Fae T-Rex

[Ogid]

15 hours ago, Igpus said:

Unfortunately, even if the Malisaurus Rex has the beast key word, Marcus won't be able to take it.  Looking at the box it's faction is The Explorer's Society only, not Explorer's/Neverborn. 

As Santa said you can still play with out of faction beasts hiring him as a secondary master. It's also legit with Zoraida, there are good bayou beasts in that keyword and 2 of them are also henchmans. But before trying it mind the GG1 changes tho, he has lost a lot of power; for a casual match sure, go for him.

12 hours ago, Maniacal_cackle said:

Just to make sure, people aren't reading this as Fae T-Rex, right?

As it's a "Malisaurus" it'd be an M-Rex

[santaclaws01]

9 hours ago, Ogid said:

As Santa said you can still play with out of faction beasts hiring him as a secondary master. It's also legit with Zoraida, there are good bayou beasts in that keyword and 2 of them are also henchmans. But before trying it mind the GG1 changes tho, he has lost a lot of power; for a casual match sure, go for him.

As it's a "Malisaurus" it'd be an M-Rex

Yeah it'd be a fame rex, master of celebrities.

[Da Git]

On 3/23/2020 at 5:25 AM, santaclaws01 said:

Yeah it'd be a fame rex, master of celebrities.

That should be "King" of celebrities! 

[HomelessOne]

Just a quick bump for those that don't look in the Explorer's Society forum:

 

[Nagi21]

13 hours ago, HomelessOne said:

Just a quick bump for those that don't look in the Explorer's Society forum:

 

#BigAndUselessinFae

[Maniacal_cackle]

40 minutes ago, Nagi21 said:

#BigAndUselessinFae

Out of curiousity, why do you say that? It isn't hindered by Fae terrain, and it gives one more option for ruthless to the crew. Those two things alone seem like pretty big factors.

EDIT: Not to mention the sequence of rougarou pushes malisaurus and moves forward, malisaurus activates and pushes rougarou forward and then has two AP to spare is pretty efficient movement up the board.

EDIT2: Plus early game he can lashing tendrils your models up the board, and then late game he can give your models + crows (for into thorns all over the place), and it gives him a built in rampage.

Overall seems pretty promising. Decent movement for itself, movement tricks for others, tons of combat-relevant stuff front of card, provides buffs to the crew, etc. It is a bit squishy, though.

[Ogid]

I don't think he is useless; he doesn't look super amazing either, just a correct model. Which is a good thing btw, powercreep is one of the fastest way to kill a game as small as this one.

I think Nagi is thinking in Titania alpha strike lists where this big boy doesn't seem to fit that well; in those Rougarous are way better to both push her the first turn (12'' vs 4'') and as ancient pact holders, Killjoy adds 5 ping damage in total to her 2 back to back activation with his upgrade and other support models like BBS or Serena will add some healing or more punch in the form of Focused that is what Titania needs to both hit hard enough the first 2 activations and recover well after it, the extra SS for not paying 10SS for the dino will also be very handy for her as she will be using a lot of them to buy triggers and reduce damage.

It has some good perks tho (some of them not that common): Ruthless is scarce in this faction, that's not something to overlook; ignoring Hazardous is also quite good for some match ups and combined with his 2 pushes it might work well in a list around ping damage with Killjoy, Rider and/or the Emissary (just not so alpha strike focused), that crow suit aura is good to enable models like Knights or Waldgeists (and even Titania, it just doesn't have the mobility to reliabily get to the target she usually want to hit the first turn in alpha strike lists); with a 12 Gorar may bring it back (with only 7Wds tho) and this is the only model in the game with a potential 3'' engagement range and staggered has some synergy with Puppets.

It needs some testing to see how useful he really is, but it doesn't look bad.

[Saduhem]

I think Titania assassination runs are exactly where you'd want this guy. Push Titania/Knight/Aeslin turn 1.

Turn 2+ Charge in and give auto Into to Thorns to everyone who's targeting the poor victim.

