New frontier model in app

[Angelshard]

So what does people think of the rough rider for Basse? 

Personally I'm kinda bummed about mv 6 instead of 7, but I'd still say it's a great schemerunner for frontier. Plus he can't be locked down and has a reliable range 14" attack and ride with me. 

I think he's gonna be a stable in my Basse crews. 

[Maniacal_cackle]

The stat 5 'ride with me's are going to realllly hurt if the crew is card hungry!

Also pretty fragile model at 7 health with basically no survivability. However, with their high speed you can set them up somewhere to basically make your opponent spend a few extra actions to take them down (moving across the table). The kick up the dust + favorable terrain mean killing them with shooting is going to be tricky.

So I think they're a sweet model, show promise, but will often die to sloppy play and people may be put off them (certainly I'd mess up with them a lot if I tried them out).

[solkan]

Minion(2) 50mm.  So are these the two minions for that nightmare box of his?

Edit:  Oh, there’s the Alt artwork.  Cool, it is them.

[Angelshard]

@Maniacal_cackle I'm not really counting on ride with me for this model to be effective. I see him more as a flanker/schemer that can take on cheap models and get into the enemy backfield.

[trikk]

7 wds with Df5 means whoever looks at it, will kill it. 

You have to be super careful with them. I think T1 you Ride With Me on Basse or Reichart and then you put markers down and try to scheme

[Angelshard]

7 wds Df5 in cover and concealment with a 14" gun. He's gonna take some investment to take down, but yeah a beater in his face will ruin his day.

[Maniacal_cackle]

But for example if you were wanting to fake Outflank last season with one of these, could set it up on a flank.

If they invest sending a model across the table to kill it, it is going to likely take most of the game for that model to track it down. If not, the rough rider can be harassing from the side and doing quite a bit of gun damage over the course of the game.

[le_wahou]

He is resilient to shoot thanks to favorable terrain. He will either be far from melee beater, or close to your main beaters. I do not find him that fragile. Besides, with 1, he will get a 2/3/4 healing flip. It prevents opponents from getting him down with multiple rounds of shooting.

Basse team gets a cheap mounted guard with this model. That's a strong addition to the team in my opinion : Guild really need these models

Edit : trigger on ride with me is after resolving. With any tome, you will get your healing

[theamazingmrg]

The big thing these guys have over Mounted Guard (other than the lack of Keyword tax in Frontier) is the built-in positive flip on the gun.

[Alerteddonkey42]

I will never understand why Wyrd wants survivalist to be a thing in this crew. Just like with the frontiersman, you need to be able to survive a round of attacks to be able to make any use of survivalist. With no other defensive tech, they won't. There are a lot of mobile beaters and bruisers that could easily off these in one activation and not spend the whole game doing it. If you want dust clouds to keep then alive, you have a whole crew relying on that and you can't activate all of them before the opponent gets to go. Idk. Right now I'm finding it hilarious that the explorer master who is dual faction with Guild seems to be the worst of the explorers (we have a relatively small sample size, but still). 

[trikk]

31 minutes ago, Alerteddonkey42 said:

I will never understand why Wyrd wants survivalist to be a thing in this crew. Just like with the frontiersman, you need to be able to survive a round of attacks to be able to make any use of survivalist. With no other defensive tech, they won't. There are a lot of mobile beaters and bruisers that could easily off these in one activation and not spend the whole game doing it. If you want dust clouds to keep then alive, you have a whole crew relying on that and you can't activate all of them before the opponent gets to go. Idk. Right now I'm finding it hilarious that the explorer master who is dual faction with Guild seems to be the worst of the explorers (we have a relatively small sample size, but still). 

If Frontiersmen and Rough Riders got HtK they would be cool and synergy well with Survivalist

[Morgan Vening]

5 hours ago, Alerteddonkey42 said:

I will never understand why Wyrd wants survivalist to be a thing in this crew. Just like with the frontiersman, you need to be able to survive a round of attacks to be able to make any use of survivalist. With no other defensive tech, they won't. There are a lot of mobile beaters and bruisers that could easily off these in one activation and not spend the whole game doing it. If you want dust clouds to keep then alive, you have a whole crew relying on that and you can't activate all of them before the opponent gets to go. Idk. Right now I'm finding it hilarious that the explorer master who is dual faction with Guild seems to be the worst of the explorers (we have a relatively small sample size, but still). 

With Frontiersman, it's kinda funny, because he's both significantly weaker, and needs it to trigger off a melee attack. Though, you could always risk the whiff (charge a friendly, cheat in the Ace of Tomes). But it's too many issues there.

But with the Rider, I'm gonna disagree. Deleting them, from a distance, and them being able to heal on a utility Bonus action, makes a difference. If you're capable of consistently doing 7 damage at 14" range, possibly into cover/concealment, then your opponent has got bigger problems than Survivalist not being that useful.

[Angelshard]

@Alerteddonkey42 I don't know many beaters that could walk 14", kill a 7wds model and walk back in less than 3 turns. And few ranged beaters will kill it in an activation. 

[Alerteddonkey42]

2 hours ago, Angelshard said:

@Alerteddonkey42 I don't know many beaters that could walk 14", kill a 7wds model and walk back in less than 3 turns. And few ranged beaters will kill it in an activation. 

