Marcus Dreams

[Ogid]

To me Marcus has 4 main problems:

• Too many must picks; for a master that is all about versatility, he has very fixed lists if you want good results. Cojo and the saber are the worst offenders.
• Weak mechanics; it seems the devs were so afraid this guy were too good. The fact than an obey can make a beast discard 2 upgrades or that he needs to scale his models but loses agains every other scaling mechanic in the game is problematic; he is also very resource starved. An stunned Marcus is beyond useless...
• He cannot adapt; he works so bad with non-beast/chimera models that if the keyword doesn't have an answer for an enemy master, he is in a terrible position. Again ironic taking in count his theme. He needs to be able to support non-beast.
• Unbalance between ARC and NVB. Either bother balancing both sides or just leave him as an ARC Master and give NVB other master; he is only playable in very limited pools and he isn't even the best in those, right now even Hina leader is better than him.

On 1/19/2021 at 8:04 PM, ShinChan said:

I would like a design change that allows Marcus to put upgrades only on Chimera. This way, the non-chimera beast could see small buffs here and there, making them more competent in their keywords while being able to operate with Marcus, without the need of putting upgrades on them.

This would be the last nail in the coffin for NVB Marcus.

On 1/20/2021 at 3:53 AM, Jinn said:

Grootslang is way better than the Mauler for mostly the same role. 

This catched my eye... those 2 are quite different imho. Mauler is a tarpit with good combat potential (quite nasty potential in the right set up actually) and a decent lodestone carrier thanks to laugh off. The grootslang is a tanky scheme runner that gives good board control and that may hope to control some foes without getting tabled too fast if needed, but he cannot tank, carry the lodestone nor attack as the mauler.

[extremor]

35 minutes ago, Ogid said:

Too many must picks; for a master that is all about versatility, he has very fixed lists if you want good results. Cojo and the saber are the worst offenders.

I would be fine with Cojo being staple. Saber is very lame imo. Without its leap I wouldn’t take it (NVB-Marcus) -so switching Leap to an upgrade would allow Marcus Keyword to be way more flexible. 

EDIT: yes my lists consist of Cojo, Myranda, 1-2 Saber, -100% of all games I played so far ~ 8 (I‘m still new to Marcus) and I wouldn’t drop any of them. 

35 minutes ago, Ogid said:

He cannot adapt; he works so bad with non-beast/chimera models that if the keyword doesn't have an answer for an enemy master, he is in a terrible position. Again ironic taking in count his theme. He needs to be able to support non-beast

I would love to see Marcus being independent from versatiles/ook. With the mutation mechanic it would be possible. Which ook/versatile do you play to counter opponents? Or what abilities does Marcus lack, so you need to take ook/versatile? 

[Ogid]

1 hour ago, extremor said:

I would be fine with Cojo being staple. Saber is very lame imo. Without its leap I wouldn’t take it (NVB-Marcus) -so switching Leap to an upgrade would allow Marcus Keyword to be way more flexible. 

EDIT: yes my lists consist of Cojo, Myranda, 1-2 Saber, -100% of all games I played so far ~ 8 (I‘m still new to Marcus) and I wouldn’t drop any of them.

I think I talked about this in the past... but my take would be change Saber Onslaught for another mask trigger that wouldn't allow him to stack 15 damage in 1 model; that plus SC make 90% of the roster redundant.

Cojo is hard to change without destroying him so maybe allow his totem to be extra stones for beasts or maybe allow Marcus' call of the wild to make beasts charge ignoring the once per turn (or perform any attack not just charges), that's one of his niches.

And Marcus feels like a 12-13SS Master... he could use some power shifted from himself (or some buffs)

1 hour ago, extremor said:

I would love to see Marcus being independent from versatiles/ook. With the mutation mechanic it would be possible. Which ook/versatile do you play to counter opponents? Or what abilities does Marcus lack, so you need to take ook/versatile? 