[santaclaws01]

13 hours ago, Nagi21 said:

#BigAndUselessinFae

No, he's not. Firstly, it's ruthless which Neverborn desperately need. Secondly, Wild Hunt giving built in into Thorns alone would make the model useful, but it's also backed up by 12 health, hard to wound, and terrifying 12(not a thing that gets teched for in fae), and a min 3 attack with either self healing or built in rampage.

[Maniacal_cackle]

40 minutes ago, santaclaws01 said:

No, he's not. Firstly, it's ruthless which Neverborn desperately need. Secondly, Wild Hunt giving built in into Thorns alone would make the model useful, but it's also backed up by 12 health, hard to wound, and terrifying 12(not a thing that gets teched for in fae), and a min 3 attack with either self healing or built in rampage.

Apparently they even said Wild Hunt giving crows was specifically to increase synergy with Fae.

[Nagi21]

On 8/3/2020 at 1:50 AM, Maniacal_cackle said:

Out of curiousity, why do you say that? It isn't hindered by Fae terrain, and it gives one more option for ruthless to the crew. Those two things alone seem like pretty big factors.

EDIT: Not to mention the sequence of rougarou pushes malisaurus and moves forward, malisaurus activates and pushes rougarou forward and then has two AP to spare is pretty efficient movement up the board.

EDIT2: Plus early game he can lashing tendrils your models up the board, and then late game he can give your models + crows (for into thorns all over the place), and it gives him a built in rampage.

Overall seems pretty promising. Decent movement for itself, movement tricks for others, tons of combat-relevant stuff front of card, provides buffs to the crew, etc. It is a bit squishy, though.

My biggest issues now are the same as then.  Fae has two 10 stone options already in Emissary and Killjoy, with a ruthless option for 1 stone more in the rider.  How does this remotely look better than any of those options?  KJ is a much better alphastrike options, particularly if you're going to use Titania as part of that since she gets the Blood Sacrifice options.  Emissary is much better in the long game when he's able to setup, with fantastic synergy with terrain.

If the Rex was the only option in Fae for either of those things, then it'd be a borderline okay model, but it's just outclassed in its own weight class.

[santaclaws01]

5 hours ago, Nagi21 said:

KJ is a much better alphastrike options,

The slower model, non-unimpeded, can't ignore models while moving, and can't move up a model in your crew, is a better alpha striker? Doubtful. Especially if you're against Thunders or Ressers where Lantern of Souls is readily available.

5 hours ago, Nagi21 said:

Emissary is much better in the long game when he's able to setup, with fantastic synergy with terrain.

Take both. It's good enough for any other combination of Emissary, KIlljoy and the Rider, only now we have a beater option that doesn't have to worry about the hazardous terrain that the Emissary makes, or the hazardous of any enemy crews(aside from Kaeris)

5 hours ago, Nagi21 said:

then it'd be a borderline okay model,

What world do you live in where terrifying 12, a 3/4/6 damage track, predatory instincts, 12 health, self healing, a potential extra attack or guaranteeing Into Thorns+built in Rampage for extra damage and positioning, the option to be immune to be immune to enemy movement and burying, is all just "borderline okay".

6 hours ago, Nagi21 said:

but it's just outclassed in its own weight class.

It's not.

[Nagi21]

3 hours ago, santaclaws01 said:

The slower model, non-unimpeded, can't ignore models while moving, and can't move up a model in your crew, is a better alpha striker? Doubtful. Especially if you're against Thunders or Ressers where Lantern of Souls is readily available.

Ignores underbrush which is the only important part of why unimpeded is needed in Fae.  Both Rex and KJ are gonna need a dog to push them up as well.  Also has Flurry and Onslaught.  Rex does not.

3 hours ago, santaclaws01 said:

Take both. It's good enough for any other combination of Emissary, KIlljoy and the Rider, only now we have a beater option that doesn't have to worry about the hazardous terrain that the Emissary makes, or the hazardous of any enemy crews(aside from Kaeris)

A stat 6, 3/4/5 with a bonus action trigger to get two attacks is the bare minimum beater, and there's a better option in KJ for that.

3 hours ago, santaclaws01 said:

What world do you live in where terrifying 12, a 3/4/6 damage track, predatory instincts, 12 health, self healing, a potential extra attack or guaranteeing Into Thorns+built in Rampage for extra damage and positioning, the option to be immune to be immune to enemy movement and burying, is all just "borderline okay".

