M3e Mei Feng Tactica

[Mycellanious]

1 hour ago, Stumpyfjord said:

That’s a really good point about the DPS efficiency. One of the skill points I think I need to improve on with the crew is over-reliance on RtRs and losing the AP/DPS efficiency of charging.

The focus also helps relieve some of the hand pressure I feel the crew struggles with overall. I’ve thought about plus flips improving “dependability” of too deck flipping but hadn’t pushed that to Focus use (which is pretty obvious once it comes to mind).

I’ve taken Claim Jump in him before for the reason you list with decent effect.

I think the hold-up for me is the Cost 9 for often standing still/low contribution. Maybe I should restructure the thought as 

“How much would you pay for a support piece that drops 7-10 focus a game for two cards?” and then judge the rest of his personal output against the residual Real Cost minus Made-up cost for focus spam.

Also just use him better through the game.

 

 

Yea, pulsing out focus is how Kang is action efficent, for the cost of a card turn one you generate the equivalent of around 5 AP. 

Another good way to think about Kang is what that Focus allows you to kill or what rules it breaks.

So if pulsing focus onto 2 Railworkers results in you killing an 8ss enforcer, you can thank Kang for that.

Dont forget that Mei Feng is a blaster in a Focus stacking crew. Because she has Breath of Fire Focus is disproportionately effective on her, especially because of Press the Advtantage making it super important to win the inital flip.

Finally, this is a faction with Deisel Engine. I already think the Foundry are uniquely suited to fighting Ressers, but stacking Focus with Deisel Engine is a great way to get around HtW. In this way, the Metal Golem gets a double positive to its attack and a double positive to its damage flip, on a model with a 3/4/6 damage track... 

[Plaag]

On 3/26/2020 at 6:07 PM, Mycellanious said:

Yea, pulsing out focus is how Kang is action efficent, for the cost of a card turn one you generate the equivalent of around 5 AP. 

Another good way to think about Kang is what that Focus allows you to kill or what rules it breaks.

So if pulsing focus onto 2 Railworkers results in you killing an 8ss enforcer, you can thank Kang for that.

Dont forget that Mei Feng is a blaster in a Focus stacking crew. Because she has Breath of Fire Focus is disproportionately effective on her, especially because of Press the Advtantage making it super important to win the inital flip.

Finally, this is a faction with Deisel Engine. I already think the Foundry are uniquely suited to fighting Ressers, but stacking Focus with Deisel Engine is a great way to get around HtW. In this way, the Metal Golem gets a double positive to its attack and a double positive to its damage flip, on a model with a 3/4/6 damage track... 

kang is a bad model in mei crew, there are a lot of models out of keyword which u want to see in your crew; also kang is not so mobile and tanking as other armoured models

[DuBlanck]

I really struggle with Kang - not because he's slow (RtR), but because after that initial pulse of Focus, he doesn't seem to do a great deal. St6 attacks and H2W with a heal is decent, but not really enough to tank. Guiding Presence comes up so rarely that I probably don't think to check for it often enough, but even when I do, that discard is expensive.

Oddly the niche I've found for him is the short-range Hot Coals action - with Focus and a Tome, he should be Blasting Burning onto people. It's theoretically useful in pools where everyone loiters in the same place, like Ley Lines. (Losing Corrupted Idols, which was what I was actually thinking of, might push him even further out of view for me.)

I'd like to make the Burning sub-theme work, between Mei's Breat of Fire, Kang's Coals, and the Rail Workers' Shovel Faster - St6 Stunned is pretty good, as is the relentless chip damage alongside the hits from Mei and Rail Golem. Unfortunately the Tomes for Blaze rarely come off the top, but I guess there's not much call to save them in hand if you do get them - Blaze is pretty much the only Tome trigger on most models, except for Condensation (Vent Steam) on the big beaters.

[DuBlanck]

Where does Sparks stand post-nerf?

Tech around making the Metal Gamin pulse loadsa irreducible damage sounds good, until they get bopped from range by armour-ignoring tech picks, I assume.

[Mycellanious]

4 hours ago, DuBlanck said:

Where does Sparks stand post-nerf?

Tech around making the Metal Gamin pulse loadsa irreducible damage sounds good, until they get bopped from range by armour-ignoring tech picks, I assume.

After a couple of games, I think I am tentatively going to call it a buff.

Pros:
+++ Soulstone usage. Absolutely a game changer, Sparks has now seen Turn 5 in every game I have used him. It also makes Sparks very good at certain Schemes, like Hidden Martyrs. In fact, I have had opponent say they don't even want to bother attacking Sparks now, since he can Stone away the first attack and Scamper away from the second. 

