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Bort

Hoffman ... in Guild

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I started playing Malifaux as an invited opponent during Closed Beta.

I liked Hoffman's fluff, so my first game was with him.  From there I playtested and gave comments / batreps on quite a few of the Guild masters during the closed Beta. With the occasional Hoffman game inbetween, him still being my favourite master.  (Not claiming I'm an expert or anything.  More pointing out that every single Beta game I played was with Guild)

Then life got in the way and I kinda lost track of Malifaux.

Then a Hoffman crew ended up in my hands (due to said opponent's generosity)

 

Now I have one challenge to you Guild players.

Give me a reason to stay with Guild.  I find that playing Hoffman with Arcanists simply opens up way more options than Guild. 

 

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If you play guild, you will be on the good side if a nerf appears. 🙂

Seriously, Phiona, is an excellent model in guild. She can be your target for the non armour ignoring and take the hit for constructs on armour piercing attack. her bring allows her to move Hoffman on the board and attack her with a heal.
Otherwise, the construcs available on arcanist are better, and their upgrades are way better than ours.

If you plan on playing multiple boss, you should also check if you prefer the arcanists or the guilds as secondary boss.

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It depends on what you want. Arcanist has more constructs than Guild (and some are top notch and versatile like swarms and miners) and very good upgrades; even the rider, Crossroad and the emissary are constructs, they have other entire keyword with a heavy construct theme (Foundry) and their summoner (summoners if you play with DMH) may summon constructs, Arcanist supports very well Hoffman's theme. If you only want to play Hoffman and stay in his construct theme, then Arcanist will offer you more flexibility to use that master in every posible scenario with only a few extra purchases from versatiles/OOK and on top of that some constructs are the best models from that faction and Arcanist have a very strongh upgrade pool (Diesel with charge through and concealment is so good for this crew; Magical Training in any minion is very good or SS cache also for minions/enforcers)

If you stand by Hoffman Guild is because you also want to play other masters of the faction or you like more this faction's tools. In Guild there are a few good in theme OOK models, like Phiona or Pathfinder summoning traps (they get Power from Hoffman that can be later transfered to other models and are annoying), but not as many options or as good as in Archanist. LLC is very good in the living models of the crew and No prisioners may be good in some minions (better for kitting than diesel but worse for direct combat). Expert Marksman in Melisa will give her Gatling an Armor Piercing trigger (Hoffman has Analyze Weakness but he has to be in range and it costs AP).

Outside of the construct theme there are a few interesting perks in Guild: the Pale Rider is the most powerful rider by far, the steward is a very good support that double the support the toolkit offers and Guild has some Obey shenanigans and Mimic (Agent 46 is bonkers) that may be used to funnel order through a few powerful models, Guild have some powerful and independent masters to use as double masters and it'd be wroth testing Lucius as a second master for him. Other models worth to look at are Layers (very reliable long range shielding, plus obyes), Exorcists/lone Marshal (no Exorcism trigger in Arcanist) and Domador the Cadaveres (healer for living models with no TN and obeys for undeads like the rider or enemies that wander too close).

 

The TLDR would be: If you want to have an small collection of models and play only Hoffman, then probably Arcanist is the best option for you. If you like Guild as faction more than Arcanist, want to expand your collection to other masters and like lists with outside of theme models, go for Guild.

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3 hours ago, Bort said:

I started playing Malifaux as an invited opponent during Closed Beta.

I liked Hoffman's fluff, so my first game was with him.  From there I playtested and gave comments / batreps on quite a few of the Guild masters during the closed Beta. With the occasional Hoffman game inbetween, him still being my favourite master.  (Not claiming I'm an expert or anything.  More pointing out that every single Beta game I played was with Guild)

Then life got in the way and I kinda lost track of Malifaux.

Then a Hoffman crew ended up in my hands (due to said opponent's generosity)

 

Now I have one challenge to you Guild players.

Give me a reason to stay with Guild.  I find that playing Hoffman with Arcanists simply opens up way more options than Guild. 

 

If you just want to play Hoff and you are playing for strength, you shouldn't.  Ssm and swarms are stupid good.  Magical training and deisel engine are both better than any of our upgrades.

