Jump to content

Bayou bash, Jockeys


Thatguy
 Share

Recommended Posts

14 hours ago, Jesy Blue said:

It's kind of sad that Big Hat, Infamous, Kin, & Tri-Chi did't get new models

I could have sworn I saw a mini of a gremlin on a lazyboy attached to an alligator. More jockey stuff in the future isn't out of the question.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Thatguy said:

I could have sworn I saw a mini of a gremlin on a lazyboy attached to an alligator. More jockey stuff in the future isn't out of the question.

Yeah, there's that and also a Gremlin riding a Whiskey Gamin type contraption. And I seem to recall one riding a Silurid as well? My guess is that Gencon 2022 will see a new Master for each faction and the Gator rider will be the next Gremlin Master (and Jockey keyword, naturally).

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Thatguy said:

I could have sworn I saw a mini of a gremlin on a lazyboy attached to an alligator. More jockey stuff in the future isn't out of the question.

That's for the board game as far as we know so far.... but any thing is possible.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

22 minutes ago, Jesy Blue said:

That's for the board game as far as we know so far.... but any thing is possible.

Wyrd have said it wasn't for bayou bash, but that seems to get ignored quite often. ( although it could be a 5-6 player expansion). 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Wyrd.thumb.jpg.4203bdf473b20d93a952a092bddcea68.jpg

 

 

For some reason I've been calling him Roy for like 2 years... hopefully he'll be either the Infamous contingent of the Jockey keyword or the Jockey Master.

What about the family on the Silarid?

nXr05vdLB8R0APKv3LmmCJUAv9CoFbrx1UAw_KPFBv4.thumb.jpg.34695ca8388034b67b7ed81bde2a60bd.jpg

  • Like 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

6 hours ago, SEV said:

Why not? That could be a nice design opportunity imo.

I do not like the preassembled models at all. Personally think its a bad call and I hope Wyrd doesn't continue with the trend.

In M2E each Master was defined by their limited upgrades and with few (no?) exceptions there was one option that was always better. I fear that the Titles system will have the same result, and I just don't like the notion of Ulix (or any Bayou Master) being the Jockey Master.

The Jockey models are all over the place in terms of appearance and I don't think they make a visually appealing crew.

Now....I recognize those are my opinions. And I think you're right that the design opportunity is interesting, but I'd rather see them start with a fresh Master.

  • Agree 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I have decided the crew to play after the starter box release

 

Size: 50 - Pool: 4
Leader:
  Bo Peep
Totem(s):
  Lucky Effigy
    Effigy of Fate
Hires:
  Fluffernutter
  Ruffles
  Stumpy
  War Pig
  Iron Skeeter
  Rooster Rider

  • Like 1
  • Haha 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Ah, I see... everyone's mounted, nice. (Well, the Effigy will be once it's turn 3)

Pretty fast crew to say the least.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 5/23/2021 at 3:08 PM, the tick said:

I do not like the preassembled models at all. Personally think its a bad call and I hope Wyrd doesn't continue with the trend.

In M2E each Master was defined by their limited upgrades and with few (no?) exceptions there was one option that was always better. I fear that the Titles system will have the same result, and I just don't like the notion of Ulix (or any Bayou Master) being the Jockey Master.

The Jockey models are all over the place in terms of appearance and I don't think they make a visually appealing crew.

Now....I recognize those are my opinions. And I think you're right that the design opportunity is interesting, but I'd rather see them start with a fresh Master.

The upshot to the title system over the old upgrade system is it can make MUCH larger changes than the old upgrade system ever could, so balancing the two is easier.  Case in point, the new Kirai is pretty substantially different as a summoner compared to her older iteration.  That wouldn't have been possible in the old upgrade system without every upgrade coming with a big line of text about "ignore whatever ability"

 

It will be on Wyrd to make it actually happen, but for now I'll remain cautiously optimistic.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

One area where I hope titles will shine is making crews more viable into their hard counters.

For instance if you don't declare a marker crew into Ressers because of Molly, maybe there is a non-marker version of the master that allows flexibility if you get the bad pairing.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Yeah. I'm also hoping it smooths or bad match ups and pools. I've heard people complain that Malifaux is pay to win, since the player with more crews to pick from has better options for each pool than a player who only has one crew.  I think titles that offer multiple play styles will help close that gap. 