It's hard because there are some crews and factions that warp the game a lot... I don't think he could adapt to every posible situation in this game just with beasts and mutations, at least without significant changes.

My OOK/Versatiles? Serena, Hina + WW (with bander); maybe some woes if I expect conditions (Candy/The Carver). There could be other good picks like Rider or BBS and potential double masters but my Marcus picks are very targeted (specific factions and pools) to avoid having to pick too many of those and face hard counters tbh so I've not explored those yet (and I pick him in those because it's a master I enjoy playing, not because he is the best in those pools).

Marcus lacks (from my NVB experience) backbone, reliability, ability to respond to certain masters/techs, scaling, condition removal, resource generation and decent early agression potential. A few versatiles help with some, but not all the problems...

[Harlekin]

6 hours ago, Ogid said:

my take would be change Saber Onslaught for another mask trigger

Well, Leap and Onslaught is what we bring the Cerberus for. If we take any from it the Marcus crew looses even more reliable options. Giving it Pouncing Strike instead might fit the theme really good, though. But the Cerberus would definitely loose its well-defined role of a hunter of lone Scheme runners, then.

 

6 hours ago, Ogid said:

And Marcus feels like a 12-13SS Master... he could use some power shifted from himself (or some buffs)

Indeed.

 

6 hours ago, Ogid said:

Marcus lacks (from my NVB experience) backbone, reliability, ability to respond to certain masters/techs, scaling, condition removal, resource generation and decent early agression potential.

Marcus (Chimera) comes with potential for mobility, card draw, healing, focus, damage output... So, he (his Keyword) looks really impressive on first glance. But he imho is a bit too much of a Jack of All Trades and lacks reliability. Most things are situational and/or circumstantial. The beasts alone don't really compensate enough for his lacking focus/reliability. 
But the idea you mentioned earlier of having Adaptive Evolution on every one of his Upgrades might really work wonders here without changing anything else. Thus, those beast would start to blend into the Keyword more and some more synergies would result. 
Not sure if this would be enough but as of now I think it is.

[Ogid]

1 hour ago, Harlekin said:

Well, Leap and Onslaught is what we bring the Cerberus for. If we take any from it the Marcus crew looses even more reliable options. Giving it Pouncing Strike instead might fit the theme really good, though. But the Cerberus would definitely loose its well-defined role of a hunter of lone Scheme runners, then.

 

Yes, that model is awesome; but the point is it's so awesome that makes everything else outclassed. Want to scheme? Cerberus. Want to kill something away from Marcus? Cerberus. Put a SC in the cat and it becomes very reliable killing things and getting back the SS used to kill those things. And this makes it also quite akward for NVB Marcus, anything that will help Marcus in purple will make it absolutely nuts in blue... Balancing both sides it's problematic with this one just considering how much the upgrades impact this crew.

Cojo has a simmilar problem. Want to fight near of Marcus or have something that stop the other player form just storming in? There is no better choice than Cojo well stacked with Focused; and he has also a lot of utility with Toss and the marker removal.

IDK, maybe tweaking the cat into an enforcer (only 1 per crew and maybe even of cost 9 to avoid Myranda shapesifting) and reducing it to only 1 will help to keep it under control instead of the trigger change...

1 hour ago, Harlekin said:

Marcus (Chimera) comes with potential for mobility, card draw, healing, focus, damage output... So, he (his Keyword) looks really impressive on first glance. But he imho is a bit too much of a Jack of All Trades and lacks reliability. Most things are situational and/or circumstantial. The beasts alone don't really compensate enough for his lacking focus/reliability. 
But the idea you mentioned earlier of having Adaptive Evolution on every one of his Upgrades might really work wonders here without changing anything else. Thus, those beast would start to blend into the Keyword more and some more synergies would result. 
Not sure if this would be enough but as of now I think it is.

Yeah, totally agree; the first time I looked at his card I was also impressed; but then in the table everything wasn't that shinny haha. The damage is definitelly there, but it's too unreliable; the card draw aura is too small, favored the opposite playstile he should be doing and can't sustaim him putting upgrades and obeying models around; in a decent fight he folds like paper. I made him work with a Colette-like playstile, quite far for the hunter style he seems to have.

