Reva Tips vs Colette?

[Speedguyjp]

I declared Reva and got quite the curveball. My regular opponent usually brings kaeris or Mei Feng but surprised me with Colette!

Standard public enemies With take prisoner, vendetta, assassinate, claim, and research mission

never played Colette before but she looks intimidating, like the crew would be hard to tackle. Any advice would be appreciated 

 

[Paddywhack]

The only thing I know about Colette is they give a lot of Distracted and Colette is pretty hard to take out. Assassinate is pretty much a no go. The Duet is still a beast too. 

Some kind of condition removal might be good. Even a Nurse can help get rid of Distracted with Assist (and Wuick Cure) as well as Painkillers. It's very short range though, so hard to position. 

Something that can target WP or ignore armor would be good against the Duet, though that Df7 is ridiculous. Looks like there is a lot of Don't Mind Me in the crew, but your pool is pretty scheme light so that's good. 

Sorry I can't give more specific help - I haven't faced her yet in 3rd. I would guess that Colette will try to take Assassinate on Reva as their crew seems very mobile and killy. 

[Ogid]

I know Colette well, but I have no idea of what Reva does. So I'll focus on Colette.

Definitelly expect the duet, it's a 12 SS model that will only give 2 bounty tokens after you kill him AND both Mannequins; your adversary probably will start the game as 2 coryphees to not give you an easy Vendetta target. To mess with this big boy consider stunned or slow (it makes its replace mechanic very ineficient), wp attacks (Wp 5 duet, 4 Coryphee), lures/displacements (to move away one of the coryphees so they can't dance together again without wasting actions) and Hazardous auras/chip damage.

I'd expect Colette to pick Vendetta and Take Prisioner here; both easy to score thanks to Presto Chango, but depending on her list and how easy to kill Reva is Assassinate is another good option (she can almost guarantee one point just burying Reva the last turn after she activates).

Expect good 6SS models, I'd say minners and Mecharachnids (precise lol) have a good chance to appear, and some of these with SS cache. The Mobile toolkit is another one that fits well, it's insignificant so it won't give points and it's able to buff/heal duet and Mecharachnids. Silent ones (6SS attuned with long range heal/slow) are another one I'd consider in this pool. I don't think you'll see her henchmans in this game (maybe Cassandra as she may copy the healing action from the duet and to tank with Finesse, but she isn't that good in this pool); maybe the rider could show up but this isn't a good pool for it either (maybe for research mission, but it's a long shot).

You'll need some condition removal and/or cheap models able to assisst (careful to not give away points this way), lures/whatever displacement you have can definitelly help you to move the model she presto changed into safety; something to get rid of focused could be good, the duet can get a huge stack of it easily between the Toolkit and the new replacement rules. And whatever you do, don't attack Colette unless you have a very good reason or can deny her defensive trigger! She loves to get the agro away from her crew and that will also give her an easy way to bury and be even more disruptive later with her Showstopper; if she wants to bury, make her use her trigger.

My 2 cents

[Paddywhack]

If you have them or can proxy, this might be a good place for Bone Piles. Numbskull means no Distracted. Same goes for Archie, though I know people don't like him as much post nerf. 

Bone piles can help with condition removal and both are immune to Pyres (for good and bad).

Sadly we don't have any way to attack buried models. 

Judicious user of Blasphemous Ritual can give you enough Focus to counteract Distracted a bit. 

[Vangerdahast]

A bit surprised that your opponent declares Colette in such pool. Strategy and Schemes are not Colette-friendly.

I don't think that you will face a full-Keyword Crew.  Distracted can be a thing but don't think it will there because of OOK hiring (in my opinion).

Don't Mind Me won't be useful for the Crew with such Schemes.

Colette and the Duet will be there but look at Versatile Arcanist models and beaters from other Keywords.

Don't take Assassinate on Colette.

As a Colette player, I would take Take Prisoner and Research Mission (beacause of Pyre Markers, Corpse and Scrap Markers).

 

[Paddywhack]

5 minutes ago, Ogid said:

or can deny her defensive trigger

Ah, if only Crooked Men were Versatile....