  • Haha 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

17 hours ago, Thatguy said:

Yeah. I'm also hoping it smooths or bad match ups and pools. I've heard people complain that Malifaux is pay to win, since the player with more crews to pick from has better options for each pool than a player who only has one crew.  I think titles that offer multiple play styles will help close that gap. 

I don't want to bring this off topic, but what miniature game is that not true for?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

18 hours ago, Thatguy said:

Yeah. I'm also hoping it smooths or bad match ups and pools. I've heard people complain that Malifaux is pay to win, since the player with more crews to pick from has better options for each pool than a player who only has one crew.  I think titles that offer multiple play styles will help close that gap. 

I have found that whilst there is a little truth to this, it doesn't hold that true after a certain amount. So yes if I have 2 crews and you only have 1, I will probably do better than you overall, but 2-3 crews with sensible tech options is probably the point where it stops being true. So you may need to spend $200-300 dollars to feel strongly competitive, but if you do that sensibly, then you can be as competitive as someone that has spent $10,000.

(This is in part based on the knowledge and experience required to get the best out of your crew. If you use a smaller section of models you are more likely to know them better, and get better results with them, even when they aren't the "best" choice)

  • Agree 4
Link to comment
Share on other sites

18 hours ago, Thatguy said:

Yeah. I'm also hoping it smooths or bad match ups and pools. I've heard people complain that Malifaux is pay to win, since the player with more crews to pick from has better options for each pool than a player who only has one crew.  I think titles that offer multiple play styles will help close that gap. 

I tried playing multiple crews and it turns out I am way more competitive just focusing on one. It is hard to master a crew (I'm still learning things ~150 games in).

That said, I think I've used more than 20 different models with Molly in the world series, so there is an element of 'buy half the faction to win.'

That said, at everything but the very top of competitive play, I feel like I can win most games using only 3 boxes.

  • Agree 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

4 hours ago, wizuriel said:

I don't want to bring this off topic, but what miniature game is that not true for?

Maybe campaign based games like Mordhiem, Bloodbowl and Frostgrave.

Not that I'd b call those balanced, but there isn't much advantage, mechanically, to buying more models once you have your crew.

  • Agree 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

4 hours ago, Adran said:

have found that whilst there is a little truth to this, it doesn't hold that true after a certain amount. So yes if I have 2 crews and you only have 1, I will probably do better than you overall, but 2-3 crews with sensible tech options is probably the point where it stops being true.

Yeah. I get where they're coming from. I personally don't consider Malifaux to be an expensive hobby. I think the $200-300 point is definitely where you start to see diminishing returns. Not just because more crews add less variance to your play styles but because with so many moving parts it's hard to master more than a handful of crews without forgetting important interactions and abilities.

But to the guy who just bought his first box or two, telling them they need another $250 invested to be competitive can be disheartening.

Some people like a challenge though. My first game in Malifaux was Ophelia and gremlins against Hamlin, back in first Ed when he couldn't be targeted by height 1 models. My opponent chose Hamlin knowing I only had the one crew, lol. I'm still playing a decade later.

 

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

16 minutes ago, Thatguy said:

Some people like a challenge though. My first game in Malifaux was Ophelia and gremlins against Hamlin, back in first Ed when he couldn't be targeted by height 1 models. My opponent chose Hamlin knowing I only had the one crew, lol. I'm still playing a decade later.

Haha! Was that a competitive game? If it wasn't, what a jerk! 

I don't think we have hard counter like that in M3 though...

I agree that, if you want to be competitive you're better to learn really well 1 generic master or 2 masters with opposed playstyle. Than learn the most powerful ook versatile options. But even if you don't have access to the super niche tech for a specific matchup and you bring only the second or even 3rd best option, I think you will have a massive advantage by knowing your crew well...

Where I agree with you : titles will help with that. And this is awesome.

I mean, most of my Malifaux buy are not to be most competitive but because I like the figs or, mostly, because I want to try something new.

I do the same in tournament (switching masters and factions), and I'm pretty sure it's not the best idea (but definitely the most fun)!

 

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I think all of the Jockeys are situational, and no one is really a great add.

