1st Dreamer crew?

[Warharan]

1 hour ago, extremor said:

I like to play lucid dream heavy and use 5-7x lucid dreams every turn. 

How many lucid dreamers do you 'field' initially?
Chompy, 2 daydreams and 2 stitched at a guess? (perhaps 1 stitched and a madness?)

All this before summoning of course.

[extremor]

A list I like a lot, even though it's a little slow:

New The Dreamer Crew (Neverborn)
Size: 50 - Pool: 6
Leader:
  The Dreamer
Totem(s):
  Lord Chompy Bits
Hires:
  Teddy
  Widow Weaver
  Insidious Madness
  Daydream
    Ancient Pact
  Daydream 2
    Ancient Pact
  Daydream 3
  Wicked Doll 
  Wicked Doll 2

 

I'll be using turn 1 to power up dolls to stiched and Lucid dream a lot. This isn't a list you may bring into all strats&schemes. It focusses on building up a force and a deck to get the upper hand. 

[Maniacal_cackle]

I usually start with a pretty powerful list, which means I only have 3-4 lucid dreams. The upside is that you're pretty powerful from turn 1. The downside is I usually only had half the weaks out of the deck by turn 3.

[SEV]

I also prefer the kind of elite dreamer list. Beside the mandatory 2 daydream with AP (they really are awesome), I usually mix and match strong models. 1-2 stitches are great to start with (especially in wedge and flank because they're kind of slow).

Even with that kind of list, your deck will be quite strong on t4-5 (you will have from 9 to 15 lucid dreams before t4). 

Also, and I'm probably the minority here, I prefer to summon alp instead of stitch for both Recover and Public. I think the damage output is better (free ping + attack before your opponent can do anything about it) even though stitches are undeniably way stronger (and as I said I like to start with one). Try to keep an other model buried if possible (a 12 give you have a daydream and a Alp, it will have a + to its fee attack) Finally, natural musk is often overlooked but it's can be really good in the right spot.

 

Well I guess I'm in Alp team (only for summon of course).

[Maniacal_cackle]

8 minutes ago, SEV said:

I also prefer the kind of elite dreamer list. Beside the mandatory 2 daydream with AP (they really are awesome), I usually mix and match strong models. 1-2 stitches are great to start with (especially in wedge and flank because they're kind of slow).

Even with that kind of list, your deck will be quite strong on t4-5 (you will have from 9 to 15 lucid dreams before t4). 

Also, and I'm probably the minority here, I prefer to summon alp instead of stitch for both Recover and Public. I think the damage output is better (free ping + attack before your opponent can do anything about it) even though stitches are undeniably way stronger (and as I said I like to start with one). Try to keep an other model buried if possible (a 12 give you have a daydream and a Alp, it will have a + to its fee attack) Finally, natural musk is often overlooked but it's can be really good in the right spot.

 

Well I guess I'm in Alp team (only for summon of course).

I think Alps are pretty fantastic, and notably only need a 9 instead of a 10. Or if you have a 12, you can summon an alp + daydream. So they're definitely pretty high on my summon list.

[extremor]

7 hours ago, SEV said:

 

Well I guess I'm in Alp team (only for summon of course).

Well then I‘m Team madness (hire and summon) 😅 the insidious madness are my favorite minion for being faster (mv6& incorporeal), tougher (incorporeal &7lp), having scatter (really mean) and attack WP.  I primarily summon them and let them unbury next to several enemy models to bind them - works well slowing the game for my opponent. 🥰

[Maniacal_cackle]

I think the problem with Stitched is that they just bring a bunch of damage to the table.

The other three minions all offer some form of utility. The crew already does insane damage; you don't necessarily need more.

So I'm also a fan of alps and insidious. That said, Stitched are my 'default' summon that I grab if I don't have any other particular need, and they do have utility in grabbing bag severes from Lucid Dreaming if you are forced to do it.

[Regelridderen]

When it comes to summoning, I’ll summon the best thing, my cards allow for, Alp, Stitched or Madness with incidental Daydreams. 

But I’ll hire Madness over Stitched for their speed and durability. Once a Madness hits the opposition and an Alp pops out of nowhere. You’ll have a hard time losing that fight. 