I have to give other users credit for the AE in upgrades to be fair; but that will also need some tweaking; a simple obeyish ability could make a beast discard 2 upgrades; and upgrades are too costly to use AE all the time so this advantage wouldn't be that good. This is also tricky as it might push some OOK beasts over the edge if this is reworked... but with the actual iteration it'd be probably fine.

IDK, maybe we'll get a surprise in the next GG and the devs figured out the perfect solution; but I don't have much hope this gets fixed soon tbh.

[Harlekin]

12 hours ago, Ogid said:

anything that will help Marcus in purple will make it absolutely nuts in blue

If NVB get another Versatile (or non-Chimera) Beast, it won't be any problem at all as it won't have any impact on a Arcanist Marcus crew. 

And yes, the Obeys are only one of Marcus' problem. Lack of survivability compared to other bubble crews (which the crew should not (fluff: stalking hunters) but has to be (for the effects/ressources)).

Maybe getting an 7 Stones Summoner (Enforcer; similar to the Forgotten Marshal) could help to give the crew a bump. If he/she could summon Minions up to maybe 7 Stones, the Molemen, Corrupted Hounds and Rattlers might suddenly see more playtime and the crew in general would get more ressources in terms of AP? Some Myranda Crocket who calls in smaller beasts again and again would absolutely fit the eco warriors theme in my book.

[Cedar]

56 minutes ago, Harlekin said:

If NVB get another Versatile (or non-Chimera) Beast, it won't be any problem at all as it won't have any impact on a Arcanist Marcus crew. 

It's easy to see NB getting something like Swampfiend/Fae beast, that could fit in the Marcus crew.

 

58 minutes ago, Harlekin said:

Maybe getting an 7 Stones Summoner (Enforcer; similar to the Forgotten Marshal) could help to give the crew a bump. If he/she could summon Minions up to maybe 7 Stones, the Molemen, Corrupted Hounds and Rattlers might suddenly see more playtime and the crew in general would get more ressources in terms of AP? Some Myranda Crocket who calls in smaller beasts again and again would absolutely fit the eco warriors theme in my book.

I imagine a Chimera/Nephilim, enforcer/henchman who is a hound-master, summoning corrupted hounds for the hunt.

[MrPieChee]

Cerberus loosing onslaught isn't a huge issue - formidable horns gives the same trigger. So, if it helps balance the crew in the wake of a buff, so for it!

Arc Marcus being better comes down to attuned and soulstone generation. The simple solution is to create an mutation that does the same/similar. I'm not a huge fan of this, but it's an easy fix.

Moving adaptive evolution to mutations could also leave space to append a change that stops it being used when obeyed... (Pretty sure I said this above, but possibly in another thread)

[extremor]

2 hours ago, MrPieChee said:

Cerberus loosing onslaught isn't a huge issue - formidable horns gives the same trigger. So, if it helps balance the crew in the wake of a buff, so for it!

I don’t think that’s a solution. To me the Cerberus would be nearly as good as before just because it still leaps. Leap is a very powerful action. 

I just wish to nerf the Cerberus to an even level with SRM, Rougarou (tBW, Groot) so each of them is specialized. This means cutting his leap. and then have a mutation with leap. I think redesigning the Mutations and one or two tweaks here and there  is the easiest way to balance the crew.  And maybe get rid of the „all mutations are plentiful 2“ idea. Why aren’t there once only mutations and plentiful 3 mutations... this would open things up: like one mutation with ruthless, one with leap, 2 with marker removal, 3x shrug off, infect trigger, maybe a spitting ranged attack, intimidating authorities (in a beastly way),1-2x terrifying, etc etc etc. 
 

Soooo many ideas. Soooo many possibilities ... like Lego... creating individual beasts...

