Any reports from LVO?

[LeperColony]

2 minutes ago, farmoar said:

Unless you are a sucker for punishment, why give yourself a completely negative weekend?

(and that is all assuming that the players that dropped did it because they were losing, and not for personal matters)

Personal matters are of course different.  Things come up, that's life and games, as fun as they may be, obviously have to yield to it.

But first of all, win or lose you're playing a game.  If your only enjoyment comes from winning, I personally would rather not have you at the event (or in the community).  It's no surprise to me that all the drops had losing records.  That's no excuse.

Second, looking at it from the point of view of someone who is going to drop if they aren't top table, what are the odds that you will be?  If you are only going to continue if you're winning, then unless you have some basis to believe you'll be consistently on top, why enter in the first place?

Obviously people have to rank their own priorities, and there's no stopping someone from dropping.  But I find it disrespectful to the TOs and the other players to flake on a commitment just because you're not going to take home the trophy.  

[Ogid]

39 minutes ago, Guslado said:

It was in Las Vegas, there were a couple people who had a bit too wild of a night after day 1 of the tourney and didn’t wake up until the afternoon day 2. 

Or maybe one of the dropped was locked in the rooftop of his hotel while the other 3 were looking for him all over the city...

[farmoar]

1 hour ago, LeperColony said:

But I find it disrespectful to the TOs and the other players to flake on a commitment just because you're not going to take home the trophy.  

There is nothing disrespectful about it at all. Life is too short to not look for ways to enjoy yourself.

Having been in the position of Round 1 Loss, Round 2 Loss, Round 3 Bye, I can tell you that it sucks. If the only thing happening on day 2 is this tournament, then yes, show up. But at a convention, or hell, LAS VEGAS, there are tons of other ways to spend your time.

Not doing well in the tournament, or having fun, go do LITERALLY ANYTHING ELSE. No one is holding a gun to your head and making you stay. I am actually surprised that there were so few drops, considering where the tournament was. And all of that has nothing to do with the other players or TO (unless one of them was being a douche-canoe)

[farmoar]

26 minutes ago, Ogid said:

Or maybe one of the dropped was locked in the rooftop of his hotel while the other 3 were looking for him all over the city...

I feel like I have heard that excuse before...

[LeperColony]

26 minutes ago, farmoar said:

There is nothing disrespectful about it at all. Life is too short to not look for ways to enjoy yourself.

Completely disagree.  By that logic, just walk away in the middle of the game if something shinier passes by.  YOLO.

 

[solkan]

2 hours ago, LeperColony said:

Obviously people have to rank their own priorities, and there's no stopping someone from dropping.  But I find it disrespectful to the TOs and the other players to flake on a commitment just because you're not going to take home the trophy.  

It feels like you’re describing a situation where it’s easier to quit a job than to quit a tournament.  😕 

It’s a game.  People are allowed to behave foolishly concerning it.

Disclaimer:  Yes, I have had a player walk out on me in the middle of a tournament game for a foolish reason.  That’s still their right to do so.

[LeperColony]

18 minutes ago, solkan said:

It feels like you’re describing a situation where it’s easier to quit a job than to quit a tournament.

Curious interpretation since the part you quoted literally says:

"Obviously people have to rank their own priorities, and there's no stopping someone from dropping."

It's almost like you don't bother to read the things you quote.

If people want to drop, that's their right.  There are innumerable rights that can be exercised in rude, childish, petty, inconsiderate or otherwise suboptimal means, and nothing I've said has ever denied people are free to drop from events.  In fact, to the contrary, I've explicitly stated they're free to do so several times.

I'm just pointing out that if your enjoyment is solely derived from winning, then unless you're the Serena Williams of Malifaux, it's unlikely to reasonably expect you're going to sail through, so you may be better off doing something other than a multi-day, multi-round event.

You and/or some others may think it's not at all inconsiderate to walk out of an event.  You and/or some others may believe that YOLO and your rights makes it not merely justifiable but in fact proper, correct and maybe even laudable to quit in the middle of an event (or even the middle of the game.  I flipped Black Joker, YOLO going to see Cher). 