3/4/5, not 6.  Df 4 is also not so hot even with 12 wds as we see with Rougarou in Fae constantly.

4 hours ago, santaclaws01 said:

It's not.

It is.

[Adran]

4 hours ago, santaclaws01 said:

 

What world do you live in where terrifying 12, a 3/4/6 damage track, predatory instincts, 12 health, self healing, a potential extra attack or guaranteeing Into Thorns+built in Rampage for extra damage and positioning, the option to be immune to be immune to enemy movement and burying, is all just "borderline okay".

 

Probably one where terrifying11, a 3/4/6 damage track with the possibility of 4 attacks, 10 health a don't die demise with built-in healing is also an option.

I don't think that rex is bad in fae, or outclassed, but if you already own killjoy then it does different stuff, but not so significantly that everyone wants both. 

[santaclaws01]

1 minute ago, Nagi21 said:

Ignores underbrush which is the only important part of why unimpeded is needed in Fae.  

Except severe terrain exists in this game outside of the underbrush markers, and Titania generally does better on maps with more severe terrain on them because she can bottleneck enemies more and it gives the Emissary more space to abuse Roots From below.

3 minutes ago, Nagi21 said:

  Both Rex and KJ are gonna need a dog to push them up as well. 

So how does that make one better than the other?

3 minutes ago, Nagi21 said:

Also has Flurry and Onslaught.  Rex does not.

Killjoy doesn't have Flurry, but yes he does have Onslaught, and the Rex has either Rip and Tear if he wants to use it on an enemy, or can put up his free crows aura for extra damage for himself and the rest of the crew, both giving you the free damage that another attack would give as well as saving cards and soulstones that would otherwise be spent on getting said trigger.

5 minutes ago, Nagi21 said:

A stat 6, 3/4/5 with a bonus action trigger to get two attacks is the bare minimum beater, and there's a better option in KJ for that.

Yeah, I was wrong about the severe damage. Rest of that I just covered.

6 minutes ago, Nagi21 said:

Df 4 is also not so hot even with 12 wds as we see with Rougarou in Fae constantly.

It is when it's backed by a terrifying 12, that gets better when enemies are injured. Also, not sure why you're knocking 4 df when it's the exact same Df killjoy has, but 2 less wounds, 1 less terrifying. The only reason Killjoy is considered is because of his demise, but that requires you to either hire a cheap tax model to not kill an autumn knight for him or you put it on the gorar which removes your Emissary/Rider safety net and Killjoy isn't even going to be in a position to be useful because if the Gorar was close enough for that it'd have already been killed, or it's late enough in the game that it won't really matter.

13 minutes ago, Nagi21 said:

It is.

No, it's really not.

[santaclaws01]

1 minute ago, Adran said:

Probably one where terrifying11, a 3/4/6 damage track with the possibility of 4 attacks, 10 health a don't die demise with built-in healing is also an option.

I don't think that rex is bad in fae, or outclassed, but if you already own killjoy then it does different stuff, but not so significantly that everyone wants both. 

Except he was saying that would make it borderline okay if Killjoy, The Rider and the Emissary all didn't exist.

[Maniacal_cackle]

Have you tested it out yet? As theory is great, but you really need to see a model on the table.

Also good to note that your average crew speed is much higher with the Rex than Killjoy. KJ contributes 10 inches of movement to your crew, while Rex contributes 16+.

[Maniacal_cackle]

For example, consider this line of play later in the game:

Charge 7", rampage another 5 inches (hitting an ally if you can't otherwise force the suit), tendril an enemy off a symbol of authority and claiming it.

Niche plays like that can win games. It is just seems like a solidly flexible model at every stage of the game. I'm having trouble thinking of a stage of the game where it doesn't have something to contribute (unlike my grave golem which can easily become wholly irrelevant if misplayed).

Edit: and of course note that if you don't need to tendril, wild hunt can make his rampage built in... This guy is where he wants to be throughout the game.

Edit2: and if you do need to tendril, he can have a positive flip built in!