 

EDIT: but maybe that’s too complicated to balance and I have to say: I just love Marcus the way he is!!!

[Harlekin]

30 minutes ago, extremor said:

I just love Marcus the way he is!!!

Same!

[MrPieChee]

I thought the point of this thread was that Marcus isn't ok as he is - he's way below the curve in Neverborn, and not great in Arcanists...

[extremor]

35 minutes ago, MrPieChee said:

I thought the point of this thread was that Marcus isn't ok as he is - he's way below the curve in Neverborn, and not great in Arcanists...

Yes it is. Still I love the way he works, even though he is under the curve. And that may be the most challenging task. Tweak Marcus but keep the style of play. And I have read several ideas and aspects of Marcus we want to be buffed: 

-independent hunter

-mutation toolbox 

-AP swap

-Card draw

-fast

-flexibel (Easy leaving Engagement)

and so on... 

 

My wish would be to keep his jack of all trades style... just buff it  but that may exactly be the difficulty as ogrid mentioned before (esp  since he now is dual faction)!!!

 

[Adran]

19 hours ago, extremor said:

I just wish to nerf the Cerberus to an even level with SRM, Rougarou (tBW, Groot) so each of them is specialized. This means cutting his leap. and then have a mutation with leap. I think redesigning the Mutations and one or two tweaks here and there  is the easiest way to balance the crew.  And maybe get rid of the „all mutations are plentiful 2“ idea. Why aren’t there once only mutations and plentiful 3 mutations... this would open things up: like one mutation with ruthless, one with leap, 2 with marker removal, 3x shrug off, infect trigger, maybe a spitting ranged attack, intimidating authorities (in a beastly way),1-2x terrifying, etc etc etc. 

Honestly, I think putting an ability like leap on an upgrade makes it harder to balance. I'm partially basing it on M2E Shifting loyalty campaign, but there are some models out there that get very good if they can leap, and you end up having  to consider the effect of leap on any model when you put it on an upgrade. 

I think Leap is one of the strongest actions out there, and should be used with care. (Although I Know that Vonschill can give it out on an upgrade, but that's at least only 1 use)

[Harlekin]

9 hours ago, Adran said:

Honestly, I think putting an ability like leap on an upgrade makes it harder to balance.

Definitely.
But it might be rather easy for having it on an Evolution Upgrade as the required Mask doesn't have to be on the Stat. Thus it will become an option which comes with a price and not an auto-take each and every activation. Remember how much Archie suddenly lost popularity after he got his nerf.

I'd still prefer the Cerberus to keep his leap as it just really fits its theme imho. 

[Adran]

Cerberus last edition didn't have a mask on its leap, or any way short of cheating to get it, and it was still crazy good, so I don't think the lack of a suit makes it bad, just requires some planning.

I wouldn't be surprised if the loss in popularity was significantly more than the loss in power for archie. But that might just be me. 

[extremor]

28 minutes ago, Adran said:

Cerberus last edition didn't have a mask on its leap, or any way short of cheating to get it, and it was still crazy good, so I don't think the lack of a suit makes it bad, just requires some planning.

I wouldn't be surprised if the loss in popularity was significantly more than the loss in power for archie. But that might just be me. 

If the range for primal domain would be extended a lot and the carddraw would be buffed, I would be totally fine with dropping the build in suit.

[Maniacal_cackle]

3 hours ago, Adran said:

Cerberus last edition didn't have a mask on its leap, or any way short of cheating to get it, and it was still crazy good, so I don't think the lack of a suit makes it bad, just requires some planning.

I wouldn't be surprised if the loss in popularity was significantly more than the loss in power for archie. But that might just be me. 

I think Archie himself can operate at essentially the same power level, but now acts as a resource drain rather than occasional resource generator.

But that is in the context of a card-draw crew with lots of activation control. You can really feel the difference to the crew, but the final effect is the same (with greater card loss and loss of activation control).

And of course it largely killed Archie OOK (still good with Reva though for the other synergies).

