Khyodee Posted May 14, 2021 Report Share Posted May 14, 2021 Hey folks, I could use some help on my Building on a Budget series of videos for S&S. The idea is to follow these guidelines: 1) Make a competitive list with some flexibility if possible 2) Limit the initial purchases to 2-3 boxes (less is better) 3) Focus on Keyword models followed by good Versatiles 4) Generally avoid non-faction models (except those in master box) and taxed models The color coding is -Green are first purchases (required or highly recommended) -Yellow are second tier purchases to really tune your list -Orange are third tier purchases that will improve your lists flexibility -Red are optional purchases if you want them (the rest of the keyword and versatile models) 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corwin Posted May 14, 2021 Report Share Posted May 14, 2021 I'm not a top tier player by any means but as for Lucius I would change familiar faces and protect and serve. I am not sure if I have ever made a list that did not have at least one changeling or the doppleganger. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Khyodee Posted May 14, 2021 Author Report Share Posted May 14, 2021 15 minutes ago, Corwin said: I'm not a top tier player by any means but as for Lucius I would change familiar faces and protect and serve. I am not sure if I have ever made a list that did not have at least one changeling or the doppleganger. Sure, but that leaves you with a really awkward 50ss list with a bunch of support models that die to a breeze. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corwin Posted May 14, 2021 Report Share Posted May 14, 2021 Yes and no, in guild I really like using Lucius as my a damage dealers with Hidden Sniper and Expert Marksman. Pump up him, Agent 46 and the Doppleganger up with Lawers and changelings and kill whatever gets within 12 inches of anything. You can Lure things in with the Doppelganger and beat them up one by one using there own attack against them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irritated Walrus Posted May 14, 2021 Report Share Posted May 14, 2021 This is hard! For a faction that has the rep for being fairly straight forward, Guild can be difficult to play compared to other factions. Hoffman for example is really good, but he's significantly better as an Arcanist. Nellie is pretty great in scheme heavy games, but is hard for a new player and can get worked in "killy" games. Lucius can be a fun choice, but does the best with some extras that break your 2 or 3 box rule. The Guild Steward is almost an auto take in most lists and that ties up one box right there. I also think Daschel is super adaptable, but requires a few more purchases than your criteria listed. I know people don't love Perdita this edition, but her crew is pretty mobile. I'm not sure what box Abuela is coming in nowadays, but having her, the family crew box and some monster hunters can be pretty good and an easy to understand first crew. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sweet Tooth Posted May 14, 2021 Report Share Posted May 14, 2021 Was wondering when you'd make it to Guild. I think Internal Investigation is a must buy, I bring Alan, an Investigator, & a FW in nearly every list with Lucius. After that it's tough since I like a single changeling, or Grimwell, or the Rider. For Lady J, I think for a new player, her core box, Six Feet Under (LM & Exorcists), and Stewie are what I'd recommend starting with. While Jury is great, she's more a tech piece and Domadores won't shine unless you're bringing the Rider/Emissary for Undead Obeys. And Recruiters stink, plain & simple. Meanwhile Lone Marshal is a near auto take for J and Stewie can help focus stack early while providing heals & roadblocks late game. Lone Marshal & Stewie are both good picks with other keywords as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Khyodee Posted May 15, 2021 Author Report Share Posted May 15, 2021 20 hours ago, Corwin said: Yes and no, in guild I really like using Lucius as my a damage dealers with Hidden Sniper and Expert Marksman. Pump up him, Agent 46 and the Doppleganger up with Lawers and changelings and kill whatever gets within 12 inches of anything. You can Lure things in with the Doppelganger and beat them up one by one using there own attack against them. Sure that works against a passive meta, but any opponent worth their salt that sees that list will have a beater model into your crew turn 1 killing before you can really counter-punch them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Khyodee Posted May 15, 2021 Author Report Share Posted May 15, 2021 19 hours ago, Sweet Tooth said: Was wondering when you'd make it to Guild. I think Internal Investigation is a must buy, I bring Alan, an Investigator, & a FW in nearly every list with Lucius. After that it's tough since I like a single changeling, or Grimwell, or the Rider. I find that version of the list is to parasitic (this models needs to do X first, before Y model can do Z sorta thing) and it needs something to hold up against a aggressive attacker. I personally like the Guardian version as it gives you lots of options and a bodyguard whose armor is unlikely to be countered since most people don't associate armor with Lucius. 