New war pig models

[Edek]

He can be Sz4 with his bonus action Sz5 with the upgrade. This model is really disappointing, that's true.

[Scoffer]

53 minutes ago, the tick said:

WTH? Isn't he Height 3? I know games are about abstraction but that has to be an error. Scaling was occasionally funky in 2E but this seems worse now. Are other factions having this issue or is Bayou just getting hosed here?

We also have guys that lost some hight (Ulix) or grew a little (Swinecursed) between editions without being resculpted. So I think we shouldn't even try to compare actual size of different models with the same SZ stat.

I should also say, that I do like Alphonse model. He looks like a nice open-minded guy, big and kind. He's very like Francois - his simple pose tells a lot about his mood and character. I think he is trying to say: "Hi, there, friend! I'm going to hit you very hard with this hand and smash you into the wall after that! Have a nice day!"

[Math Mathonwy]

I'm not a huge fan of Alphonse sculpts but it would be immensely better if he was properly big and not "somewhat tall human" size. He looks very lackluster on his 50mm base.

[ShinChan]

I'm fine with Alphonse design, but the size is ridiculously small.

[the tick]

And how much does it cost to have one of those molds tooled these days? Could we like...I dunno...start a GoFundMe page or something to have these things redone to be the correct size?

[Rufess]

48 minutes ago, the tick said:

And how much does it cost to have one of those molds tooled these days? Could we like...I dunno...start a GoFundMe page or something to have these things redone to be the correct size?

If we had access to the 3D model, then it would cost less than a minute to adjust the size, then 3D print it out. But since we don't, we then have to 3D scan and re-print it on a proper scale. The scanner and printer would each cost few hundreds to a thousand or two. So it is doable base on how many players would fund for it.

However considering the IP right, I do not think Wyrd would allow this happen. An alternate way is, like the 3rd party Warhammer models, to have someone to create a model of a typical Goblin(without a big nose) riding on a typical pig and use as proxy model for War Pigs. It is somehow on the grey zone and of course illegal in any tournament, but it is the only realistic and affordable way I could think of to do it.

Edited November 20, 2020 by Rufess

[SEV]

1 hour ago, the tick said:

And how much does it cost to have one of those molds tooled these days? Could we like...I dunno...start a GoFundMe page or something to have these things redone to be the correct 

 And why not Just put pressure on Wyrd to adjust their next print run? I mean, this is on them and they probably know that something went run with production (I know they're a small company, but they still should have some sort of quality control before going into mass production)...

As a new player and a Bayou player, I know that will deter me to buy the Soey keyword. 

[the tick]

1 hour ago, SEV said:

 And why not Just put pressure on Wyrd to adjust their next print run? I mean, this is on them and they probably know that something went run with production (I know they're a small company, but they still should have some sort of quality control before going into mass production)...

As a new player and a Bayou player, I know that will deter me to buy the Soey keyword. 

CNC cutting the molds for plastic injection molding is stupid expensive and I think requires pretty long lead times with the shops that actually do the tooling. This isn't to excuse the errors....but I don't think Wyrd is large enough to afford several several thousands of dollars in additional mold cutting.

But yeah. These issues definitely have me turned off buying more of my favorite master's keyword.

@RufessWhat about commissioning an artist to concept and 3d sculpt an aggressive looking pig (that doesn't infringe on IP). Then printing that model and putting the Rooster Rider Gremlin's on top of an appropriately scaled 3d print? Hell I think I just talked myself into that plan. Edit: so some initial searching suggests it'll cost maybe a couple hundred bucks to have an artist prepare a concept and then have a 3d sculptor design the model.

[muraki]

I think ya'll guys are overreacting a bit here.  Warpigs are already one of the easier sculpts to get alts of (war rabbit, sparkle steeds, war rooster) in addition to the OG warpig.  You can also easily proxy in a somer avatar (if your meta is ok with proxing that is).  Sparkle steeds and rabbits turn up semi frequently on wyrd sales too, so it shouldn't be hard to find 2-3 sculpts you enjoy for the keyword.

I'll be honest, I have so many alt models I had no interest in picking up this box, but with all the discussion I may grab a set if my local does a small business sale on faux, cause the cute tiny pig fits better with my nightmare / silly pig set.  Also as a friend said, the smaller size mades it a better candidate for fun basing ideas.

If wyrd wants to change the next set of sculpts it's their call.  Tiny pigs riders may be the new amazon vik haha.

[the tick]

10 hours ago, muraki said:

I think ya'll guys are overreacting a bit here.  Warpigs are already one of the easier sculpts to get alts of (war rabbit, sparkle steeds, war rooster) in addition to the OG warpig.  You can also easily proxy in a somer avatar (if your meta is ok with proxing that is).  Sparkle steeds and rabbits turn up semi frequently on wyrd sales too, so it shouldn't be hard to find 2-3 sculpts you enjoy for the keyword.

I'll be honest, I have so many alt models I had no interest in picking up this box, but with all the discussion I may grab a set if my local does a small business sale on faux, cause the cute tiny pig fits better with my nightmare / silly pig set.  Also as a friend said, the smaller size mades it a better candidate for fun basing ideas.

If wyrd wants to change the next set of sculpts it's their call.  Tiny pigs riders may be the new amazon vik haha.