I'm not sure how much card draw Marcus has, or how the dynamic of the crew works.

So that's an angle to consider nerfing leap suit may not impact the model itself, but the rest of the crew might have to alter its patterns to ensure the leap happens.

EDIT: note as much as I complain about it, ultimately the removal of Archie's suit was an improvement and game balance improved.

EDIT2: but then, some games I flip the leap off the top four turns in a row and feel like I have a pre-nerf Archie (leaping even without any cards in hand to cheat for leap). So from that perspective I don't like it compared to other possible changes.

[Maniacal_cackle]

What I would have done for Archie, and could work for Cerberus, is to give a new ability instead of leap:

Gargantuan rush: push 6 inches in any direction.

Terrain still affects it (though Cerberus gets unimpeded), models can block it, etc.

And it feels appropriate for these giant brutes to be able to be stopped in their tracks by a size four ice golem (while tricksy silruids sneak past the lines).

[Ogid]

On 2/1/2021 at 9:56 AM, Harlekin said:

If NVB get another Versatile (or non-Chimera) Beast, it won't be any problem at all as it won't have any impact on a Arcanist Marcus crew. 

And yes, the Obeys are only one of Marcus' problem. Lack of survivability compared to other bubble crews (which the crew should not (fluff: stalking hunters) but has to be (for the effects/ressources)).

Maybe getting an 7 Stones Summoner (Enforcer; similar to the Forgotten Marshal) could help to give the crew a bump. If he/she could summon Minions up to maybe 7 Stones, the Molemen, Corrupted Hounds and Rattlers might suddenly see more playtime and the crew in general would get more ressources in terms of AP? Some Myranda Crocket who calls in smaller beasts again and again would absolutely fit the eco warriors theme in my book.

I don't think NVB Marcus could be fixed with only a few NVB exclusive models, and even if it could, that would railroad the list into a few must picks to patch the holes... no thanks...

Yes agree totally in that point, Marcus mechanics are all over the place and just doesn't work as intended.

And about the summoning, it could be a way but right now he already lacks the resources and I don't think we need more summoners (plus if this new summoner is avaliable for blue, then again NVB is in the loss because no way to get the trigger if he is an enforcer).

On 2/1/2021 at 2:14 PM, MrPieChee said:

Arc Marcus being better comes down to attuned and soulstone generation. The simple solution is to create an mutation that does the same/similar. I'm not a huge fan of this, but it's an easy fix.

I'm not a big fan of this as it seems like a patch that forces NVB to use that one and offer little to ARC. I'd rather see both sides being able to put the other faction's upgrades in chimeras (and maybe also in beasts). This would fix it giving both sides of the crew new useful perks.

On 2/1/2021 at 4:55 PM, extremor said:

I don’t think that’s a solution. To me the Cerberus would be nearly as good as before just because it still leaps. Leap is a very powerful action. 

I just wish to nerf the Cerberus to an even level with SRM, Rougarou (tBW, Groot) so each of them is specialized. This means cutting his leap. and then have a mutation with leap. I think redesigning the Mutations and one or two tweaks here and there  is the easiest way to balance the crew.  And maybe get rid of the „all mutations are plentiful 2“ idea. Why aren’t there once only mutations and plentiful 3 mutations... this would open things up: like one mutation with ruthless, one with leap, 2 with marker removal, 3x shrug off, infect trigger, maybe a spitting ranged attack, intimidating authorities (in a beastly way),1-2x terrifying, etc etc etc. 
 

Soooo many ideas. Soooo many possibilities ... like Lego... creating individual beasts...

Tbh I think Cerberus is at the level of the other beasts in NVB but maybe it's my playstile; it only goes out of hand in ARC thanks to that upgrade. In NVB Rougarou is tankier while still dangerous with the right upgrade and can do things the cat can't (like using that push to move defenders out of the way or being a model able to get rid of conditions in a crew severly punished by that) or the Grootslang being able to defend several places at once and control foes with range 2 and slow. The cat is schemy and fast, but go down very quickly even with mutations and his damage output isn't that great without being able to buy the suit and getting free positives thanks to SC. In a faction where every crew can grow a Mature if they want in turn 1 I don't think the cerberus is something to call home about tbh.