19 hours ago, Sweet Tooth said: For Lady J, I think for a new player, her core box, Six Feet Under (LM & Exorcists), and Stewie are what I'd recommend starting with. While Jury is great, she's more a tech piece and Domadores won't shine unless you're bringing the Rider/Emissary for Undead Obeys. And Recruiters stink, plain & simple. Meanwhile Lone Marshal is a near auto take for J and Stewie can help focus stack early while providing heals & roadblocks late game. Lone Marshal & Stewie are both good picks with other keywords as well. I had this discussion with another guild player and the problem while the LM is clearly one of the best models in guild, you struggle to make a decent 50ss list (exorcists die to a breeze in my experience) if you buy it first. I disagree to the Recruiters as I think the model may be slightly overcosted, but its a fine model in the games I've seen it. It dissuade attacks into the Domadors since most people know they just replace. Domadors are stronger just attacking to injury and heal your frontline (or the Recruiter) at the same time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trample Posted May 16, 2021 Report Share Posted May 16, 2021 I'm with Sweet Tooth on this one I think. I like Domadors, but you've really got to have the Pale Rider along with them. I would buy the six feet under box and have a list with LJ, Scales, Lone Marshal, Judge, 2x coat probably, and 3-4 of the Death Marshals and Exorcists. The Death Marshals are really good models for 5 stones (yes, they are better with Domodors around to help them get fast) and I wouldn't mind a couple of them in a beginning crew. The Lone Marshal is just awesome though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
belorey Posted May 16, 2021 Report Share Posted May 16, 2021 I would change the order of priorities with Hoffman boxes, Basse and Nellie boxes. 1) Hoffman Core box > Support staff > Rift in the Union > Keepeing the Peace 2) Nellie Core box > Pale Rider > Guild Steward > Scooped = Lucius Core box (or get a Lawyer from a friend) 3) Basse Core box > Sand Worm > Trappers (1 box) > From Above > Pale Rider > Fool's Gold = Trappers (2nd box) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trample Posted May 16, 2021 Report Share Posted May 16, 2021 2 hours ago, belorey said: 3) Basse Core box > Sand Worm > Trappers (1 box) > From Above > Pale Rider > Fool's Gold = Trappers (2nd box) I agree with the Sand Worm and first trapper box. I rarely find room for an Austringer so wouldn't rate From Above that high. I often have a Rough Rider in my lists, so I would probably swap Fool's Gold and From Above. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
belorey Posted May 16, 2021 Report Share Posted May 16, 2021 2 hours ago, Trample said: I agree with the Sand Worm and first trapper box. I rarely find room for an Austringer so wouldn't rate From Above that high. I often have a Rough Rider in my lists, so I would probably swap Fool's Gold and From Above. I think depends of pools but 1 Austringer 1 Pathfinder are always on my list 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trample Posted May 17, 2021 Report Share Posted May 17, 2021 Probably not the best advice for those just getting into the game, but as soon as that Austera & Twigge box is out that model will take over as my Austringer. So, that box could easily replace From Above for me, since the Skybound Ally is always being discarded to prevent damage rather than summon a raptor - so I don't really need a raptor in my bag. That new model ilooks so good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
le_wahou Posted May 17, 2021 Report Share Posted May 17, 2021 The family is really an excellent for budget building. With the core box, the rider and the steward, you will have every thing you need. Latigo reserve is optionnal. I would probably buy Grimwell, undercover reporter (not available at the moment and with 3 useless models) and Lone Marshall before the reserve. Peacekeeper does not seem a good idea : Francisco with a lead lined coat can fill the spot of heavy beater. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Angelshard Posted May 17, 2021 Report Share Posted May 17, 2021 I've never understood the dislike of monster hunters. For 6 stones they're a solid, fast schemer. They can even deal decent damage if you invest a bit in it. I would definitely put family reserves as a green. Also because I'm pretty sure pistoleros are going to get an errata at some point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaston Posted May 17, 2021 Report Share Posted May 17, 2021 7 hours ago, le_wahou said: The family is really an excellent for budget building. With the core box, the rider and the steward, you will have every thing you need. Latigo reserve is optionnal. I would probably buy Grimwell, undercover reporter (not available at the moment and with 3 useless models) and Lone Marshall before the reserve. Peacekeeper does not seem a good idea : Francisco with a lead lined coat can fill the spot of heavy beater. This is literally how I started Guild. Core, Rider, Steward were all I used for a ton of games. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaston Posted May 17, 2021 Report Share Posted May 17, 2021 3 hours ago, Angelshard said: I've never understood the dislike of monster hunters. For 6 stones they're a solid, fast schemer. They can even deal decent damage if you invest a bit in it. I would definitely put family reserves as a green. Also because I'm pretty sure pistoleros are going to get an errata at some point. For me, sizable learning curve for them to not die in a single activation. They "break" the Family mold by leaving the support bubble. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
