Leaving engagement by breaking LoS

[Hollow]

In the 2nd edition it was able to leave models engagement without disengage strike by breaking LoS without leaving engagement range (e.g. Incorporeal model moves through the wall). Does this trick still work in the 3rd edition?

[santaclaws01]

58 minutes ago, Thimblesage said:

Well Cyclops are WAY better than I thought. They can position themselves 2" away from an enemy model, (within their engagement RANGE,)  and create 2 ice pillars between the models so that LoS is blocked. Now the enemy model is perma-paralyzed 

They would be able to charge, or use any other movement effect that isn't a walk.

[GlowingFruit]

5 hours ago, gozer said:

For example, how would a disengage work in the case when a friendly model is leaving an enemy model's engagement range but isn't engaged due to line-of-sight? Does the enemy model get to make a melee attack? How? They have no LoS. And if the enemy model can't make a melee attack then does the disengage go un-contested and the friendly model gets their free push?

To make it clear, let's make a dumb situation with two units having the same size and different  range, the first has 1" range and the other has 2". The first one is engaged by second at a range of 2". Now since #1 is engaged, he cannot take the walk action nor the charge action (p.26 of the Rules Manual, Engaged effects). If a third model of the same size or taller would place itself between the first two #1 could walk off freely since LoS would be broke off. Else, he could use the disengage action since he is engaged by an enemy model (p.26 of the Rules Manual second paragraphe of engagement).

The thing I'm not sure in this situation is about model #2. I'm not quite sure he could use his walk action to leave (It would be logic for me since model #1 doesn't have the reach to get a hit on him).

This make me think that the engaged effect (If we look at it as a statut effect) only affect a victime or both model in cases were they have the same range.

On 8/12/2019 at 11:48 AM, hollow1351 said:

In the 2nd edition it was able to leave models engagement without disengage strike by breaking LoS without leaving engagement range (e.g. Incorporeal model moves through the wall). Does this trick still work in the 3rd edition?

When looking by the rules we have at the moment, I'd say no. I think it is weird that there are no clarification about moving through terrain while being engaged since Incorporeal models are a thing.

The reason behind my no is that the engagement range of units generaly doesn't see over high wall and there  range couldn't go on the other side anyway (except if it is a 1" or 2" and the engaging model has a big enough size + melee range so that he could still see you and able to target you).

Maybe it is an intentional nerf to incorporeal models or just a miss from there part. Personally, I would like if incorporeal could walk away if they can break LoS by using there ability. But from my understanding, at the moment, disengaging seems to be the only way to pass through wall or other things that break LoS. Once engaged, they feel like a standard unit, just more resilient .

PS. Sorry for my first post, I had used my physical copy of the M3E Core Rulebook so the page numbers were different. I used the online Rules Manual for this post so nobody would be confused.

[Maniacal_cackle]

2 hours ago, Thimblesage said:

Well Cyclops are WAY better than I thought. They can position themselves 2" away from an enemy model, (within their engagement RANGE,)  and create 2 ice pillars between the models so that LoS is blocked. Now the enemy model is perma-paralyzed 

Huh, interesting. I assumed you could disengage from this, but no, you can only disengage if you're engaged. However, charge has the same restriction, so you can charge away if you're not engaged (or disengage if you are engaged).

You can also destroy the ice pillars.

It's RAW, though almost certainly not RAI, but if that's how your group plays it, there's still plenty of wiggle room.

[Flib Jib]

1 hour ago, Maniacal_cackle said:

It's RAW, though almost certainly not RAI, but if that's how your group plays it, there's still plenty of wiggle room.

Lol, let's not make assumptions about my community.  I was just illustrating a point. 

[Adran]

5 hours ago, Thimblesage said:

Well Cyclops are WAY better than I thought. They can position themselves 2" away from an enemy model, (within their engagement RANGE,)  and create 2 ice pillars between the models so that LoS is blocked. Now the enemy model is perma-paralyzed 

Since every model can charge at least as far as it could have disengaged, it's pretty hard to call this any form of paralyzed. In practical terms they are less paralyzed than if instead of ice pillars you had a ht 0 impassable terrain. 

[Paddywhack]

14 hours ago, santaclaws01 said:

They would be able to charge, or use any other movement effect that isn't a walk.

Yes, but is sure seems silly. The rule under Engaged does seem to imply that was the intent of the rule in the Walk section - the wording under Walk just wasn't well thought out. If we go with the assumed intent, then these silly cases of models having to Charge to leave a model's engagement range when not in LOS disappear - making the game cleaner. So if someone really wants to play RAW, even with the weird cases that will come up, then at least there are work arounds. I think I'll be playing it based on whats written under Engagement as that makes more sense and seems to be what was intended - at least until an official FAQ.