First impressions of the new Lampads.

[Maniacal_cackle]

So I took Lampads out for a spin, and here's my impressions:

• Still need a target number to get their full movement a turn, so... Still kind garbage.
  • But they're basically immortal with a GST and burning since they are so hard to kill now.
    • But immortal models don't really win games...
      • But it is exciting they at least have a defined role! Immortal minions of mediocrity.

Anyone have different experiences with them?

[muraki]

3 minutes ago, Maniacal_cackle said:

Still need a target number to get their full movement a turn, so... Still kind garbage.

How is this any different from free mv actions like leap/onward/ride?  Is it because you want drag along so you're usually also fishing for a mask?

[Maniacal_cackle]

Just now, muraki said:

How is this any different from free mv actions like leap/onward/ride?  Is it because you want drag along so you're usually also fishing for a mask?

Well, Reva is a super card-tight crew. Having an important target number disqualifies most models from my Reva crews xD

[Maniacal_cackle]

Also, compare using a 5 on a lampad to a 6 to do Ride With Me on Dead Rider.

A good model with a Target Number is fine (Dead Rider, Calypso, etc).

A bad model without a target number is fine (bone pile).

A mediocre model with a target number is not my cup of tea in this crew xD

[Morgan Vening]

22 minutes ago, Maniacal_cackle said:

Also, compare using a 5 on a lampad to a 6 to do Ride With Me on Dead Rider.

A good model with a Target Number is fine (Dead Rider, Calypso, etc).

A bad model without a target number is fine (bone pile).

A mediocre model with a target number is not my cup of tea in this crew xD

If you almost always had to cheat (high TN, or suited), maybe.

But given you succeed almost 70% of the time innately*, I can't see it's much of a card drain. You should get it most times, and when you don't, you don't have to spend it if you don't need it.
* Yeah, if you want to carry your Pyre Blankie around, it's substantially more resource intensive.

Also, if you give it Whisper, your chances of needing to waste cards are gone, and you open up the option for card draw. Though GST looks better if you're going to spend those stones on an Upgrade.

[Maniacal_cackle]

13 minutes ago, Morgan Vening said:

If you almost always had to cheat (high TN, or suited), maybe.

But given you succeed almost 70% of the time innately*, I can't see it's much of a card drain. You should get it most times, and when you don't, you don't have to spend it if you don't need it.
* Yeah, if you want to carry your Pyre Blankie around, it's substantially more resource intensive.

Also, if you give it Whisper, your chances of needing to waste cards are gone, and you open up the option for card draw. Though GST looks better if you're going to spend those stones on an Upgrade.

It is pretty close to a 1/3 chance to fail, which is quite high for my taste, but I suppose it does come down to the strength of what you're doing with the rest of the package.

Whisper may make more sense than GST, since GST could be a bit redundant. But I'd rather have an upgrade on Reva.

[Morgan Vening]

15 minutes ago, Maniacal_cackle said:

It is pretty close to a 1/3 chance to fail, which is quite high for my taste, but I suppose it does come down to the strength of what you're doing with the rest of the package.

Whisper may make more sense than GST, since GST could be a bit redundant. But I'd rather have an upgrade on Reva.

Depends on the opponent too. Opponent declares Hamelin, or any other Wp dependent crew, Stubborn (the minion only ability) probably pays itself off pretty quickly.

[Da Git]

I often took Lampads before the errata. It's interesting in that the changes made them both better but worse for one of the main reasons I took them. It's still a quite mobile model with a large toolbox, which I like. I also don't find the crew that card intensive with the mass positives I get from Reva, Bete and Toshiro if I bring him. I also generally give him GST. Like you said, it makes him super hard to take down.

I like him better as a schemer than Wanyudo as he has much more survivability with Burning Body (especially with GST, which he gets mre use from). I'll take the scheme-move-scheme option over Mv7, but no bonus move.

Worse:

• less efficient burning batteries as they now use it for themselves

Better:

• finally a stat 6 attack! (even better with Toshiro!) and built in ram, so Flame Wall has 1 less hoop to jump through (though still hard to get off with needing 3+ burning before the attack)
• Even better at sharing the burning with more pyre shenanigans and better stat on attack and hovering flame (previously needed a 6)
• better at moving pyres with a mask (probably not something you can count on as lots of models use low-mid masks, might might be crutch)
• much better resilience with Flaming body (& GST lessons this need as well)

Note, he still basically comes back with the same amount of health from his demise ability (except from irreducible), since he'll get one burning from placing in the Pyre before removing it.

[Maniacal_cackle]

9 minutes ago, Da Git said:

I often took Lampads before the errata. It's interesting in that the changes made them both better but worse for one of the main reasons I took them. It's still a quite mobile model with a large toolbox, which I like. I also don't find the crew that card intensive with the mass positives I get from Reva, Bete and Toshiro if I bring him. I also generally give him GST. Like you said, it makes him super hard to take down.

I like him better as a schemer than Wanyudo as he has much more survivability with Burning Body (especially with GST, which he gets mre use from). I'll take the scheme-move-scheme option over Mv7, but no bonus move.

Worse:

• less efficient burning batteries as they now use it for themselves

Better:

• finally a stat 6 attack! (even better with Toshiro!) and built in ram, so Flame Wall has 1 less hoop to jump through (though still hard to get off with needing 3+ burning before the attack)
• Even better at sharing the burning with more pyre shenanigans and better stat on attack and hovering flame (previously needed a 6)
• better at moving pyres with a mask (probably not something you can count on as lots of models use low-mid masks, might might be crutch)
• much better resilience with Flaming body (& GST lessons this need as well)

Note, he still basically comes back with the same amount of health from his demise ability (except from irreducible), since he'll get one burning from placing in the Pyre before removing it.

Good to hear that they still work for some builds!

[ShinChan]

Five games using 1 or 2 of them, with and without GST, summary: I'm not sold on them.

I'm gonna list some reasons:

• They're squishy as fuck, even with GST (that puts them at the price of a Mature Nephilim). Df 4 means that even the smallest of the Gremlins is going to hit you, and they don't gain that much burning if you actually want them to do something else. They also lost 1 Wound and The final Veil. Flaming body is great, don't get me wrong, but not that much when you still have Df4 and Wp5 and someone can remove all that burning with a single attack (or a tactical action that you cannot resist, yes I'm looking at you Shenlong!).
• The Demise is nice, but you have to spend 2 resources a Pyre Marker and a card (which Reva doesn't draw in any way). I understand that the card is mandatory (so you can not trigger demise multiple times and go around the board or stay in the same place jumping from one pyre to the next one). Also, having to jump to a pyre marker can be both, beneficial or a detriment to use the demise (maybe you'll end up blocking other models, maybe you'll be in another quadrant for Turf War or maybe you can't even see the Pyre Marker and you die.
• Their damage track is still quite "meh" for a 8ss model. I don't think that a 2/3/5 would have been overpowered.
• The "Flame Wall" trigger is a "create" and not a "drop", so you cannot place it touching the enemy you're attacking.

 

Just compare a Lampad to a Student of Viscera. The Viscera ties him or wins at all categories:

• Mobility: Ambush is more reliable, they have Rush and Unimpeded. Viscera Wins.
• Damage output: Better Damage track, slightly better triggers. Viscera Wins.
• Tankiness: 9 Wounds, Armor and HtW. Viscera Wins.
• Utility: Situational Card, situational healing and pushing the enemies, hands out Stunned and prevents enemies from disengaging. I would say that Viscera wins, but since Lampads provide some targeted utility to Reva with the Pyre Markers and giving out burning, we could consider it a tie.