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Zipp in OC


Jafar
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As in topic, has anyone tested this master in OC? 

When I played a little with crew creator, I always ended with 100%gremlin crew. I only once found place for Johan. Beside Mx child and copy for Piano action (I think it may be difficult for child to follow Zipp, but that's the other story), what are OC tricks or stronger sides? Thank you in advance for help. 50 ss lists are welcomed as well. 

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First of all, you have Midnight Stalker. He's technically part of the crew, but you can't hire him in Bayou. Then there's the Emissary - he improves your movement, heals and gives out upgrades etc. Prospector gives you more resources. If you are into multimasters, you can take either Schill or Barrows for synergy.

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15 minutes ago, Zebo said:

Today, the only reason to play Outcast Zipp is having declared Outcast and wanting to play a superfast disruptive crew (and to surprise your opponent). Zipp is way stronger in Bayou than in Outcast. 

Owww, that hurts :( This topic was to find something opposite to it, because I had very similar thoughts. Maybe there is undiscovered combo with Emissary worth 10 ss? 

But to be honest, he is quite good pick in OC compared to other masters. Especially when we want something that's fast and can drop pianos (or disrupt in general) 

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You always can find tricks in Outcast that fluke not be done in Gremlins, for example, if facing enemies like Colette, Misaki or other bury/fading models, Outcast Zipp can bring Obliteration models, although since you declare faction before master, I doubt anyone declares those models versus Outcast. 

You can always declare Outcast to "ban" Those crews from the pool. 

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There are two questions here - One is " I've declared I'm playing outcasts, why would I want to use Zipp?"

The other question is "I want to play Zipp, why should I declare outcasts?"

And the answers are different. I think you're asking the second question.

I've not played a lot of Zipp in Outcasts, but I have used him, and found he was effective. There are a lot of Strong outcast models that Iron Skeetars can ferry about. The bandits can help you trigger free loot, which is something I almost never get to use when I'm using an Imfamous crew.

It may well be that Zipp is at his strongest as a bayou master, but he certainly has a place in the Outcast stable as an option.

 

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1 hour ago, Jafar said:

Owww, that hurts :( This topic was to find something opposite to it, because I had very similar thoughts. Maybe there is undiscovered combo with Emissary worth 10 ss? 

But to be honest, he is quite good pick in OC compared to other masters. Especially when we want something that's fast and can drop pianos (or disrupt in general) 

Emissary can give regen +1 to Zipp, which will make him even less attractive as a target since he'll be able to run off and heal a bit if need be.  The heal and mv aura is a nice bump, but he'll quickly need to walk that donkey up the field to keep up with the rest.

Don't mind me, is always good to put on a quick model and Companion can be devastating at the right time to remove a pesky model or throwing down a ton of pianos in a row. :D

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35 minutes ago, Adran said:

There are two questions here - One is " I've declared I'm playing outcasts, why would I want to use Zipp?"

The other question is "I want to play Zipp, why should I declare outcasts?"

And the answers are different. I think you're asking the second question.

I want to focus on next master in OC. By the "cool" factor I eliminated Hamelin and Jack Daw. Now I want to discuss other masters. In my local meta I saw everything excluding Zipp so started this topic :) For me he can do better in Bayou, but still is good master in OC. 

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I started with Outcast (Mercenary, Plague, Freikorps, and Bandits, respectfully), then went Ten Thunders (Tri-Chi and then Oni).  When Tri-Chi lost dual faction and Infamous gained dual faction, I decided to pick up Infamous because if I'm gonna be playing Bayou, might as well have 2 crews in the Bayou faction, and I can use them in Outcast as well.

For some reason, I'm just more comfortable playing as Outcast.  I have 5 keywords I can pick from (6 once I get my hands on Barbaros & some Nephilim) so when the table and pool gets revealed, I have many options to pick from.  Right now in Bayou I have 2 keywords (3 counting my cool Fist Mate lead all Stealth Swampfiend build), so I don't have as many options.

So I use Zipp in Outcast because Outcast is comfortable.  It's safe.  It's my playground.

I play Zipp in Outcasts because I can.

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2 hours ago, GrumpyGrandpa said:

Can you give a few examples of how?

Any Bayou Upgrade > any Outcast Upgrade

Lucky > Hodgepodge

Mmm I'm not gonna lie, Pride > any other Crossroad xD

Yes, Outcast has a good versatile scheme runner in Midnight Stalker, but Infamous precisely doesn't need OOK scheme runners, and Gremlin has their own good models. 

And, as is have been said before, if you mostly end hiring a full Gremlin crew, what sense has to make Zipp Outcast? For the pleasure of having crappy Upgrades? 

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1 hour ago, Zebo said:

Any Bayou Upgrade > any Outcast Upgrade

Lucky > Hodgepodge

Mmm I'm not gonna lie, Pride > any other Crossroad xD

Yes, Outcast has a good versatile scheme runner in Midnight Stalker, but Infamous precisely doesn't need OOK scheme runners, and Gremlin has their own good models. 

And, as is have been said before, if you mostly end hiring a full Gremlin crew, what sense has to make Zipp Outcast? For the pleasure of having crappy Upgrades? 

Hmm.. I can see the upgrade part, but it seems slighty vague / situational on the other arguments. But I'll admit that I havn't faced O Zipp a whole lot.

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5 hours ago, Zebo said:

Any Bayou Upgrade > any Outcast Upgrade

Lucky > Hodgepodge

Mmm I'm not gonna lie, Pride > any other Crossroad xD

Yes, Outcast has a good versatile scheme runner in Midnight Stalker, but Infamous precisely doesn't need OOK scheme runners, and Gremlin has their own good models. 