But I personally think that TOs go through efforts to put on events, to set up tables, to organize the players, to create the scenarios, to obtain the space from the event (which is itself a limited commodity in many cases and represents a commitment by the event based on the TO's representations of likely attendance) that is entitled to respect.  I also think the other players who show up and want to play the game with their fellow players who are there for the same reason deserve respect, and by dropping I may be forcing another on the sidelines.

It's of course anyone's right to not feel this way.  It's a matter of judgment.  But in my judgment, which I am entitled to render, it's rude.

Quote

It’s a game.  People are allowed to behave foolishly concerning it.

If you believe it's behaving foolishly, I'm not even sure where we disagree.  I didn't even go as far as foolish, I just said it was rude.  

Nowhere did I claim we should strap people to chairs.

[CD1248]

2 hours ago, LeperColony said:

Completely disagree.  By that logic, just walk away in the middle of the game if something shinier passes by.  YOLO.

 

I think you're being both unrealistic and uncharitable. It's a foregone conclusion that a multi-day event is going to have the bottom half of the field gutted by drops, in fact I can't think of a single instance where I *haven't* seen it happen, in any hobby game.

Tourny games are tiring, and there is very little incentive to come back for day 2 if day 1 was just repeated beatings and you know that your best-case scenario is a middle of the pack finish.

And who are they hurting? Worst case scenario, you go from even to odd player numbers and someone has to take a bye, but it's just as likely that the opposite occurs.

[Guslado]

As the TO from LVO I didn’t mind the drops. There’s a lot to do in Vegas and playing two full days of a tourney can be tiring; for some players it was three full days as I ran a  Double Rush tourney and All Out Brawl on Friday.  

To change the topic away from opinions on drops. Here’s a few pictures of the tables from LVO

[LeperColony]

46 minutes ago, CD1248 said:

I think you're being both unrealistic and uncharitable.

To have as a normative goal that people should finish what they start seems neither unrealistic nor uncharitable.  Exceptions are going to exist, and they're going to fall on a continuum of appropriateness depending on the specific circumstances and the code of conduct used to evaluate those circumstances.  But I don't think there's anything unreasonable about having a general expectation that people are going to honor their commitments.

Are deviations from that norm going to happen?  Yes, and for all sorts of reasons. 

Are they the end of the world? No, even if by some strange circumstance they were to result in something "drastic" like the cancellation of the event.    

But that doesn't mean skipping out suddenly becomes commendable.  

50 minutes ago, CD1248 said:

And who are they hurting? Worst case scenario, you go from even to odd player numbers and someone has to take a bye, but it's just as likely that the opposite occurs.

This is a matter of etiquette, and as such standards are going to vary.  

In my estimation, someone does suffer a harm if they sit around doing nothing for 2+ hours because I decided to quit.  Maybe you don't think that's a harm, or maybe you don't think it's harm enough to require any additional calculation on your part.  But I do.

Ultimately it's a matter of perspective.  I personally would be embarrassed to discover that I'd wasted two hours of someone else's time.  Obviously, since I'm not a saint I don't value their time as highly as my own, but I don't think it's a trivial matter.

54 minutes ago, CD1248 said:

Tourny games are tiring, and there is very little incentive to come back for day 2 if day 1 was just repeated beatings and you know that your best-case scenario is a middle of the pack finish.

So again, this goes to the point that if your measure of enjoyment is based on victory or defeat, unless you have solid grounds for thinking you're going to be winning, maybe multi-day, multi-round events aren't for you.

 

Dropping from an event isn't the most terrible thing possible.  Nobody died.  And it's going to happen, especially in a larger field, with other options, and in a multi-day event.

But just because a behavior isn't the worst transgression of all time doesn't mean it can't be discourteous.  And just because the consequences aren't the downfall of Western civilization, it doesn't mean they don't matter to anyone.

