Counterspell and Obligatory Triggers

[GrumpyGrandpa]

Hey guys

Sorry if this has already been asked, but I could find an answer for this wyrd (heh..) situation last week. 

A Bayou Gremlin shoots an Oxfordian Mage within 6 inches of the model.

1. The Bayou Gremlin have to declare triggers.
2. The Oxfordian Mage says models within 6 have to discard a card to declare triggers.

Does this mean the Bayou Gremlin player HAS to discard a card? Or can the player simply ignore the trigger, if they don't wish to discard a card?

[Scoffer]

It has to declare a trigger so it has to discard a card to declare one.

[GrumpyGrandpa]

4 hours ago, Scoffer said:

It has to declare a trigger so it has to discard a card to declare one.

Damn, seems annoying! But thanks for the quick reply  

[santaclaws01]

There's no clear ruling either way, and the arguments going both ways are equally valid. I'd say just work it out with your opponent beforehand.

[solkan]

Part of the supporting evidence for the position that you have to declare the trigger, and do the things necessary to declare the trigger, is the FAQ entry:

Quote

If a Trigger has a Cost, is that Cost required to declare the Trigger?

a) No. Costs aren’t required as a function of declaring a Trigger and are paid at the same time as declaring a Trigger. However, should a Cost not be paid, any effects from that Trigger (and those effects produced as a result of declaring the Trigger) are ignored. As such, if a model is required to declare a Trigger, they must declare the Trigger (if able) and then if it has a Cost the Cost must be paid. Otherwise, the Trigger has no effect.

It seems to me that the consistent position is:

• When you get to the Declare Triggers step, you have to declare the trigger for the suit you have currently in the duel total.  And you have to try to pay the cost of the trigger, and any "must do ____ to declare triggers" effects.

For the actions that don't have all of the suits covered (like Tusks on the Blood Hunter), if you don't have a matching trigger at that step, there's no obligation to do anything.

 

[Clement]

2 hours ago, santaclaws01 said:

There's no clear ruling either way, and the arguments going both ways are equally valid. I'd say just work it out with your opponent beforehand.

I get the argument for being forced to discard the card so that you can declare the trigger.   What's the argument the other way though?

[santaclaws01]

3 minutes ago, Clement said:

I get the argument for being forced to discard the card so that you can declare the trigger.   What's the argument the other way though?

Counterspell is a a restriction put on being able to declare a trigger, so if no card is discarded at the time you declare triggers you aren't able to declare triggers as far as the action is concerned.