 

But if you are playing for fluff, you can stay on the right side of the law this way.  

Also, armor 2 on Howard and Joss are cool.

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2 hours ago, 4thstringer said:

If you just want to play Hoff and you are playing for strength, you shouldn't.  Ssm and swarms are stupid good.  Magical training and deisel engine are both better than any of our upgrades.

 

But if you are playing for fluff, you can stay on the right side of the law this way.  

Also, armor 2 on Howard and Joss are cool.

I mean, if you’re playing for fluff then what is legal isn’t always right, and the Arcanists are the ones looking out for the little guy through unions, creativity, and allowing the exploration of individuality through magic. 

I got into Guild because it’s dripping with theme: steampunk nobility, giant constructs, multiple frontier crews, and those zany journalists (who in my head canon are more Lois Lane than party line propagandists!). Then I learned that they’re basically the nationalist party of Malifaux, but at this point I’m committed because I like a good fight and if I’m learning the game I might as well do it wearing training weights, so once I decide to branch out I really know what I want to do to play on “easy mode.”

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1 minute ago, Yore Huckleberry said:

I mean, if you’re playing for fluff then what is legal isn’t always right, and the Arcanists are the ones looking out for the little guy through unions, creativity, and allowing the exploration of individuality through magic. 

I got into Guild because it’s dripping with theme: steampunk nobility, giant constructs, multiple frontier crews, and those zany journalists (who in my head canon are more Lois Lane than party line propagandists!). Then I learned that they’re basically the nationalist party of Malifaux, but at this point I’m committed because I like a good fight and if I’m learning the game I might as well do it wearing training weights, so once I decide to branch out I really know what I want to do to play on “easy mode.”

What legal isn't always right is definitely truth both in malifaux in real life.  But especially if you are going to focus on Hoffman, Perdita, Basse, or LJ, you can at least comfort yourself in believing that those themes are trying to protect people from actual monsters.

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2 hours ago, eddy said:

Reasons to play guild:

-Pale Rider

-You can say you are giving enemy handicap

- You Like to play with the bad guys. 

 

2 hours ago, Yore Huckleberry said:

who in my head canon are more Lois Lane than party line propagandists

Sorry for your head, but no. Nellie lies purposely about the Arcanists and the Guild, even to her supposedly friend Fionna Cage, who thinks her accident was fault of the Arcanists because Nellie lied her when really was fault of the Guild. 

I think is one of the characters I hate the most (along Sonia and Marcus) 

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As far as I remember there is no anti-forced-movement tech in Arcanist constructs that is as useful as Laugh Off from Lead-Lined Coat. The traditional bane of a Hoffball was getting it dispersed by forced move effects. That hasn’t been the case as much this edition in my meta (except for telling a Shove Aside trigger to shove it) but it’s still nice to have...just really expensive.

Phiona is special because her strengths run counter to stompybot weaknesses: good raw defensive stats and high wound count. Agent 46 is special because mimic is flexible.

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19 minutes ago, thatlatinspeakingguy said:

what's wrong with him? I am not following the fluff, but you made me curious.

I hate him because I played a lot versus him and he looked so OP when compared to Von Schill... 

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27 minutes ago, le_wahou said:

You can say this from any faction. Except maybe, really mayyyyyyyyybe, for Tony

Molly and Reva are IMHO the goodest masters in Malifaux (maybe now with Basse, as long as he keep his theme) 

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3 minutes ago, Zebo said:

Molly and Reva are IMHO the goodest masters in Malifaux (maybe now with Basse, as long as he keep his theme) 

Reva mind controls her followers, gets them to kill themselves, then resurrects  them as her thralls... 

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35 minutes ago, le_wahou said:

You can say this from any faction. Except maybe, really mayyyyyyyyybe, for Tony

From a very general point of view Neverborn would be the "good" guys (Guess which is my faction? :P). In the sense of having the masters trying to save the entire world from Tyrants instead of unleashing them out of pure greed or ignorance (but funnily enough they also have their own share of tyrants). One may disagree with the means, but not with the end. All the human factions are too busy playing their own petty power games.