I’ll rarely have more than one Stitched on the board, as they ruin the deck thinning. 

[Warharan]

2 hours ago, Regelridderen said:

I’ll rarely have more than one Stitched on the board, as they ruin the deck thinning. 

How do you mean? It is optional to use "fiendish gamble" or do you mean something else?
(and I am missing your point completely)

[Hawkoon]

Can't see it mentioned elsewhere so just adding a point to the conversation.

Starting with a madness on the table adds more opportunities for the opponent failing a wp duel due to terrifying and spectral bite resisted by wp, and thus more options for unburying summons. It shouldn't be hard unburying summons, but more duels means better chances at getting the summons when and where you need them.

[Warharan]

21 hours ago, extremor said:

<snipped actual list to get to the point>

 

I'll be using turn 1 to power up dolls to stiched and Lucid dream a lot. This isn't a list you may bring into all strats&schemes. It focusses on building up a force and a deck to get the upper hand. 

How does this work? Do you kill you own wicked dolls? (thus creating a scrap marker)

[extremor]

35 minutes ago, Warharan said:

How does this work? Do you kill you own wicked dolls? (thus creating a scrap marker)

Teddy kills one doll by using his free action and one by charging...

[LexLock]

9 hours ago, Regelridderen said:

When it comes to summoning, I’ll summon the best thing, my cards allow for, Alp, Stitched or Madness with incidental Daydreams. 

But I’ll hire Madness over Stitched for their speed and durability. Once a Madness hits the opposition and an Alp pops out of nowhere. You’ll have a hard time losing that fight. 

I’ll rarely have more than one Stitched on the board, as they ruin the deck thinning. 

I think you'll find that deck thinning ruins the Stitched. Who cares that you can get a slightly higher average card on turn 4/5, if you Lucid Dream out face cards wherever possible and then use them with your stitched they become disgusting.

Playing with an extra hand made entirely of high cards is way better than slightly improving your deck for the turns where you (as a summoner) should be strongest anyway.

[Maniacal_cackle]

3 hours ago, LexLock said:

I think you'll find that deck thinning ruins the Stitched. Who cares that you can get a slightly higher average card on turn 4/5, if you Lucid Dream out face cards wherever possible and then use them with your stitched they become disgusting.

Playing with an extra hand made entirely of high cards is way better than slightly improving your deck for the turns where you (as a summoner) should be strongest anyway.

Interesting points!

I don't think you lucid dream to get slightly higher average card flips, though.

You do it to get weaks out of your deck for damage flips. Once you have no (or few) weaks, your models are hitting extremely hard, and it takes relatively low investment to get there.

Additionally, if you're shedding every severe card you see, you may have them out of the deck at the start of the turn, reducing the number of severes you draw or flip that turn. While the Stitched are more reliable, I like having those severes around for my better models.

So I don't think it is a matter of always severe or always weak.

[Maniacal_cackle]

On the other hand, removing moderates can be a major downside, especially initially.

There is a big difference between 5/8/13 and 6/8/11. In the first one I take the 5. In the second one I strongly consider the 11.

[SEV]

19 hours ago, Maniacal_cackle said:

On the other hand, removing moderates can be a major downside, especially initially.

There is a big difference between 5/8/13 and 6/8/11. In the first one I take the 5. In the second one I strongly consider the 11.

Yep If I have a stitch I always take the 11 in that example. I'll also strongly consider the 13. An extra 13 in hand is stronger imo than removing a weak from the deck.

[Warharan]

Today I got a 2nd hand lot including the following:

Teddy
Tuco
Doppleganger

3 changelings

At a guess the changelings are not worth their cost (4+1) and Teddy is a must-have.

Even a newb like me can tell this is an awesome model. (and talking stats and sculpt both btw)

How about the others?
When (if ever) is Tuco worth it in a Dreamer crew? And the Doppleganger?

 

[SEV]

2 hours ago, Warharan said:

When (if ever) is Tuco worth it in a Dreamer crew? And the Doppleganger?

 

Yep Teddy is great and you should definitely have him in to your Dreamer arsenal, but that doesn't mean it's an auto-include (he can be clumsy and card hungry). 