[Speedguyjp]

After reading some of thesE cards I’m tempted to bring both Manos (Lantern) and Anna (Gravity Well/Hostile Work Environment)...seems to be good counters despite some juicy public enemies targets

[Ogid]

37 minutes ago, Speedguyjp said:

After reading some of thesE cards I’m tempted to bring both Manos (Lantern) and Anna (Gravity Well/Hostile Work Environment)...seems to be good counters despite some juicy public enemies targets

Those are good models, but both of these are also worth 3 bounty tokens... I'm not totally sold with Anna, she seems tanky and will restrict some Colette options, but it won't stop her main combo: taking one of your models away and putting it near of one of her beaters (probably the Duet); and what is worse, it stops the placement of her own model so she won't have to sacrifice a dove to do that, plus her damage doesn't seems that great; later into the game she may make harder for colette to save a model in her aura, use showstopper near of her or to throw a beater forward tho... I like Manos, but I'm not sure how it'll perform versus mostly Armored +1 and +2 guys.

I don't know if you play with double masters or not, but this is a good pool for that; Kaeris (to turn your pires against you) or Mei Feng could also be in her crew and you may consider some of your own master as options. What about McMourning? He ignores Armor (I'm sure you'll be facing a lot of armor in this match up) and has stat 7 (one of the few that may challenge the duet attacking Df), has also good sustain, can wreck face even stunned and Catalyst is decent ping damage for those Armored guys you'll face.

Jaakuna is a risky one as she can't use SS but it may also be potentially quite good; Vengeance and a Hazardous aura is a lot of pain for high armored models and that Lure may be life saving when one of your models gets kidnapped; plus killing her doesn't seem that easy.

[Vangerdahast]

Agree with Ogid about Anna. She won't stop the kidnapping of one of your models.

And the first model I would kidnap would be Manos. If I was playing this game and if I had a good hand turn one, Manos would be the first model I will use Presto Chango on to place it near my deployment zone and my not yet activated Duet.  Manos won't on his own kill the Duet and prevent the Demise with Lantern of Souls but if the Duet attacks him (only three times with splitting/refroming the Duet because of Extended Reach)  and I have initiative in Turn 2, (cheating if necessary) for two more Duet attacks, Manos won't be automatically dead but you will have used a lot of your Soulstones and Manos will be obliged to come back to his Crew (Leap is good for that). Later in the turn, Colette could perhaps kill him with Sword Trick or Bury him. It depends on how card flips (and cheating) will go but I don't think Manos is a big threat for Colette's Crew. So be cautious when playing him. I don't often face Ressers, so my advice is perhaps not optimal (I don't know all the tricks Ressers have). I can be wrong.

And as you said Anna and Manos are juicy targets for Public Ennemies. But, Anna's Glimpse of the Void Trigger could be useful to hamper an ennemy beater.

I would like to hear how the game went and what Crew your opponent played.

 

[Maniacal_cackle]

I've not played against Colette much, but...

Bete noir may be a worthwhile consideration for a beater. All of Colette's repositioning shenanigans are irrelevant against bete, as she can just bury.

Bone piles also seem solid, since they provide condition removal, scheming, and are a lot of work to kill for a single bounty token. Then you need corpse positioning. Carrion emissary is good for this, but given what others have said I'd lean towards Grave Golem. If they reposition grave golem into melee range of their beaters, that is mostly upside for you. Also consider throwing in a restless spirit or gravedigger as needed.

Be extra careful with Reva, as Reva feels like the top priority target for them to reposition in a bad spot and then nuke. Reva is super squishy, and by the sounds of it Colette just needs to land one reposition to kill her. Consider activating Reva late.

The McMourning suggestion seems super solid above (and consider doing a flesh construct summoning engine to give you more cannon fodder), but if you're not doing double masters I can recommend the list I took to my last game:

• Reva & candles
• Dead Rider (can optionally swap this out for any of the other suggestions)
• Grave golem
• Bete Noire
• Bone Pile
• Shieldbearer
• Restless spirit
• 4 stones

The Dead Rider was there to taxi the Restless spirit up the field, but that doesn't seem as necessary here. So there's other options.

Another thing to consider is a Toshiro build. He is fantastic for stopping assassinate, is solid on claim jump scenarios where he doesn't have to move much, and Ashigaru can Take the Hit for your beaters if colette tries to reposition them. You could perhaps just straight swap Dead Rider for Toshiro in the above build.

[Maniacal_cackle]

As for schremes, I think the ideal scenario is:

• Bete vendettas an enemy beater, so when it comes to take down your crew, she can just unbury and score the points.
• Research mission for easy points with corpse candles.
• Camp the centre with your team (with Reva in a safe position with an ashigaru, attacking through corpses) to deny them claim jump.