  • Fluffernutter has a great synergy with Wizz-Bang and has nice triggers, but he's a 5/4 with no defensive tech.
  • Stumpy looks like a great model actually, but I'm not sure how much room it will have in its Keyword. I can see it played with Zoraida in Neverborn, to help the Emissary, but that's mostly it. Watch out for the play of tossing someone in the mud after putting the aura of severe terrain up, it could put a bunch of staggered for the Emissary to blast people after.
  • Ruffles has no room for me in a Tricksy list. It's worse than a Rooster Rider (and they're not great) and worse than a Bushwhacker. Someone would argue that pushing people into pit traps and blah, blah, blah. But after the nerf to Sparks, the setup to get 1 damage and +1 injured it's just not worth it. Also, it's another model that doesn't ignore pit traps if you're trying to follow that path. He also dies to a stiff breeze, so he's wasted stones when you could have a Bushwhacker for the same price or even a Survivor for 1ss less.
  • Bo Peep: She's a decent model, interesting new abilities, being able to get out of engagement and still have 2 actions to go run a scheme and a very interesting aura for both Ulix and Mah (let's remember that Tricksy doesn't have any healing and they usually hurt themselves). She's also the henchwoman, which means she's going to be a bit more resilient than the other 3 (very important for models that are df5/wp4). Her damage track is terrible, but she has 2":ToS-Melee: and her mask trigger is great.
  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

6 hours ago, Thatguy said:

Yeah. I get where they're coming from. I personally don't consider Malifaux to be an expensive hobby. I think the $200-300 point is definitely where you start to see diminishing returns. Not just because more crews add less variance to your play styles but because with so many moving parts it's hard to master more than a handful of crews without forgetting important interactions and abilities.

But to the guy who just bought his first box or two, telling them they need another $250 invested to be competitive can be disheartening.

Some people like a challenge though. My first game in Malifaux was Ophelia and gremlins against Hamlin, back in first Ed when he couldn't be targeted by height 1 models. My opponent chose Hamlin knowing I only had the one crew, lol. I'm still playing a decade later.

To some degree I don't think titles will fix this, partially because I think this problem is an illusion.

Yes, for equally matched opponents it is an issue. But there is so much space for skill to dominate in Malifaux, I rarely see it in action (except in the World Series where there are just top calibre players from around the world).

But in the NZ meta, even when all I had was 3-4 boxes (Molly + The Lost + Dead Rider + Eternal Servitude essentially), I was getting top tables in tournaments (or winning all the local ones). Once you have ~100 soulstones of models to round out your crew, you can beat almost anything with a flexible crew.

So there's budget options I reckon.

Although maybe not for facing Explorer's Society. For that, I reckon you need quite a bit of tech since they are tuned pretty high xD

EDIT: To put it it another way, I'm not sure I've ever lost a game where the issue was lack of access to models. There was always something I did that lost the game (or on very rare occasion, bad luck xD)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

4 hours ago, ShinChan said:

I think all of the Jockeys are situational, and no one is really a great add.

This was pretty much my thought. Even with versatile, I don't see them getting much play outside of in their respective non-jockey keywords.

2 hours ago, Maniacal_cackle said:

Once you have ~100 soulstones of models to round out your crew, you can beat almost anything with a flexible crew.

I think it's kind of hard to parse which is more influential. Are people with ~100 ss worth of models beating the guys with ~50 ss because they have a bigger pool of models or because they've got another dozen games worth of experience in time while they built up thier crew? Probably both. But it's hard to say which one contributes more.

Also new players don't have the experience to build or select a flexible crew. Molly might do great with a few boxes, but a new Lady J player might discover they have more than a hundred dollars of keyword models and still need to spend more on OoK models to be competitive. 

All of which isn't too say that I think of Malifaux as pay to win, but I do think titles giving more play styles to players with few models will help smooth out the curve of cash investment to competitive viability.

8 hours ago, SEV said:

Haha! Was that a competitive game? If it wasn't, what a jerk! 

I thought it was a friendly pick up game. I was mistaken. 😂 

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Well, I remember feeling the lack of healing on my collection when playing Ophelia on M2E, when everyone had dumb luck and I only had her base crew. Adding just the slop haulers and Lenny really made me a major threat at my club. In Argentina we never had a  competitive community, so when a friend came from Chile with the first Sandeep we ever saw, it demolished every single other player at our friendly tournament.

Back on the jockeys, they seem nice, I do not see any of those as a "must have" for any of my crews, but probably will be grabbing them as they are really pretty. Maybe some can be used as flankers for some schemes, but I doubt many will be having place in competitive matches. For Henchman Hardcore games I will need to think a bit more, I really like to play with Francois' Kin, and I am painting my Tri-Chi models so...

Would love to see at some point the alligator and sillurid too, but the more time passes, the more I think I need a Gremlin Conquistador and/or cavalliers.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

 Share

×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information