Youko Hamasaki - Tactics and Strategies

[Cursed25]

40 minutes ago, touchdown said:

 

In Von Schill's Load Up, his My Loyal Servant trigger says "another model" followed by "other than this model". Why would it need that if another model already means that?

for VOn Schill the (other than this model) is there to prevent you form choosing Von Schill as the target for the heal!

 

so you choose a target with load up

after that with my loyal servant you have to choose another model from the target (not that clear with the new FAQ problem) and this other model can't be Von Schill because every ''this'' on the card refers to the model using the ability

[touchdown]

@Cursed25 the FAQ says that "anther model" refers to the model taking the action, not the target of the action. So both clauses mean the same thing and the target of Load Up is a valid target for My Loyal Servant

[Ogid]

1 hour ago, Kharnage said:

I feel that it's obvious that the ruling on Enraged by Insolence was a ham-fisted attempt at nerfing Nekima by not letting Nekima herself get free swings, and their blanket "another means not the acting model" interpretation has backfired immensely. Obviously Enraged by Insolence meant another nephilim that isn't the one dying, My Loyal Servant and Ricochet being great examples of how they clearly originally defined "another".

It does seems like it... It'd had been much better just errata her if that was such a big deal than this. But now that's more or less clear maybe it's better if we treat that FAQ as an errata just for Nekima and keep reading "Another" like before; the alternative is a can of worms.

Well... maybe the conspiracy theory was right and LVO did attract some attention after all XD. On the bright side, at least you are working on getting Schtook nerfed now instead of another NVB master 

 

Also FWIW, around September there was a discusion about that ability in the NVB forum were the meaning of "Another" was discussed.

[Kharnage]

9 minutes ago, Ogid said:

Also FWIW, around September there was a discusion about that ability in the NVB forum were the meaning of "Another" was discussed.

Yuh, I was there. I of course, foolishly stated that My Loyal Servant was a precedent for why "another" is "other than the model we were just talking about" rather than "other than the acting model."
But with
"No. “Another” always refers to “not the model from which this text is written” except in those instances where the model in which “Another” is written would not always be a legal subject of the sentence, such as “Another Scrap Marker”, or “Another enemy model”. In such cases, “Another” will never refer to the previous legal subject."

It's not just "could go either way" interpretable, they cleanly shot their own foot off. It wasn't "another, in this instance, means not Nekima" it was "another ALWAYS refers to". So, enjoy your double-ricochet damage flips while you can! 

[Ogid]

2 minutes ago, Kharnage said:

It's not just "could go either way" interpretable, they cleanly shot their own foot off. It wasn't "another in this instance means not Nekima" it was "another ALWAYS refers to". So, enjoy your double-ricochet damage flips while you can! 

[Cursed25]

8 hours ago, touchdown said:

@Cursed25 the FAQ says that "anther model" refers to the model taking the action, not the target of the action. So both clauses mean the same thing and the target of Load Up is a valid target for My Loyal Servant

I'm pretty sure they will retcon fast their mistake in the FAQ which confused more than helped ahah!

 

the fact they specified (other than this model) in the Von Schill card clearly means that there intention for ''another model'' is from the point of view of the target not the model doing the ability. And as others have found ricochet trigger is now way more powerful than it should be! I won't use the new another model FAQ rule because it's counter-intuitive and is not RAI in my opinion! I know it's RAW for now but I hope they will change it soon.

[Mithrandir]

Re-reading this thread again, I noticed a couple of things that you didn't talk about:

- How about second masters with Youko? E.g. Akami (+1 hand size, gets summons).
- And the Effigy/Emissary/Effissary? Are they worth it?

[Ogid]

29 minutes ago, Mithrandir said:

Re-reading this thread again, I noticed a couple of things that you didn't talk about:

- How about second masters with Youko? E.g. Akami (+1 hand size, gets summons).
- And the Effigy/Emissary/Effissary? Are they worth it?

There is an "old" thread were some of these were adressed

https://themostexcellentandawesomeforumever-wyrd.com/topic/147016-youku-advice/

[Jude]

Has anyone tried Yamaziko? She might be a bit pricey for what she does but depending on the strats and schemes she might be useful but I like the idea of putting more pressure on their hand.

I haven't played any Youko yet but she's definitely a master I'm interested in.

[Jesy Blue]

I did in the Beta... unless the opponent is a card drawing fiend, like Zoraida, Molly, or Jack Daw, there's enough in keyword discard to take care of the hand.  Honestly,  by the time you got around to her, they wouldn't have a hand left anyway.  Also, the pass token generating trigger doesn't work outside of Last Blossom.