++Synergy with the Porkchop. Previously, Sparks and the Porkchop had dis-synergy which was unfortunate and sad. Since the Porkshop can't benefit from Fast twice, there was no reason to use Now Yer A Robot on it. Now however, Sparks can give the Porkchop a Fourth Action which is very powerful. Being able to set up Vent Steam early, or even just taking an extra Walk Action is very strong. Plus, Reckless damage is both prevented by Shielded, AND procs Packed With Explosives. 

++Increased Versatility. The advantage that Command Construct has over Burn Out is that it is more versatile. Being able to get an extra Action on another model during Sparks' Activation can be a game changer. For example, using Command Construct to have another model Ride the Rails so that both Sparks and that model can evacuate the area before the opponent has a chance to attack either of them. It can also be used on Enemy Constructs, which is useful because previous enemy Constructs where difficult for the Foundry to handle, as they ignore Vent Steam. Plus, it is an Attack Action, so now Sparks has a use for Focus!

++Sparks no longer needs to consume Scrap for his Tactical, which means your Turn 1 has a decreased resource cost.

+ Sparks can turn your Living models into Constructs, so when they die you get an extra Scrap!

 

Cons:
-Increased resource cost. Command Construct require a NINE, in a crew with ZERO card draw and lots of discards. It is definitely not going to go off every Turn, maybe once or twice a game. At least it can be mitigated a little bit by spending Focus? Oh, also it has no Triggers...

- Sparks can no longer give himself an extra Action. Previously, you could Burn Out Sparks for a 3rd Action, but you can't Attack yourself so you cant Command Construct on yourself. 

- The range of Scrapyard Mines got reduced and it is now an Aura. Most of the time, I'm throwing the enemy into the Scarp so the range reduction isn't seriously impactful. The fact that it is now an Aura is mitigated by Stone usage, as it is now acceptable for Sparks to be on or near the front lines. 

- - With the Focus Changes, Galvanize is not a great Trigger, particularly if you want to bring Kang. 

- - Command Construct is affected by Concealment, so you still have the issue where your Turn 1 can be messed up by Diesel Engine, except now you don't get your extra Action if the model you want to target is in Vent Steam. 

- - - The Maximum amount of health Sparks can save you in a Turn has been reduced. Previously you could Heal twice and give Shielded, for a total swing of six Health. Now that his Tactical is no longer a Bonus Action, the most HP you can swing is four, or if you Ride the Rails, only TWO. 

 

Neutral:

Analyze Weakness is still a dead Action. Sparks has even more Action AND resource pressure than he did before. In my 60+ games of Foundry, I have attempted Analyze Weakness twice and succeeded zero times.

[dannydb]

You missed the fact you can now have sparks do command construct to have metal Golem off the rails which is awesome

 

In fact you could have the Golem go off the rail 4 times a turn if you bring joss and amina 

[DuBlanck]

20 hours ago, Mycellanious said:

he can Stone away the first attack and Scamper away from the second. 

That is a layer of defence I'd not considered, nice - particularly as the Vented Steam and general rush probably means opponents are picking fewer shooters as damage dealers.

20 hours ago, Mycellanious said:

a crew with ZERO card draw and lots of discards

This has always been my problem with Foundry, and was part of why I rarely played Sparks before (felt hard to get reliable work out of him).

20 hours ago, Mycellanious said:

Analyze Weakness is still a dead Action

It did always feel fluffy rather than useful, so it's not really much surprise that nothing's changed there. It does tack onto the end of the weak anti-enemy Construct role with Command Construct though, reinforces him in that role.

[touchdown]

I've found Sparks's card pressure is lessened a bit because he has one of the few heals in the game with no TN and no healing flip. He can flip a black joker and still heal 2.

[frumpypigskin]

What are people's favourite uses for Sparks now?

Shielded AOE bomber Metal GAMIN?

Turbo Tickel Pig? (Reckless pings shielded, he's already got Vent steam potentially from Spark's bonus action)

Bossy Sparks telling Hoffman what to do!?! (It says LEADER! not master....) 

Pain train keeps rolling... Either turn on vent steam before the golem goes to town or get it to go off the rails again after its activated... Gotta say most of the time I can see myself going early with sparks to set up his shielded on a model I expect to get targetted though...

Anyone else got any wonderful favourite  actions of non-constructs they'd sink and AP,a scrap and a bonus action to get off an extra time in a turn?

 

 

 

[dannydb]

Bossy sparks is pritty good especially if you boss a golem to off the rails multiple times a turn or it to vent steam 

[frumpypigskin]

Can confirm Sparks auras still work. Sparks giving the piggy shielded turn 1 and telling the golem to vent steam meant I had 2 forward, steam vented, vectors for Mei to attack from. Top of 2 sparks goes first to move into range for his auras and get the Enforcer next Mei to vent steam early. 

Mei getting to attack DF 5 models, pushing them around over scrap markers in steam is gross! 