And, as is have been said before, if you mostly end hiring a full Gremlin crew, what sense has to make Zipp Outcast? For the pleasure of having crappy Upgrades? 

I think your value metrics are a little off here

Bayou Upgrades are better, but for the most part OC performs well without them. Most OC players only buy an upgrade if they have an extra 2 stones that aren't better spent elsewhere. That said, Wanted Criminal is pretty great on a skeeter especially if you are also trying to score Deliver. 

Lucky Emmesary may be better than the Hodgepodge, but why would I want to hire a model that can't keep up with Zipp's crew? Those stones are better spent elsewhere.

I'd say usually 50-60% of my stones are spent on infamous models. The rest are spent on versitile and ook models. There are so many strong options in OC. 

  • Prospectors are amazing with First Mate to feed his Leap/Strike every single turn. I almost always take FM and I never take him without a prospector. 
  • Ashes and Dust is incredible with Zipp. With a 7" incorporeal move he can be anywhere zipp needs him to be with the rest of the crew. 
  • Skeeters can fly around Sue or Hans for ridiculous ranged murder if you need it. Sue (or a Dead Outlaw) can also make tons of scheme markers for Mancha to bash people's heads into. 
  • MS is great if you want to spend all your other stones on beaters for a murder. He can  take care of all your scheming needs single-handed. 
  • Gracie and Barboros with zipp is one of the meanest Claim Jump combos I have ever played. 


tldr: I'd say Zipp is top 3 for strongest masters in OC behind Tara and Levi for his speed, versatility and killing power. IDK if he is better in either faction but he sure as hell is strong in OC. 

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10 hours ago, OhRlyeh said:

I think your value metrics are a little off here

Bayou Upgrades are better, but for the most part OC performs well without them. Most OC players only buy an upgrade if they have an extra 2 stones that aren't better spent elsewhere. That said, Wanted Criminal is pretty great on a skeeter especially if you are also trying to score Deliver. 

Lucky Emmesary may be better than the Hodgepodge, but why would I want to hire a model that can't keep up with Zipp's crew? Those stones are better spent elsewhere.

I'd say usually 50-60% of my stones are spent on infamous models. The rest are spent on versitile and ook models. There are so many strong options in OC. 

  • Prospectors are amazing with First Mate to feed his Leap/Strike every single turn. I almost always take FM and I never take him without a prospector. 
  • Ashes and Dust is incredible with Zipp. With a 7" incorporeal move he can be anywhere zipp needs him to be with the rest of the crew. 
  • Skeeters can fly around Sue or Hans for ridiculous ranged murder if you need it. Sue (or a Dead Outlaw) can also make tons of scheme markers for Mancha to bash people's heads into. 
  • MS is great if you want to spend all your other stones on beaters for a murder. He can  take care of all your scheming needs single-handed. 
  • Gracie and Barboros with zipp is one of the meanest Claim Jump combos I have ever played. 


tldr: I'd say Zipp is top 3 for strongest masters in OC behind Tara and Levi for his speed, versatility and killing power. IDK if he is better in either faction but he sure as hell is strong in OC. 

This is the post I couldn't be bothered to write. 

Additionally Prospectors help gain  back some cards so Merris' bonus is less of a tax. 

Alice/Taylor/Mad Dog on a skeeter is also amazing. 

You can also dish out fast with SoC or Dead Outlaw so your beater on a skeeter has that much more ap turn 1.

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34 minutes ago, thatlatinspeakingguy said:

He's Outcast player. Do you really need any other reason?

Maybe I've been explaining horribly myself. 

First, sorry because my bad understanding was making me answer a question nobody ask. 

20 hours ago, Zebo said:

Today, the only reason to play Outcast Zipp is having declared Outcast and wanting to play a superfast disruptive crew (and to surprise your opponent). Zipp is way stronger in Bayou than in Outcast. 

Here, I understood that the OP wanted to know why to play Zipp in Outcasts instead of Gremlins, and I answered my opinion. 

I, of course, am a Outcast player, and I'm totally decided to play Outcast Zipp. Probably is one of the strongest and funniest masters in the Faction. 

And you totally can find synergies in Outcasts that you will find harder to do in Gremlins, like the Malifaux Child copying the piano drop, or sz 2 killers (Arik, Mad Dog, Rusty...) Being carried, Von Schill giving upgrades to Skeeters/Wrastlers (a Wrastler dropping a pair of Minefields Markers to use  with their attacks) and a lot more that still haven't come to anyone mind.

 

Sorry if this was becoming a rant about Outcast Upgrades. 

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4 hours ago, Zebo said:

Von Schill giving upgrades to Skeeters/Wrastlers (a Wrastler dropping a pair of Minefields Markers to use  with their attacks) and a lot more that still haven't come to anyone mind.

Don't forget Flying Piglets... they're Undead Minions, not Beasts!

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On 1/28/2020 at 12:38 AM, OhRlyeh said:

Prospectors are amazing with First Mate to feed his Leap/Strike every single turn. I almost always take FM and I never take him without a prospector. 

Could you explain this synergy in more detail? I've never thought about a prospector for anything more than collecting soulstones.

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1 minute ago, Sol_Sorrowsong said:

Could you explain this synergy in more detail? I've never thought about a prospector for anything more than collecting soulstones.

Prospectors are so much more than that. I think the OP was mainly referring to their soulstone generation allowing FM to leap and strike every turn. 

They are great models for detonate the charges because of the different ways they drop scheme markers. Amazing at card draw in a crew that already has access to good card cycling so your hand is often well above average. 

I will always take 1, often 2 in a Zipp crew 

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