Some could do it in 1 hit with focus. Just offhand I would have no trouble getting hannah to do it (I've been playing Freikorps lately) and Friekorp aren't even the most efficient beaters. Plus with rocket boots she wouldn't even really be gone from the game. This argument, however, also assumes that there is nothing to do where the rough rider is and you can just give up a flank once they die (banking on the opponent "wasting" ap after killing the rough rider). Most pools will have something to do. It's also assuming that the opponent wants their model to go back to the same place it were. Beaters or bruisers with leap will easily kill them and still be relevant the next turn. Any sniper model can kill them in 2 shots (hans can do it in 1). I guess it depends on the meta you're in, how much your opponents spam focus, and if you opponents take efficient beaters. You're right in that it won't usually die to 1 hit, but at 7 ss I would like it to take more than 2 hits. I also disagree with the argument that if someone goes after them then they won't contribute to the rest of the game. Their mobility and range is probably their biggest defense, but I'm not overly impressed. The healing isn't great as you need a suit on a minion in a crew that can be quite card starved. Reichart and Basse have heals, but they are pretty inefficient and cost an ap (and don't have triggers). I could be wrong though. Haven't gotten them on the table. My comments, like many in this thread, are a hot take. 

[Adran]

10 hours ago, Alerteddonkey42 said:

Some could do it in 1 hit with focus. Just offhand I would have no trouble getting hannah to do it (I've been playing Freikorps lately) and Friekorp aren't even the most efficient beaters. Plus with rocket boots she wouldn't even really be gone from the game. This argument, however, also assumes that there is nothing to do where the rough rider is and you can just give up a flank once they die (banking on the opponent "wasting" ap after killing the rough rider). Most pools will have something to do. It's also assuming that the opponent wants their model to go back to the same place it were. Beaters or bruisers with leap will easily kill them and still be relevant the next turn. Any sniper model can kill them in 2 shots (hans can do it in 1). I guess it depends on the meta you're in, how much your opponents spam focus, and if you opponents take efficient beaters. You're right in that it won't usually die to 1 hit, but at 7 ss I would like it to take more than 2 hits. I also disagree with the argument that if someone goes after them then they won't contribute to the rest of the game. Their mobility and range is probably their biggest defense, but I'm not overly impressed. The healing isn't great as you need a suit on a minion in a crew that can be quite card starved. Reichart and Basse have heals, but they are pretty inefficient and cost an ap (and don't have triggers). I could be wrong though. Haven't gotten them on the table. My comments, like many in this thread, are a hot take. 

Hannah has the potentially highest damage track in the game, and is one of the easiest models to utilise her maximum possible damage. If you only take models Hannah can't kill in 1 hit with focus, then you have a very small pool of models. 

There is not very many models that can do 7 damage in one hit in any circumstances, There are only 7 possible models in Outcast for example, and 3 of those are Friekorps, (you have 2 versatile in Hans and Barbaros, and 2 Amalgam in Desolation engine and Ashes and dust) who also have good access to focus as required, so I think your view is slightly slanted,  several require the right suited card as well as a stone to get there (or 2 suited cards for Hans). 

(Those numbers don't include using a red joker for damage, which does up it quite a bit)

Remember if you are using Sniper to increase range, you don't also gain a positive to the attack and damage flip. (You can spend a second focus for that if you want).  Most Snipers have a long range anyway so you might not mean that, but I've seen people make that mistake before. 

 

 

[Angelshard]

@Alerteddonkey42 I agree that it's a hot take for all of us and I might end up disappointed. I guess I'm just tired of hearing how, almost, every guild model is underwhelming or bad. I don't think you can expect much more from a 7ss model than what the rough rider gives you.

It can put down two schemes a turn with a 5+ thanks to build in reposition trigger. It has a decent attack, with above average range and it gives ride with me. With the option of healing any model within aura 3 if you have the tome and need the healing. It's very hard to take down from range and it can't be locked by just engaging it. 

I really don't see how it's not worth 7 stones.

[4thstringer]

I'm excited for it.  It isn't a guild model, so we will only see it in basse, but I think it be a common take in at least Basse, and maybe in McCabe.  

[Morgan Vening]

22 hours ago, 4thstringer said:

I'm excited for it.  It isn't a guild model, so we will only see it in basse, but I think it be a common take in at least Basse, and maybe in McCabe.  

Maybe not two, but I think every McCabe crew will take one for a Sidir taxi, assuming you don’t want to use McCabe for that.

[HomelessOne]

Not in app, but another new kid. Foreshadowed even!

[Morgan Vening]

The sleeper has awakened!

[Angelshard]

If you have a low mask in hand three attacks with min 3 seems quite effective and the fact that you can negate things like serene countenance is also really good. But I wish it had wp 5. Df and wp 4 seems quite harsh on an 8ss model. 

[Squirrelich]

Looks cool, but its aesthetic is so different than the rest of my Guild models it is going to be one more reason I never make room for Basse in my budget  

[Adran]

1 hour ago, Angelshard said:

If you have a low mask in hand three attacks with min 3 seems quite effective and the fact that you can negate things like serene countenance is also really good. But I wish it had wp 5. Df and wp 4 seems quite harsh on an 8ss model. 

Its worth applying the Colette rule to the model. Its defensive stats only matter if you're attacking it.

And if you attack it you are risking allowing it to unbury with that extra attack. So you can certainly hit it and hit it hard (although its not easy to get cheatable damage) but you may not be able to hit it often.

There maybe a sudden rush of wp attacks when you know you're facing frontier.

[Angelshard]

Oh how I wish I could give it a lead lined coat. 

[touchdown]

11 minutes ago, Angelshard said:

Oh how I wish I could give it a lead lined coat. 

if you declare Guild Basse, you could!