 

(The "with me" on Ten Thunder's masked agent makes the turn 1 dive all the more effective)

[Aemaru]

New to mei feng, i play Ten thunder usually.

With Mei feng I find more advantages to play her the arcanist side because their versatiles allow you to draw cards, have a hand of 7 cards, and have an effigy with dispel which are more or less covering her crew's weakness. In regard, in tt we can bring Minako to summon katashiro, and have the upgrade to switch off defense triggers.

What are your thought on this side's question ?

 

[Jinn]

8 hours ago, Aemaru said:

New to mei feng, i play Ten thunder usually.

With Mei feng I find more advantages to play her the arcanist side because their versatiles allow you to draw cards, have a hand of 7 cards, and have an effigy with dispel which are more or less covering her crew's weakness. In regard, in tt we can bring Minako to summon katashiro, and have the upgrade to switch off defense triggers.

What are your thought on this side's question ?

 

I wouldn't hire the Effigy into Mei for the dispel unless I was fighting a super condition focused crew. Her totem already provides a cleanse for the crew.

[Mycellanious]

On 1/24/2022 at 10:39 AM, Aemaru said:

New to mei feng, i play Ten thunder usually.

With Mei feng I find more advantages to play her the arcanist side because their versatiles allow you to draw cards, have a hand of 7 cards, and have an effigy with dispel which are more or less covering her crew's weakness. In regard, in tt we can bring Minako to summon katashiro, and have the upgrade to switch off defense triggers.

What are your thought on this side's question ?

 

There is a hidden advantage to playing Thunders Mei. Foundry relies on Armor an awful lot, but when you declare Arcanists your opponent knows to expect Armor which encourages them to pick a Keyword that can deal with Armor (Schtook is often played into Arc for example.) But that expectation doesnt exist in Thunders, so you can blindside somebody who wasnt expecting to deal with Armor. Severe Terrain also really hurts this crew, so Trained Ninja is extremely useful

[Cats Laughing]

21 minutes ago, Mycellanious said:

There is a hidden advantage to playing Thunders Mei. Foundry relies on Armor an awful lot, but when you declare Arcanists your opponent knows to expect Armor which encourages them to pick a Keyword that can deal with Armor (Schtook is often played into Arc for example.) But that expectation doesnt exist in Thunders, so you can blindside somebody who wasnt expecting to deal with Armor. Severe Terrain also really hurts this crew, so Trained Ninja is extremely useful

Trained Ninja carriers are 'somewhat' limited. There's a decent amount of living, often living+construct, in the keyword, but none of the living models drop scrap at the end of their activation, so you don't get easy ride the rail nodes via this upgrade. Just a FWIW.

[Litano]

Hi all-- just getting into the Foundry crew specifically and Malifaux generally, and came across an interesting rules question I wanted to run by the hivemind. Apologies if this has been discussed elsewhere, but I couldn't find any mention of this ruling in my brief perusal of this thread or the larger forum. I'm pretty certain I have the correct interpretation here, but I'd welcome the sanity check. If nothing else, this is a useful topic to clarify for other Mei Feng players!

If Mei Feng uses Freight Train and declares the Scorched Remains trigger, can she take her 2" push from Constant Motion before dropping the Scrap Marker from Scorched Remains? For reference, it seems to me that both Constant Motion and Scorched Remains would occur in step 2F of the detailed timing chart for the activation phase (pg. 35 of core rules). This seems similar to the example in the OP tactica, which sees Mei Feng resolve the push from the Jackhammer Kick trigger on Deadly Claws before following the target with her own push from Constant Motion, except the order here is reversed. The timing of pushing the opponent before pushing Mei seemed like a choice rather than a mandate based on my read of the rules, however, so I wasn't sure if the player could choose to resolve a trigger and corresponding ability in a different order (per the guidance on simultaneous effects on pg. 34). I know that Constant Motion is an "after resolving" effect and Scorched Remains is an "after succeeding" effect, but the distinction doesn't seem to make a difference for the purposes of timing restrictions.

Like I said above, I'm pretty sure that my interpretation of the rules here is correct. The whole system is just very confusing for me as an MTG player, since I'm very used to the timing and priority rules of that game and its stack. I've read the rulebooks' guidance here several times and even looked at FAQs and such, but intuitively it feels like A) one effect should not be able to be resolved before another effect that it spawns (I would say "that it triggers" in MTG, but terminology here is different) and B) the two components of Jackhammer Kick, which seem to be written as one cumulative effect, should not be divisible such that another effect can be resolved after one of these components but before the other. I can see that the timing rules of Malifaux permit both of these outcomes from the rules themselves and the discussion earlier in this thread, but my intuition here is useless enough that I thought I'd turn my question about Freight Train timing to the group.

Thanks in advance for the clarification, and I'll let you know how my games with Mei Feng go as soon as I start grinding out reps!

