If a model chain activates, can mood swings stop it?

[Maniacal_cackle]

If the Viktorias use Synchronized for example to chain activate, can the second Viktoria be stopped using Pandora's mood swings?

Pandora's effect happens after a model is chosen to activate, so does chain activation count?

[Maniacal_cackle]

I'm currently leaning towards no:

Selecting a model (step B) is presumably when Pandoras mood swings apply, but chain activations don't need to select a model, they go straight to C1 and start the activation.

[solkan]

Yeah, I think the timing argument is pretty conclusive.

Step B is "Select Model" which is described as "The Active player chooses one of their models that has not yet Activated this Turn to Activate.  Chain activations explicitly bypass that step, and say "Some effects can cause models to Activate after another model. If a model would Activate this way, immediately go back to the start of Step C."

In case someone wants to argue about expectations (from the Action sequence or elsewhere), that's a different arrangement of steps compared to taking an action, where the first step is always to "declare" the action.

So a model can end up activating without being "chosen" to activate, while it's not possible to take an Action without declaring it.

 

[Maniacal_cackle]

Man, the timing rules really aren't nice to Pandora between this and focus use timing.

Ah well, she isn't nice to anyone else xD

[diki]

Step C requires a Chosen model, therefore regardless of if you do step B a model has to be chosen to activate.

"C. Activation: The chosen model Activates (it is now the Acting model) and follows the steps below. "

I don't think the wording of mood swings requires the choosing to happen in step B of the activation timing. But you probably want to clarify before playing with your opponent or tournament organiser.

[Adran]

I can't offer anything productive at the moment, but does it make a difference which model is causing the chain activation? 

Actually looking at Companion, Accomplice and synchronised, they are all things done by the model that is about to activate (even when the ability isn't on their card), and so probably bypass the choice in a way that you can't mood swings it. 

 

[Maniacal_cackle]

1 hour ago, diki said:

I don't think the wording of mood swings requires the choosing to happen in step B of the activation timing. But you probably want to clarify before playing with your opponent or tournament organiser.

I'll be the TO for the next tournament, so trying to tackle it xD

Good point about the wording of step C, and there's a 'spirit of the rule' argument to be made potentially.

[diki]

I think with Mood swings being a master only power that requires a fair element of setup (aura plus los to somethign you would rather force to activate) that it's probably the intent to interupt any model activating in that aura. It's not like it's stopping the oponent getting an extra activation.

I also doubt anyone thought "oh pandora is too good we need to add some models with chain activation powers to hard counter this"

EDIT: I think its important for your oponent to know about it though. It's possible for them to influence who pandora can see, and to choose to use chain activation etc.

[Vaylos]

On 9/10/2020 at 5:10 AM, Maniacal_cackle said:

I'll be the TO for the next tournament, so trying to tackle it xD

Good point about the wording of step C, and there's a 'spirit of the rule' argument to be made potentially.

Did you every find out the specifics about this ruling?

[Maniacal_cackle]

7 hours ago, Vaylos said:

Did you every find out the specifics about this ruling?

Nothing more than what is in this thread :(

[TheUnseemlyOne]

With the recent changes, this question applies to Youko now too.