Marker Removal in Outcasts

[Bazlord_Prime]

Hey! New to Outcasts, and I'm just wondering how Outcasts go about getting rid of non-Destructible markers, such as Titania's "Underbrush", Mysterious Emissary's "Hungry Land", etc?

Thanks!

[Alerteddonkey42]

4 hours ago, Bazlord_Prime said:

Hey! New to Outcasts, and I'm just wondering how Outcasts go about getting rid of non-Destructible markers, such as Titania's "Underbrush", Mysterious Emissary's "Hungry Land", etc?

Thanks!

Very few models are able to remove those types of markers unfortunately. The only way I can think of off-hand is by taking Zipp and hiring in Mancha Roja. He can remove markers with his melee. 

[Adran]

Zipp bringing in bayou infamous ( mancha and the wrestlers) removal is the only way. I think it puts them at 4th best faction ( as guild, arcanists and TT can't even do that much if I remember correctly). 

[Alerteddonkey42]

50 minutes ago, Adran said:

Zipp bringing in bayou infamous ( mancha and the wrestlers) removal is the only way. I think it puts them at 4th best faction ( as guild, arcanists and TT can't even do that much if I remember correctly). 

Lotus eaters in 10T can. I know that much after my games vs Shenlong. I don't think Arcanists and Guild do though. 

[Adran]

37 minutes ago, Alerteddonkey42 said:

Lotus eaters in 10T can. I know that much after my games vs Shenlong. I don't think Arcanists and Guild do though. 

I keep forgetting them because it's a front of card thing, not an action. Ok, tt probably just edge bayou. 

[clockworkspide]

Can Outcast Crossroads 7 bring in Gluttony to do it?  Or does Maddening Drums not work here?

[Adran]

17 minutes ago, clockworkspide said:

Can Outcast Crossroads 7 bring in Gluttony to do it?  Or does Maddening Drums not work here?

That also works. 

[Jesy Blue]

You'd have to declare Pride as leader first, so that's gonna had a rare occurrence unless you often play Crossroads Seven.

[Bazlord_Prime]

Boo.

Well, if it's a fairly rare capability, I can't be too bummed out that we don't have any. I'm just switching over from Bayou where we have Gluttony and the Lucky Emissary that can both do it, so I thought it was a bit more common across the board.

[Jesy Blue]

Bayou is LOADED with them... every one else,  not so much.

Also, if you've declared Parker, you can bring Bayou Smugglers, who can just move them, which is kind of like getting rid of them. So, another option.

[Bazlord_Prime]

6 minutes ago, Jesy Blue said:

Bayou is LOADED with them... every one else,  not so much.

Also, if you've declared Parker, you can bring Bayou Smugglers, who can just move them, which is kind of like getting rid of them. So, another option.

Or Zipp. Smugglers are both Bandit & Infamous.

[Adran]

On 8/9/2020 at 10:16 PM, Bazlord_Prime said:

Boo.

Well, if it's a fairly rare capability, I can't be too bummed out that we don't have any. I'm just switching over from Bayou where we have Gluttony and the Lucky Emissary that can both do it, so I thought it was a bit more common across the board.

I think it's only 7 8 models in the game, its the 4 bayou options, Molly, poltigiest and lotus eater. Edit -And Kaeris on a Trigger...

[Bazlord_Prime]

1 hour ago, Adran said:

I think it's only 7 models in the game, its the 4 bayou options, Molly, poltigiest and lotus eater. 

Wow. Bayou - and especially Zipp - really are privileged in this regard. Enough to make me think twice about coming to Outcasts, given In going to be facing Titania quite regularly 😉

[Jesy Blue]

Also, outside of Infamous, Outcast has a single Flying model.... there are a lot of limitations.

However, my Freikorps have about a 75% win ratio over Fae because of ignoring concealing and indirect fire; I've got a friend who almost always beats Fae with Amalgam and/or Bandits.

There is not only 1 way to play against a keyword. That's probably one of the main draws of the game.

 

[Burnin4tor]

I like the slight imbalances in factions - if all factions had the same access to the same tricks the game would be stale. 
 

the fact is, there’s probably 10 ways to deal with marker crews of which marker removal is an obvious one - the fact we can’t do that probably means we have 2 or 3 other means to deal with them

[dannydb]

Think kaeris and fire Golem can remove markers with triggers on attacks

 

But it's not common.

[Adran]

55 minutes ago, dannydb said:

Think kaeris and fire Golem can remove markers with triggers on attacks

 

But it's not common.

You're right about Kareris, (Arggh yet another one I miss!)  the Golem is Scheme markers only

[LeperColony]

11 hours ago, Burnin4tor said:

I like the slight imbalances in factions - if all factions had the same access to the same tricks the game would be stale. 
 

the fact is, there’s probably 10 ways to deal with marker crews of which marker removal is an obvious one - the fact we can’t do that probably means we have 2 or 3 other means to deal with them

I very much agree with this position.  Removal is nice, but there are other tools that can be applied depending on the situation.  Recently I played a game as the Viks against Raspy, and Battle Tempo was very effective at managing the risk of ice pillars.

If all the factions had the same abilities, the game would lose a lot of its flavor.

[Alerteddonkey42]

On 9/15/2020 at 6:50 AM, LeperColony said:

I very much agree with this position.  Removal is nice, but there are other tools that can be applied depending on the situation.  Recently I played a game as the Viks against Raspy, and Battle Tempo was very effective at managing the risk of ice pillars.

If all the factions had the same abilities, the game would lose a lot of its flavor.

I don't think it's about every faction having the same abilities. It's more about every faction should have access to tech picks. If a faction can't do anything against a certain master, it makes facing that master (or faction as a whole) more one sided. I like list building being part of the strategy of the game (as opposed to others where you just smash the same list every time) but I don't think it should decide the game. 

[Jesy Blue]

Everyone has an inherent weakness:

• Outcasts are notoriously light on condition removal
• Bayou is known for having few armor penetration options
• Neverborn have little in the way of guns
• Arcanists are hated by Craig Shipman
• Ressers have lower stats overall
• Ten Thunders
• Guild have very few movenent tricks

It balances out across the whole game, so that when everyone is special then no one is special.

[Alerteddonkey42]

5 hours ago, Jesy Blue said:

It balances out across the whole game, so that when everyone is special then no one is special.

Theoretically, it could. However, this assumes that lack of answers to different problems is equivalent across factions (is lack of armor penetration models equivalent to lower stats? Hard to say. Also, ressers have lower DF and WP but higher wounds. So, it's not all stats). This is also complicated by factions that answer everything like 10T (or Arcanists? I get your joke but I'm actually not sure if they lack anything in particular. I don't play them enough). While I agree that every faction shouldn't have equal access to every type of tech, I will also say that access to counter-tech (or lack of access) is not currently balanced across factions. Of course, this leads to the whole topic about whether there is true balance and if we should attempt to strive for it. I guess I'm in the camp that we should always strive for better balance. This all being said, I still believe that Malifaux is a very balanced game (much more so than some others), there is just some noticeable imbalance. 

[Jesy Blue]

You had a whole lot of rebuttal for someone who got the joke.

[Alerteddonkey42]

On 9/16/2020 at 7:26 PM, Jesy Blue said:

You had a whole lot of rebuttal for someone who got the joke.

Lol. I guess I didn't realize your whole post was a joke. Sorry that I had a response? Glad to see you didn't have a rebuttal and we are in agreement though.