I never used Tuco and honestly I don't think I'll ever do. It seems such a weak model. His stat line is horrible and he doesn't seem to do much. Pseudo lure as a bonus can be nice, but 6" range pretty much negate his effectiveness. To hire him I think really need badly to deploy from the shadow (can't think of a scenario in that GG) and probably need his anti-shocwave or benefits heavily from the blast on his shotgun... That seems pretty niche to me. 

On the other hand Doppleganger is a nice tool to have. I usually use her for don't mind me (that can help in recover or in sybol against a crew with a lot of 2" engagement range). The stat 6 lure is a good way to have your summons popped in the righ spot. She's also have plenty of food attack action to copy. Scatter, draw essence and whisper truth are great tactical action to have access to when you hire her. Finally I never used the double master combo Dreamer/Zoraida but she's probably great in that crew. More card draw and more utility from mimic.

[Roadhouse]

4 hours ago, Warharan said:

Today I got a 2nd hand lot including the following:

Teddy
Tuco
Doppleganger

3 changelings

At a guess the changelings are not worth their cost (4+1) and Teddy is a must-have.

Even a newb like me can tell this is an awesome model. (and talking stats and sculpt both btw)

How about the others?
When (if ever) is Tuco worth it in a Dreamer crew? And the Doppleganger?

 

Changelings are super niche, even with Lucius, and I wouldn't take them with Dreamer. I've tried Tuco a couple times but still haven't found where I want him, Dreamer probably isn't it though. Teddy is awesome, Serena following him around makes him very difficult to remove. Unless you really want Breath Fire from Carver, Teddy is just so much better IMO.
I think Doppelganger has potential with Dreamer as a Stat 7 Lure, she can Mimic her own action, giving you a very reliable way to get a summon out from 12" (everything else in Keyword is Rng 8). Further you're always bringing Chompy and who doesn't like Stat 7 3/4/6 or Stat 7 Twist Reality. Another synergy is that Doppel and Serena both have Disguised so you can set up AP inefficient roadblocks. There is alot to like there.

[Regelridderen]

Tuco can throw a spanner in your opponents wheel by unburying a summon T1 in your opponents deployment zone.

His Disillusionment might be short ranged, but unlike a Lure you control the movement - and with position based Strats and Schemes that can be quite advantageous. 

He can definitely find a space in a Dreamer crew. Not for every match-up, but for some. - and his Good for a laugh -trigger is a good use of Tomes. 

[Warharan]

While still in the process painting this Dreamer crew I am eyeing what other options there are in NB.
Is there a master within NB you'd recommend after this one?
(Pandora seems good given the overlap in models. But does she fill 'gaps' in gameplay a Dreamer crew cannot offer?)

Which one(s) and why?

So I can be on the lookout on the 2nd hand market for example.

[Regelridderen]

1 hour ago, Warharan said:

While still in the process painting this Dreamer crew I am eyeing what other options there are in NB.
Is there a master within NB you'd recommend after this one?
(Pandora seems good given the overlap in models. But does she fill 'gaps' in gameplay a Dreamer crew cannot offer?)

Which one(s) and why?

So I can be on the lookout on the 2nd hand market for example.

Pandora is a hoot to play. What she excels in is denial of actions and positioning - Candy and Kade work great with Dreamer, while ‘Dora likes Coppelius and Serena. The two are my favorite masters in the game. 

[Maniacal_cackle]

If you're looking to be competitive, Zoraida is pretty much a must.

Otherwise I feel like Dreamer/Pandora has a pretty decent spread of coverage, but haven't played them in GG1.

[Warharan]

58 minutes ago, Regelridderen said:

Pandora is a hoot to play. What she excels in is denial of actions and positioning - Candy and Kade work great with Dreamer, while ‘Dora likes Coppelius and Serena. The two are my favorite masters in the game. 

High praise!

Is a Pandora core set enough for starters?
Bearing (Yes; me b punny!) in mind I have Teddy, Carver, Tuco and a doppleganger?
Or are the other 'woe' boxes a must?

 

[Warharan]

45 minutes ago, Maniacal_cackle said:

If you're looking to be competitive, Zoraida is pretty much a must.

Otherwise I feel like Dreamer/Pandora has a pretty decent spread of coverage, but haven't played them in GG1.

Competitive is not my goal at all.
But good to know she's an option that works too!