belorey Posted May 17, 2021 Report Share Posted May 17, 2021 You are not going to see Peacekeeper outside of Hoffman. Maybe with Nellie un GG1 in some pools. Guild Steward is a must i so many crews so he could be Green/Yellow box in all keywords (only Augmented don't really need him) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maniacal_cackle Posted May 18, 2021 Report Share Posted May 18, 2021 2 hours ago, Gaston said: This is literally how I started Guild. Core, Rider, Steward were all I used for a ton of games. To some degree, I Reckon a lot of the factions could just have a list of boxes that you could combine with any core box. For example in Ressers you could do something similar with eternal servitude + dead rider + any core box. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaston Posted May 18, 2021 Report Share Posted May 18, 2021 On 5/16/2021 at 10:06 AM, belorey said: I would change the order of priorities with Hoffman boxes, Basse and Nellie boxes. 1) Hoffman Core box > Support staff > Rift in the Union > Keepeing the Peace 2) Nellie Core box > Pale Rider > Guild Steward > Scooped = Lucius Core box (or get a Lawyer from a friend) 3) Basse Core box > Sand Worm > Trappers (1 box) > From Above > Pale Rider > Fool's Gold = Trappers (2nd box) I agree with this for Basse, and would even move the Trapper box up. It has the 4 clockwork traps his crew wants as part of their playstyle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Khyodee Posted May 18, 2021 Author Report Share Posted May 18, 2021 On 5/16/2021 at 9:06 AM, belorey said: I would change the order of priorities with Hoffman boxes, Basse and Nellie boxes. 1) Hoffman Core box > Support staff > Rift in the Union > Keepeing the Peace I can see flipping Support Staff with Keeping the Peace, but I do not understand everyone's love of Howard in Augmented as he is worse then the Peacekeeper in every way imo and you already have tons of healing so you don't need the Steamfitters unless you really want to drop lots of markers (and honestly they get sniped out anyways as they die easier then most in this list). On 5/16/2021 at 9:06 AM, belorey said: 2) Nellie Core box > Pale Rider > Guild Steward > Scooped = Lucius Core box (or get a Lawyer from a friend) I feel like at this point, why are you even playing Nellie? I would rather just suggest picking her up after another master if your just buying versatile and out of keywords. On 5/16/2021 at 9:06 AM, belorey said: 3) Basse Core box > Sand Worm > Trappers (1 box) > From Above > Pale Rider > Fool's Gold = Trappers (2nd box) I'm fine with putting Sand Worm before the 2nd Trapper box and dropping Keeping and Steward to red. Austringers are fine, but I there are plenty of pools you don't take them into, hence orange. As for Rough Riders, they die way to easy for their cost and just never end up being worth their cost from what I've experience with them and from what other good players have said as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thatguy Posted May 18, 2021 Report Share Posted May 18, 2021 4 minutes ago, Khyodee said: I do not understand everyone's love of Howard in Augmented as he is worse then the Peacekeeper in every way imo Vent steam is really good. I agree that if you just want stuff dead, Peacekeeper is probably a better pick. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
belorey Posted May 18, 2021 Report Share Posted May 18, 2021 12 hours ago, Khyodee said: I feel like at this point, why are you even playing Nellie? I would rather just suggest picking her up after another master if your just buying versatile and out of keywords. The only good model in Scooped box is the Undercover Reporter and it's a tech piece. And if you are trying to make a list of boxes that people play to know what they must buy fiest i'm telling you what are the most common models. You post at the beggining you were looking for competitive recomendations. I love to play Nellie, i have played with her las 2 vassal tournaments. And i know what i'm saying. If you only are going to recomend a list following keyword boxes then this topic is useless. A typical Nellie list: Size: 50 - Pool: 4 Leader: Nellie Cochrane Totem(s): The Printing Press Hires: Phiona Gage / Dr. Grimwell Undercover Reporter Field Reporter Guild Steward Pale Rider Guild Lawyer As you can see, only one model from Scooped box. If somebody ask me between buy the Rider + Steward or Scooped box i would recomend fiest those versatile models. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
belorey Posted May 18, 2021 Report Share Posted May 18, 2021 12 hours ago, Khyodee said: I can see flipping Support Staff with Keeping the Peace, but I do not understand everyone's love of Howard in Augmented as he is worse then the Peacekeeper in every way imo and you already have tons of healing so you don't need the Steamfitters unless you really want to drop lots of markers (and honestly they get sniped out anyways as they die easier then most in this list). Howard and Peacekeeper are both good models i like to play both in my games. But Howard has more movilitie and in Malifaux that's a plus. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maniacal_cackle Posted May 18, 2021 Report Share Posted May 18, 2021 From my understanding, 'core' for competitive guild is essentially lone Marshal, pale rider, guild lawyer, steward. After that you can season with whatever core box you like. Is that correct? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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