Jump to content

Will one of you go and do well at a tourney with guild?


4thstringer

Recommended Posts

16 minutes ago, Cronex13 said:

That's... Something I hadn't considered. Wow. Talk about dirty. 

Let’s take it a step further... check this discussion out.

 

So 46 can copy The Jury’s suited Obey and not need to stone. Not always the best option (paying 8+1 stones for Jury vs stoning for a mask) but could be really fun. And don’t forget Doppel could do it at a stat 7!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

11 minutes ago, Cronex13 said:

Um. Maybe I misread but it sounds like that thread is saying that the built in suit ISNT part of the stat? The rulebook wording doesn't seem to lean that way?

The stat is just the numerical portion, yes, but that thread calls out that any :+flip or :ToS-Mask: from the original action would be copied over as well. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

7 hours ago, Sweet Tooth said:

The stat is just the numerical portion, yes, but that thread calls out that any :+flip or :ToS-Mask: from the original action would be copied over as well. 

Holy.... seems unintuitive but maybe technically correct. 

Jury with inbuilt mask is legit, witchling thrall with inbuilt rams for that 3/5/7 damage are the first two that come to mind for A46’s uncheatable goodness.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I've read the 2 post about it and I'm not sure I agree with stats being only the number!

 

I'll show you why! Most people in the other threads said it was only the numerical number because of this paragraphe in page 22:

 

''Any Action that requires a duel will have a stat. This is what the model adds to the card it flips in the duel (in this case, 5). It may also have a Fate Modifier, which impacts the flip for that Action, and/or a suit, which is added to the model's final duel total.''

 

The stat 5 they are referring is for an action shown higher in the page, the action is eldritch blast with a stat 5 with a :+flip and a :ram.

Most people in the other thread said since they separated the 5 form the rest, the stats only represented the numerical value and they said the ''It'' after that refers to the action and not the stats but if we replace ''It'' by action this sounds a bit strange to me:

 

''Any Action that requires a duel will have a stat. This is what the model adds to the card it flips in the duel (in this case, 5). ''THE ACTION'' may also have a Fate Modifier, which impacts the flip for that Action, ....''

 

I'm not perfect in english but I think it feels better it the ''It'' is instead the stat.

 

''Any Action that requires a duel will have a stat. This is what the model adds to the card it flips in the duel (in this case, 5). ''THE STAT'' may also have a Fate Modifier, which impacts the flip for that Action, ....''

 

If the ''It'' was in fact for the action, I think they would have written it like this:

 

''Any Action that requires a duel will have a stat. This is what the model adds to the card it flips in the duel (in this case, 5). 'THE ACTION'' may also have a Fate Modifier, which impacts the flip for ''IT'', ....''

 

So for me until they FAQ it, I'll play it as the stat is everything under the stat section of any actions, not just the number because I found this counter-intuitive and I don't think it's RAI.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

You probably shouldn't go analyzing the rules based on the language used if your English isn't perfect.

Anywho, you might have a point if that was the only paragraph in the rules saying that the suit is not part of the stat, but there are also others in the Duels part of the rules:

Quote

Players add their stat, the value of the flipped card, and any suits to determine their current duel total.

Notice the multiple suits. The current duel total being referred to is the one before cheating, and the only way to have multiple suits at that point is to have one associated with a card and another one associated with the stat, because suits from soulstones only get added to the final duel total.

Not that I really think the writers of these rules have really paid that close an attention, but if we assume that they indeed have, then the only logical conclusion is that the suit is separate from the stat.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

7 minutes ago, Myyrä said:

Not that I really think the writers of these rules have really paid that close an attention, but if we assume that they indeed have, then the only logical conclusion is that the suit is separate from the stat.

Even if they didn't... This is basically only relevant for two models in one keyword in the whole game – a keyword that hardly has a reputation for being 'broken' or even that powerful.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

13 minutes ago, Myyrä said:

You probably shouldn't go analyzing the rules based on the language used if your English isn't perfect.

Anywho, you might have a point if that was the only paragraph in the rules saying that the suit is not part of the stat, but there are also others in the Duels part of the rules:

Notice the multiple suits. The current duel total being referred to is the one before cheating, and the only way to have multiple suits at that point is to have one associated with a card and another one associated with the stat, because suits from soulstones only get added to the final duel total.

Not that I really think the writers of these rules have really paid that close an attention, but if we assume that they indeed have, then the only logical conclusion is that the suit is separate from the stat.

If you look at a card as per the picture you will see that the number and the positive and suit all come under the stat column of the attack.

 

Therefore number positive and which are inbuilt are part of the stat

Screenshot_20191015-130034.jpg

Link to comment
Share on other sites

5 minutes ago, Regelridderen said:

Even if they didn't... This is basically only relevant for two models in one keyword in the whole game – a keyword that hardly has a reputation for being 'broken' or even that powerful.

And the Malifaux child, Wendigo, Lazarus and  argueably Cassandra andHannah that I've found so far

Link to comment
Share on other sites

6 minutes ago, Starrius said:

If you look at a card as per the picture you will see that the number and the positive and suit all come under the stat column of the attack.

 

Therefore number positive and which are inbuilt are part of the stat

 

And if you read the rulebook, it tells us that that the Stat column of an action can contain 3 things, The stat, fate modifiers and suits, so distinguishing between the number (which it calls the stat), the suit and the fate modifier.

  • Agree 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

30 minutes ago, Starrius said:

Till I read otherwise me and the people I play with will add suits, it is FAQ'd it doesnt worry me either way most things I used dont have the added suits

Now you are just contradicting yourself. Are you replacing the entire stat column with 6 when mimicking something with Agent 46 or not? 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Okay sounds like there is still some debate here, but the ability states that "the stat of that action is considered to be the stat of this action" (the mimic) and since the mimic cast doesn't have any built in suits or positives, you wouldn't keep suits or positives from thw ability he copies

Link to comment
Share on other sites

6 hours ago, Starrius said:

When  you duplicate a power with mimicry you get everything from the attack,  any inbuilt suits/positives and triggers.

 

This can be interesting if you copy the opponents attack, had agent 46 thoon's melee attack then then bury him with the same.melee.attack

False. You only get the built in triggers. You replace the stat with the stat of Mimic, which in a46 case is 6

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Definitely useful and your idea of combining it wirh inhuman physiology is pretty darn genius. I'm confused as to where the disagreement is though. It's important we hash it out so that when an opponent comes with same argument, we stand prepared. As per the wording of the ability, the model treats the selected action (and it's triggers) As though it were printed on its card. The stat for the action is considered to be the stat for this action. We have determines that stat includes flip modifyers and built in suits, of which the mimic ability has neither...

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information