Granted, in those type of card draw keywords, yes she is helpful because 1. Another Wp dual around your Distraction models.  2. Slow playing the schemes to counter your Leverage is now more punishing... damed if you do, damed if you don't. 3. Buffing the already stellar minions' Lures before needing to use Leverage is pretty freaking funny!

I typically stick with 1 out of keyword model max (I love leaming into Leverage) and I'm currently high on Mr Tannen, but I can see a given situation occasionally swapping the teacher in.

[Wakefield]

I don't like running her as a Bubble but after seeing Tannen in Lynch I can definitely see using the two of them and Bill as a mobile central command station for the rest of the crew.

Honestly, I'm with you, Jesy, on mostly staying in keyword. Dawn Serpent or Samurai to taste is what I've found works best depending on what my opponent declared.

[korgal]

On 3/6/2020 at 6:47 AM, Wakefield said:

So no bonuses unless you carry them over between turns

This is not true. We can not keep pass tokens between rounds because they are discarded jute after the initiative flip.
We agree ?

[Adran]

5 minutes ago, korgal said:

This is not true. We can not keep pass tokens between rounds because they are discarded jute after the initiative flip.
We agree ?

If you read the whole of that section Wakefield is talking about how leverage earns pass tokens at the start of the turn but after the initiative flip, so they won't give you a bonus to initiative unless you carry them over to the next turn ( when they will then be discarded before you earn new ones).

[korgal]

Thank a lot ! You're so quick ! ^^

[santaclaws01]

Also a note: Youko can use Information network on riddles in the dark to give distracted +2 even if both crews have a full(6 vs 5) hand, as the you don't have to discard down to the max until after resolving the action.

[Pbradbury]

Do you have any updated thoughts after the April 21 errata?

[Assdex]

On 7/25/2021 at 4:33 PM, Pbradbury said:

Do you have any updated thoughts after the April 21 errata?

She is become better , but still hard to play her , a lot depends from position.

She is good for drain opp hand , but its not enough to win u need manage how deal with it. 

I think its really great work with misaki as a second master.

[Wakefield]

Once I have more games in with Newko I will update the forum post with thoughts. 

Initial experiences:

Always go for Crow on Riddles if possible. Quick Reflexes is also good, very good if there are multiple threats coming in, but stoning for Crow gives a lot of pressure.

We Own You is solid, but it always takes 2 AP on a model that has no distracted on it and setting up for distracted later is a pain.

It is almost always more AP efficient to hit models that are currently focused to remove it and potentially add one distracted than it is to load up targets with distracted first because an ally can just end the condition or Assist and burn an AP to remove distracted. If your  opponent does not have any forms of instant condition removal, this can still be a good way to burn AP from models that want to be doing something else.

Queen's Gambit is one of the best things on her card, but it requires a stone or a mask on an opposed duel with the enemy, spend it wisely.

I used to take 7 stones with her, I still feel that's an accurate number.

Oh, and her melee attack is just a flat upgrade. And it's still never going to be used.

Additionally, she is far better as a second Master now, particularly in crews with Executes such as Misaki.

[Assdex]

On 7/29/2021 at 7:34 PM, Wakefield said:

Once I have more games in with Newko I will update the forum post with thoughts. 

Initial experiences:

Always go for Crow on Riddles if possible. Quick Reflexes is also good, very good if there are multiple threats coming in, but stoning for Crow gives a lot of pressure.

We Own You is solid, but it always takes 2 AP on a model that has no distracted on it and setting up for distracted later is a pain.

It is almost always more AP efficient to hit models that are currently focused to remove it and potentially add one distracted than it is to load up targets with distracted first because an ally can just end the condition or Assist and burn an AP to remove distracted. If your  opponent does not have any forms of instant condition removal, this can still be a good way to burn AP from models that want to be doing something else.

Queen's Gambit is one of the best things on her card, but it requires a stone or a mask on an opposed duel with the enemy, spend it wisely.

I used to take 7 stones with her, I still feel that's an accurate number.

Oh, and her melee attack is just a flat upgrade. And it's still never going to be used.

Additionally, she is far better as a second Master now, particularly in crews with Executes such as Misaki.

If u can good setup for we own u . It cast u 2 ap but u can make 2 attacks for hina from it and easy kill some stuff cuz u flip all cards

[Wakefield]

Updated the list, going to be working on this more over the next few days, but the basic information is more updated.