And about the leap change for a wattered down version of it... the cerberus would still be a model able to dish out 15 damage to a single target in a turn in ARC getting SS out of it and being able to use SS to reduce damage in ARC while still having all the issues in NVB... I don't really think hitting that is the way to go, it'd make both version worse (hitting the ARC harder) without really solving too much.

And yeah, leap in an upgrade would be beyond OP XDD; that is too good.

On 2/1/2021 at 4:55 PM, extremor said:

I just love Marcus the way he is!!!

On 2/2/2021 at 10:45 AM, MrPieChee said:

I thought the point of this thread was that Marcus isn't ok as he is - he's way below the curve in Neverborn, and not great in Arcanists...

There is room for both :). I have a ton of fun with Marcus and I really like how he plays, but at the same time the glaring weaknesses make him a suboptimal pick everywhere. So yeah, the idea of this thread is trying to fix his problems and giving him more viable lists without changing him too much or making him the new OP crew.

[admiralvorkraft]

I doubt that you can really rework Marcus without addressing SS Cache and Magical Training.

[MrPieChee]

I really can't see Marcus/dual faction masters being able to use both factions upgrades. It goes against the current design of the factions. Even it was on the cards, which I doubt it is, I can't see how this is better than giving Marcus an upgrade for it.

Arc Marcus already gets Wings which gives the best part of the pre-errata inhuman reflexes - having a mutation that does the same thing for an arcanist upgrade isn't much of a stretch.

Anyway, as I said before, its an easy fix, but not one I like much (but its much better than giving Marcus access to 6 general upgrades). 

 

There's lots of talk of lead lined coat ham stringing Guild. I wonder if Marcus can only move forward after Arcanist upgrades get changed. I wonder if just getting rid of attuned from the SSC still leaves it worth 2SS? It obviously won't be worth it on lots of models its currently taken on...

[extremor]

I fought von stook yesterday. I had a pretty hard time due to his „no upgrades“ aura and I thought that if adaptive evolution moved to the upgrade cards v.S. Would be a really hard counter. Esp with Anna lovelaces „no place“ aura. 

[Ogid]

1 hour ago, MrPieChee said:

I really can't see Marcus/dual faction masters being able to use both factions upgrades. It goes against the current design of the factions. Even it was on the cards, which I doubt it is, I can't see how this is better than giving Marcus an upgrade for it.

Arc Marcus already gets Wings which gives the best part of the pre-errata inhuman reflexes - having a mutation that does the same thing for an arcanist upgrade isn't much of a stretch.

Anyway, as I said before, its an easy fix, but not one I like much (but its much better than giving Marcus access to 6 general upgrades). 

 

There's lots of talk of lead lined coat ham stringing Guild. I wonder if Marcus can only move forward after Arcanist upgrades get changed. I wonder if just getting rid of attuned from the SSC still leaves it worth 2SS? It obviously won't be worth it on lots of models its currently taken on...

Balancing a game like this one is hard but after thinking about this particular issue more than once, the shared faction upgrades are literally the only way I see to balance well both sides of this crew. A NVB model that alone could put this crew on par would have to be very OP and the last thing this crew needs is another must pick. A mutation "fixing" this would force players to go for that one in most situations, thus neutring the point of getting the best upgrade for the scenario and giving him only a few playable lists... I could be wrong here, but I don't see those as good options.

Also Malifaux is full of crews breaking rules, this perk would be just another instance of that and by letting only the out of faction upgrades on Chimera (or in chimera + beasts) and as a leader only ability, you know those will be mostly in models that already can use them so there shouldn't be much room to break things (instead of a NVB player getting a Mature with SSC or an ARC getting his Emissary or Kudra with IR to name 2 potential powerful synergies).