[Da Git]

I think that's the difference between the Rex and Killjoy; flexibility vs pure beat-stick-ness(TM!). I think I prefer the flexibility of the Rex. She can move your own models (especially that size 3 Emissary that the Rider can't move) or can move enemy models through 2 different actions (one of which being a bonus).  She can give out Staggered, to make the Emissary's attack shine (or vice-versa).

I didn't like her at first, but she has grown on me as I've used her a couple of times. I think she's a pretty good all-round model.

Clever girl!

I think I'll be using her in conjunction with the rider and Emissary + 2 other models (Aeslin, Rougarou, Knight or Adze)

[Maniacal_cackle]

@Da Git, have you tried Rex with Killjoy yet?

The most frequent criticism of KJ I hear is lack of mobility, which Rex does a lot to address (40% mobility boost for the turn!). With a rougarou you could even alpha strike with Killjoy if you wanted.

EDIT: Like I'd love to try out a list like Rex, KJ, rougarou with ancient pact x2, 10 stones for whatever. Plenty of cards, massive initiative, tons of killing power anywhere you need to be on the board.

[Da Git]

@Maniacal_cackle I have twice. First game she did well, won me the game as a 10ss scheme runner and got use of tendrils to push models (both sides) around.

The second game he failed, but I was outplayed and was the wrong opposing crew to bring her in, so not her fault

[Ogid]

I agree that's the best way to see if he is really worth its salt, trying it.

While it's true there is some overlap between what the dino the other 10SS options do; it's also true he brings different things to the crew and they could complement each other well. I don't know how well he may compete with the other two, but having more options definitelly don't hurt.

He got some damage but he isn't a pure beatstick, that's clear; I think Killjoy or the Rider beat him there. But he also got some utility and that's the selling point for me; that aura is really good, specially in a crew with pushes and a trigger that displace an enemy and may put it into it so other models may hammer it down. Staggered go quite well with the Emissary, giving him easier targets and staggered plus Fae's severe terrain may be crippling for a model that cannot just fly/incorporeal away. The ammount of pushes he has are good for both positioning and doubling in the ping damage strategy (and even built in Rampage is already ping damage)

More utility: It is a model with a trigger that let it not being moved and buried; having corrupted ley lines in the pool that's quite hot as only an obey crew can move him away from a marker if he is the bearer (and he has a few movement tricks to mess with the enemy one)... I don't think we have much of that in the faction (maybe Marcus with his bears is the closest thing, but Marcus isn't nearly as good as Titania is). Also 3'' of engagement range can let him control 2'' range models that aren't used to being outranged (and again, in a crew with a lot of into thorns triggers, so I woulnd't rule out putting a few of them there if things go really well) and being able to charge through other models is quite convenient in my experience.

IDK, I'll give it a chance.

[FrostHunter]

I would point that on right table he might be fun with Waldgeist(s?) - MR grants them slow trigger which imho is great trigger, but it required high crow card reserved for better models.

[Maniacal_cackle]

9 hours ago, FrostHunter said:

I would point that on right table he might be fun with Waldgeist(s?) - MR grants them slow trigger which imho is great trigger, but it required high crow card reserved for better models.

That's a pretty brutal combo, considering how far the Waldgeist can reach! Our forests on our tables are often 4-5" ideally (and sometimes bigger), so the threat range on the Waldgeist pulling that off is pretty intimidating.

[Ogid]

4 hours ago, Maniacal_cackle said:

That's a pretty brutal combo, considering how far the Waldgeist can reach! Our forests on our tables are often 4-5" ideally (and sometimes bigger), so the threat range on the Waldgeist pulling that off is pretty intimidating.

Even without big forests the range is actually good for their 4 Mv stat! with Ambush their reach is 8'' or 7''+underbrush diameter in the best case; having Planted Roots they do like to stay in forest/underbrushes so it probably don't even cost a card.

Also a cute trick of these boys is littering the map with underbrushes while moving up the board: Germinate, put the underbrush in contact with it in the direction the Waldgeist is going and then ambush for free (which also creates a dangerous area for enemy models thanks to the underbrush), in fact they may ambush twice the same underbrush if done right (ambush being the last movement of its activation). It's actually very easy to be inside of an underbrush with them when they are played like this.