 

[Durza]

<Modhat> I've just deleted some comments, play nice. <Modhat>

[Guslado]

11 hours ago, Guslado said:

To change the topic away from opinions on drops. Here’s a few pictures of the tables from LVO

And because I apparently can't upload photos directly to this thread from my phone, here are finally some photos from LVO:

[Mortarion]

23 hours ago, Guslado said:

Hey! I ran the Malifaux events at LVO this year. Here's the breakdown of all of the masters played and the matchups at LVO.

I was posting most of my photos to A Wyrd Place as I'm one of the mods over there and these forums don't get along well with my phone. I'll see if I can get a few more photos from my phone onto these forums in a bit, but figured the breakdown of masters and matchups is what people mostly wanted.

Were there no Guild players at all?

[Kharnage]

3 hours ago, Mortarion said:

Were there no Guild players at all?

Not a one! Zero guild players from start to finish. 

[Beta]

Well...that says a lot...

[Tors]

Yeah, that there aren't guild players near vegas... i can understand  everytime i read another "guild is bad"-thread here i also got the urge to quit

[Kharnage]

8 minutes ago, Tors said:

Yeah, that there aren't guild players near vegas... i can understand  everytime i read another "guild is bad"-thread here i also got the urge to quit

Carry on, humans! I think that there's plenty to work with in Guild, if God Empress Nekima wasn't my first love I'd probably be playing Justice. I think the issue is that the stronger players moved to different factions, hunting after fractions of power, and so now skill levels combined with a slight disadvantage leads everyone to believe that Guild is unsalvageable. 

[farmoar]

14 hours ago, Durza said:

<Modhat> I've just deleted some comments, play nice. <Modhat>

Sorry for the Modhat. I decided to read the comment thread after having some adult beverages.

[Tors]

44 minutes ago, Kharnage said:

Carry on, humans! I think that there's plenty to work with in Guild, if God Empress Nekima wasn't my first love I'd probably be playing Justice. I think the issue is that the stronger players moved to different factions, hunting after fractions of power, and so now skill levels combined with a slight disadvantage leads everyone to believe that Guild is unsalvageable. 

Oh you missunderstood, i get the urge to quit because of the people posting, not the Faction. I don't see many relevant problems with the trusty redcoats (in fact i would rate them above NVB for example) and the last tournament i attended (14 players i think) had guild on place 1&2 only seperated by one point of total VP diff).

It's just the especially intense (and unnessesary) pitty party that is the guild subforum that's tiring. But to be fair that's true to an extant in almost every faction sub here - i am pretty sure if we take every of the dozens of errata threads and note down every mentioned piece in need of adjustment, we get a complete list of malifaux models.

[thatlatinspeakingguy]

15 minutes ago, Tors said:

It's just the especially intense (and unnessesary) pitty party that is the guild subforum that's tiring. But to be fair that's true to an extant in almost every faction sub here - i am pretty sure if we take every of the dozens of errata threads and note down every mentioned piece in need of adjustment, we get a complete list of malifaux models.

Fun fact - there is no active thread on errata in Ressurs subforum. I am almost certain that there was an attempt to start the discussion, but is seems that players were pretty happy with what we got, and the thread died out. Sure, Archie could cost a bit more, some Redchapelle models could be rewritten a bit to synergize better, but overall the faction seems to be close to the sweet spot. I think that's because most of our keywords are based on real synergies, so single pieces strenghten each other. I don't see that so often in other factions. TT are a complete disaster in this respect (and the greatest failure of 3ed imho), as many lists consists of the same few OOK/versatile supermodels.

[Fetid Strumpet]

Most of the errata discussions for Ressers are on discord. Revenant and Red Chapel fixes are a pretty regular discussion.

[Gnomezilla]

2 hours ago, Tors said:

Yeah, that there aren't guild players near vegas...

The trio of Guildies in central Texas (two Sonnias and one stubborn little construct handler) always end up at the bottom of the rankings, no surprise that they didn’t travel to LVO for more of the same. It’s the lack of Outcasts which startled me...but then, and I attribute this to being in Texas, you can’t throw a stone without hitting a Parker player, let alone the rest.

[Ogid]

Does anyone remember how were the Marcus (NVB) and Lucius (NVB) games (a quick match overview and lists)?

Ty!