Admittedly these are opinions in regards to the appearance of the models, but I don't think its over-reacting. If you want to stick with pigs, rather than other barnyard animals, then you choices are very limited. And because the scaling issues are so irritating to me personally, I'd rather not use them. The War Rabbit is the only alternative that matches the same-ish general size as the "original" plastic War Pig. The  Sparkle Steed has the same scaling issues we've already identified, and based on the picture I've seen I'm not confident that the attachment points for the base are adequate for a metal model. I'm not a fan of the War Rooster sculpt, and at that point why not just use Rooster Riders?

[OracleToronto]

On 11/19/2020 at 10:21 PM, muraki said:

I think ya'll guys are overreacting a bit here.  Warpigs are already one of the easier sculpts to get alts of (war rabbit, sparkle steeds, war rooster) in addition to the OG warpig. 

I never knew the War Rooster existed ... and I wish I still didn't that little gem will be haunting my dreams tonight!

[Ja9nge]

If someone want to go for proxy models, I expect that the future Bayou Bash game, and the faction starter sets that were announced at Gencon, will provide some nice alternatives. 

 

[the tick]

2 hours ago, Ja9nge said:

If someone want to go for proxy models, I expect that the future Bayou Bash game, and the faction starter sets that were announced at Gencon, will provide some nice alternatives. 

 

With luck you're right that Bayou Bash might have some suitable proxies. It's worth being hopeful at least. I'm still pursuing a custom option though.

[GrumpyGrandpa]

13 hours ago, the tick said:

With luck you're right that Bayou Bash might have some suitable proxies. It's worth being hopeful at least. I'm still pursuing a custom option though.

My local tournament scene doesn't allow proxies with other Malifaux models, so I'll be stuck with the War Piglets  Tried finding an alternative, but nothing seems to fit the theme.

[MrPieChee]

1 hour ago, GrumpyGrandpa said:

My local tournament scene doesn't allow proxies with other Malifaux models, so I'll be stuck with the War Piglets  Tried finding an alternative, but nothing seems to fit the theme.

They may well get official cards for war pigs, so it'll be just like the war rabbit.

[DuBlanck]

On 11/20/2020 at 2:15 AM, the tick said:

CNC cutting the molds for plastic injection molding is stupid expensive and I think requires pretty long lead times with the shops that actually do the tooling.

Makes it all the more baffling that these errors were allowed through - do Wyrd not double-check the actual models that are being referenced when cutting the die? After ponygate, why is "make sure the model is actually the right size" not a step in the production cycle?

Size being "just a stat" is fine and all, but it is genuinely inconvenient to have to remember the this physically-small model is actually rules-big, or these two differently-sized models are actually the same size. Unless Wyrd habitually pack their dies so tight that models literally cannot be bigger, I don;t understand why this keeps happening.

@muraki I think the problem is that they are advertised as large models, but are in fact small models, and also it somewhat spoils the aesthetics of any crew if the big beefy enforcers are neither big nor beefy or indeed any more imposing than the standard-issue grunts (ahah).

[Math Mathonwy]

41 minutes ago, DuBlanck said:

After ponygate, why is "make sure the model is actually the right size" not a step in the production cycle?

Ponygate? Wyrd has been having issues with their scaling ever since they switched to plastic. Ramos' totem is too big for its base, Young Lacroix are the biggest Gremlins around, the differences between two of the Rooster Riders are downright comical, the female multipart TtB minis are enormous amazons, half of the kneeling models are gigantic compared to their non-kneeling counterparts, and so on and so forth.

[Maniacal_cackle]

18 hours ago, DuBlanck said:

Size being "just a stat" is fine and all, but it is genuinely inconvenient to have to remember the this physically-small model is actually rules-big, or these two differently-sized models are actually the same size. Unless Wyrd habitually pack their dies so tight that models literally cannot be bigger, I don;t understand why this keeps happening.

I think this hits the nail on the head for me.

If someone wants to play with just markers, that's fine by me, but I generally prefer they have markers with like a popsicle stick representing height.

Being able to glance around the table and understand LOS is important, and having to stop to check cards for actual size is not great.

EDIT: Imagine this scenario - I carefully place my Carrion Emissary, a model that towers over most things in the game, to get its aura affecting a critical model. I remember your war piglet is actually bigger than it appears, so assume it must be size 2 instead of size one. And then I'm quite surprised when it turns out your little piglet can block LOS to my emissary's aura and the game is decided by that. Not ideal. For reference, the Emissary model:

Granted, that is the large end of size 3, but there should be a general right-ish approach to the size of things.

[Edek]

I've positioned a Sz3 model that's physically way smaller than plenty of Sz2 terrains more time than I care to admit. How the heck Kandara is Sz2 when Mancha and Piggies are Sz3 is a mystery to me. Test Subjects are Sz2 and Brin who is the tallest model from the box is Sz1. 

[SEV]

Not an ideal solution, but you can adjust the base height to compensate for size... put that little war piglet on a big pile of thrash and he'll at least be taller than your size 2 models.

 

I still think that wyrd should fix this. Or at least make sure it never happens again (there's plenty of simple quality assurance process out there, you don't need to have an ISO certification to avoid blatant mistakes even if you're a small company).