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24 minutes ago, Ogid said:

In the sense of having the masters trying to save the entire world from Tyrants instead of unleashing them out of pure greed or ignorance

That was the intention of Von Schill when he released Titania.

I've always considered Neverborn as the conservative folks of a land that want to expel the immigration. 

 

Hmmm Von Schill, hero of Malifaux and doom of Tyrants... 

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29 minutes ago, Ogid said:

From a very general point of view Neverborn would be the "good" guys (Guess which is my faction? :P). In the sense of having the masters trying to save the entire world from Tyrants instead of unleashing them out of pure greed or ignorance (but funnily enough they also have their own share of tyrants). One may disagree with the means, but not with the end. All the human factions are too busy playing their own petty power games.

Titania is a Tyrant. Nekima,  Marcus, and Euripides all serve Titania. Dreamer is a Tyrant. 

Pandora and Zoraida are your only legs to stand on in that regard, and Pandora runs around the streets torturing random people to death because she thinks its fun. Zoraida is a human.

I dont think you are the good guys. 

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35 minutes ago, Zebo said:

I've always considered Neverborn as the conservative folks of a land that want to expel the immigration. 

If I'm not mistaken Lilith stood by Humans at first; until they tried started to mess with tyrants. No wonder the natives wants them out of their lawn...

31 minutes ago, Mycellanious said:

Titania is a Tyrant. Nekima,  Marcus, and Euripides all serve Titania. Dreamer is a Tyrant. 

Pandora and Zoraida are your only legs to stand on in that regard, and Pandora runs around the streets torturing random people to death because she thinks its fun. Zoraida is a human.

I dont think you are the good guys.

Details without importance :D

Man, NVB really needs a Nellie washing its image... NVB's "Nellie" version of the above would be like this:

Quote

Titania, Pandora and Zoraida are standing for both NVB natives and the humanity at once, bravely supported by Nekima, Marcus and Euripides. 

Pandora, aside for saving the world, goes beyond his duty and patrol the cities punishing people who totally deserves it. The existence of Dreamer are rumors from Arcanists to undermine our duty.

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51 minutes ago, le_wahou said:

You know, I do not want to be the oppressive power (well, maybe a little), but we are way out of topic here 🙂

How like a Guildie to enforce the rules when its convenient for them. ;)

 Let us be free!

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Got some interesting answers thanks.

Was more a sentimental view on wanting to stay with Guild.  But as my only master I guess I'll be declaring Arcanist mostly, unless I want to do something very specific.

Mostly thanks to Melissa I have an unhealthy liking towards Run&Gun.  So "No Prisoners" upgrade will probably pull me towards an occasional Guild game.  :) 

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15 hours ago, Gnomezilla said:

As far as I remember there is no anti-forced-movement tech in Arcanist constructs that is as useful as Laugh Off from Lead-Lined Coat. The traditional bane of a Hoffball was getting it dispersed by forced move effects. That hasn’t been the case as much this edition in my meta (except for telling a Shove Aside trigger to shove it) but it’s still nice to have...just really expensive.

Phiona is special because her strengths run counter to stompybot weaknesses: good raw defensive stats and high wound count. Agent 46 is special because mimic is flexible.

Is LLC that useful for Guild Hoff?  Only* Hoff, Joss, Howard, and the Steamfitters can take it, and Joss and Howard are pretty much self-sufficient from Turn 2 onwards so don't rely on the Hoffball quite the same.

 

 

*And Ryle, but he's DMH so doesn't count!

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1 hour ago, theamazingmrg said:

Is LLC that useful for Guild Hoff?  Only* Hoff, Joss, Howard, and the Steamfitters can take it, and Joss and Howard are pretty much self-sufficient from Turn 2 onwards so don't rely on the Hoffball quite the same.

 

 

*And Ryle, but he's DMH so doesn't count!

Hmm, I missed/forgot that they are "living/undead" restricted.  :( 

Back in Closed Beta the Riotbreakers had a built in ability with similar wording to "Laugh Off"  (has since been replaced with "Unyielding".)

Either way, it was a great help against Lure and other move shenanigans my opponent tried to use.   So LLC definitely has its uses beyond the extra armor.

Stopping resistance triggers etc. from pushing you away is useful.

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