Don't forget Bete can bury herself turn 1 with a mask by attacking an ally!

EDIT: Be careful of shockwaves against Bete! Keep her buried as much as possible (and if she gets the first point of Vendetta, you also have the option of leaving her buried until turn five and just using her as a pass token if need be).

[Speedguyjp]

Just a quick closure on this...

We played the game yesterday. Stopped after 3 turns due to time and my kids not leaving us alone lol. After 3 I was up 2-1. Very likely score would have been 2-2 or 3-2 in my favor had the game run its full course.

My list:

Reva +2cc

Manos

Anna

2x Shieldbearer w/ GST

Bone Pile

 

His List:

Colette + 3 doves

Cassandra

2x Coryphee, one with soulstone cache

Silent One

Envy

Miner with Magical Training

 

I went with research mission and vendetta (Shieldbearer on a Coryphee). In hindsight the vendetta target was pretty dumb - should have gone cassandra. I knew he'd combine into the duet but figured I'd be trying to kill it anyways for the bounty until I realized you don't earn bounty if it dies into mannequins. I had it down to 1 wound near manos and anna too...but with a couple weaks and a Black Joker I couldn't finish it off.

It was a pretty cagey game. The only things that died in the first two turns was corpse candles and doves. In turn 3 he killed manos for a nice bounty, but I killed cassandra to equalize and also scored research mission with the bone pile (corpse marker, his scheme marker, pyre marker). Manos and Anna really affected his gameplan as he had to really work to set up presto-chango and his unburying. Other than the flips vs. the Duet mentioned above I did feel like I was flipping out of control good for the game. I spiked 2x 13s against Envy's double positive gatling gun early and had several other critical flips to save models from getting hit or dying (severes on defense, severes to mitigate damage with soulstones, etc.). 

Highlight of the game was end of turn 3 - I had the last activation and with my last shieldbearer AP to put down a scheme marker to enable Reva to unbury (she was hit by sword trick, bad play on my part). I then got unbury with Reva who summoned a corpse candle and then killed Cassandra. The candle was summoned in base contact with a Silent One on 2 wounds. The corpse candle focus attacked and hit a severe damage to kill the silent one, dropping a pyre marker and corpse marker to win me research mission. Went from a draw to 2-1. 

My opponent acknowledged he could have taken a tougher list with Colette but had been wanting to try out a couple different things. He lamented not bringing more beef instead of Envy.

 

 

[Adran]

I may be forgetting something, but from what I remember if you put soul stone cache on a corephyee and it combines you lose the upgrade. 

[Ogid]

Ty for the report! It seems like a close game

25 minutes ago, Speedguyjp said:

Stopped after 3 turns due to time and my kids not leaving us alone lol.

This made me lol, I've been there haha.

 

If you don't mind a few extra questions:

did your oponent tried to kidnap something in turn 1 with Colette? If not, why do you think he decided not to? Did you do something to prevent it like hiding the good targets or covering them with shieldbearers?

 

15 minutes ago, Adran said:

I may be forgetting something, but from what I remember if you put soul stone cache on a corephyee and it combines you lose the upgrade. 

You are right, I was about to also point this out. Only summon upgrades remain after one model is replaced (unless it stated otherwise in the upgrade or the model, but that's not the case)

Upgrades in a Coryphee/Duet are only worth it if you don't plan to use the replace mechanic.

[Speedguyjp]

1 hour ago, Ogid said:

did your oponent tried to kidnap something in turn 1 with Colette? If not, why do you think he decided not to? Did you do something to prevent it like hiding the good targets or covering them with shieldbearers?

 

You are right, I was about to also point this out. Only summon upgrades remain after one model is replaced (unless it stated otherwise in the upgrade or the model, but that's not the case)

Upgrades in a Coryphee/Duet are only worth it if you don't plan to use the replace mechanic.

 

re: the upgrade - Thanks for pointing that out! I have to say working through the replace mechanic did take us about 20 minutes. After having done it it will be faster next time. I'll let him know about the upgrade.

 

So I was defender and basically deployed in a big bubble with the shieldbearers close by the do focus bombs. There was some blocking terrain in the middle of the board that prevented a straight-up push forward by him. He didn't really have a good opportunity/target to presto-chango something away or bury it. He ended up swapping a dove and Envy late in the turn to shoot at Anna but I managed to spike a couple 13s to avoid any damage.