[Trimasel]

Short answer as you wish, Foreigh Train resolutions:

1. Action itself (Foreigh Train) 

2. Trigger (Scorching Remains) / Constant motion

3. Constant motion / Trigger (Scorching Remains)

Deadly claws:

1. Action itself (deadly claws) 

2. Jackhammer kick firs part - push / Constant motion

3. Constant motion / Jackhammer kick firs part - push

4. New generated action

 

Long answer, Constant motion resolves in same time when default triggers, but before new action generated.

Basically - core 35page 2f describes that it is step of "after resolving" trigger & "after successing" triggers, and all other abilities after resolving. And because them are simultaneous, you can do as any order you wish (34page). 

[Litano]

Gotcha, thanks for the clarification! You took very few words to answer a question I took a lot of words to ask. In my defense, I'm still trying to puzzle out rules for the game generally. This answer and the earlier clarification about multiple sources of hazardous terrain earlier in the thread both helped me a lot!

I've gotta say, the crew seems like a lot of fun. I can already see some of the shortcomings in what it can't do already, and I'm sure I'll discover more of them when I pick Mei into terrible MUs or pools and get my shit kicked in, but she really aligns with the playstyle I gravitate towards in other wargames. Any other tips for a first-time player entering the game through this crew?

[Trimasel]

Try have plan where you should drop scraps first turn and probably second turn, as well as how move all crew in this scoring/fighting positions with at less count of standart walks.
 

After that (with this Mei) best activation: is Breath of Fire with tome trigger to Vent steam (if you can't guarantee +2 duel against opp, better even use stone if no tomes in hand) & two attacks with Jackhammer (in some cases Blind by Iron to control model). 

Try different crew setups to find your playstyle, but mostly tend hire at least one extra 1 walking forge (I tend to 2 extra).

I got only one game with title Mei, so cant really give a lot advice there. There I defiantly suggest Sparks + more walking forges.

P.s. there are rough matches are constructs/ignore hazardous (like incorporeal) and what can eat scrap. Otherwise this crew can be quite mobile & can do almost all strategies without big trouble (the most difficult in gg2 is Corrupted Laylines).

[NoisyAssassin]

I started Malifaux with Mei, and she's a fun intro master and crew! The one thing I'd say is really important for them after you've got the basic game mechanics down is figuring out and practicing your unpacks. As in, it's worth setting up some terrain, generating a random pool, grabbing your crew, and then deploy all your models and go through all the movement of your first turn. Then rinse and repeat. Foundry's big schtick is Ride the Rails, and getting your rail lines set up well is both important and not always intuitive. 

[Litano]

How do you choose when to bubble up your models vs. using their mobility to yeet them all over the table? It seems like there's a lot of nuance in deciding when to keep your units together to benefit from auras like Kang's The Worker's Champion or Actions like Sparks' Heavy Wrench healing while also maximizing their unique ability to rapidly reposition in small groups that can run schemes across the board in a single turn.

[NoisyAssassin]

It's definitely situational, and something you'll learn as you play the crew. I like to bunch up my deployment generally to help with early railwalking, so everyone will be in range of Kang's pulse and abilities like Sparks'. After that it really just depends on the board state and where models need to be/what they need to be doing.  

[Adran]

9 hours ago, Litano said:

How do you choose when to bubble up your models vs. using their mobility to yeet them all over the table? It seems like there's a lot of nuance in deciding when to keep your units together to benefit from auras like Kang's The Worker's Champion or Actions like Sparks' Heavy Wrench healing while also maximizing their unique ability to rapidly reposition in small groups that can run schemes across the board in a single turn.

In part, you choose this based on what crew your opponent is playing, and what strategy and schemes you select. If you are facing a master like Pandora, its quite risky to plan to huddle, so I would then try and make a general game plan in which I expected to spread more, but if the game is set so that I can get a lot of my points by remaining in a large huddle together, and my opponent doesn't have a keyword to punish that, I may plan to largely stay together. One of the strengths of the crew is how quickly a model can switch from one side of the board to another if is has to, with the potential for a model to move 27" inches in its turn (As long as you have the scrap markers in exactly the right place), so you can often keep a huddle for most things, and send models out for specific missions, knowing that they will be able to return to the huddle quickly. 

[DuBlanck]

Just to clarify on the Freight Train -> Scorching Remains & Constant Motion timing:

After doing the FT push, I can take the CM Push before or after dropping the Scrap, and there is no requirement to be consistent turn to turn?

[Adran]

45 minutes ago, DuBlanck said:

Just to clarify on the Freight Train -> Scorching Remains & Constant Motion timing:

After doing the FT push, I can take the CM Push before or after dropping the Scrap, and there is no requirement to be consistent turn to turn?

Both occur at the same time point, so you get to choose which to resolve first each time. This means you can make different choices each time.