 

SSC is a big part of ARC tho, so definitelly not in favor of removing/nerfing that upgrade. Also even sharing upgrades ARC still has the upper hand in SS generation anyway, with the Miners and his Rider may also help with this playstile by giving those models extra activations; that empower this playstile way more than anything in NVB.

I don't have a problem with crews relying a lot of some of it faction's upgrades, but in this case it's problematic because of the dual faction nature of Marcus. It is specially important because the crew cannot rely on their SS users to do the heavy lifting AND it can also solve part of the crippling problems of the crew (unreliable, resource hungry and no backbone); other ARC dual faction masters also suffer a bit by it, but all of those may rely on their henchmans and Masters way more than this crew or aren't as restricted as this one so the other factions advantages really make them playable.

 

Also this plus a few buffs could also give Marcus a niche, right now there are better crew for his good pools in both factions (Colette/Sandeep or Zoraida/Nekima for example; hell, even Hinamatsu could be a better pick than him in NVB); by giving him some really unique options (like Ill Omen+2 or high ping but glassy Initiates with IR in ARC), he could stand a chance to be a legit pick at least in some scenarios.

However this is just the tip of the iceberg, more of his mechanics need some work; right now his crew tries to be a bubble crew, an scaling crew with the upgrades and a mobile hitty/schemy crew at the same time and it fails at the three. His crew gets steamrolled by any half decent bubble crew, any other fast crew either outpunches or outscheme them, relying so heavily on charges make counterpicks crippling and his upgrades loses against any other scaling mechainc (summons, tokens, LD...). And even other simmilar mechanics are clearly superior and more versatile (see McCabbe artifacts giving fast and working on OOK workhorses like Samurais or Jorogumos or Asami's Flicker being active from minute 1, not requiring so many resources and being immune to shenanigans while the master AND totem are alive).

He needs to specialize a bit more, trying to be so good at so many thing will leave either an OP crew able to play every pool or an underdog like this one.

 

24 minutes ago, extremor said:

I fought von stook yesterday. I had a pretty hard time due to his „no upgrades“ aura and I thought that if adaptive evolution moved to the upgrade cards v.S. Would be a really hard counter. Esp with Anna lovelaces „no place“ aura. 

Honestly RES shuts down Marcus at so many levels that for me Marcus is a big no no into that faction (at least from the purple side)

[extremor]

So, next round here. I tried to think outside the bubbles for some of the fewer used models (my standard of course) and today I’m starting with 

razorspine rattler:

IMO they lack a true purpose. They seem to have been stuck half way between scheming and slowing down/binding enemy models. Lots of crews have their own way of leaving engagements other than disengagement so they seem to lack something. I think they should be more annoying like: boring conversation or diversion aura. 
 

what do you think?

[Harlekin]

That's just not necessary. If my opponent has to spend some of his movement trick actions on getting a model free of the Rattler, that's just fine.
For me, the Razorspine Rattlers are just fine just because they are multi-purpose: They are rather fast, are sturdy enough to be more than a nuisance, have the chance to cost ressource with Constriction and Wicked. 
I only wish for them to have Adaptive Evolution. 

The thing about Rattlers in a Chimera Crew is that the opponent can't ignore them and he has to dedicate a serious amount of ressources to getting them down, usually a model with higher cost than the Rattler itself plus some cards. And if the Rattler goes down chances are pretty high that the 8+ Stone model is someplace he doesn't want it to be and already took a relevant amount of damage.

I guess the Rattler are so unpopular because of the competition. 7 Stones is more than another Initiate or Crockett and only 1 below another Sabertooth. They kinda tend to fill a role usually meant for cheaper models to take: announce Scheme running and/or diversion. And Marcus' cheap models (Molemen, Hoarcats, Corrupted Hounds) are just, well, close to never seen on the table at all. So, falling back on a 7 Stones model to fullfill those duties usually taken by 3-5 points models seems to be more change of habits the typical Malifaux player is willing to do.