Colette (Performer) M3E

[LeperColony]

Does anyone use False Reality much?  I haven't used it yet.  For one thing, I rarely have a ton of Distract on my enemies.  And for another, it seems to pale in comparison to Presto-Chango.  If I can't reliably get a or I don't want to burn a stone, I've always done something else (move or interact mostly, assist once) rather than activate it.

Removing Prompt really changed how she plays in a fundamental way, which I'm not saying is necessarily a bad thing.  But I feel like False Reality is a drag on the rest of her kit.  If it gave Distract, then you did the move effect, it would obviously be a lot better but it would also mesh well with the rest of her crew and I don't think it would have been OP.

[Vangerdahast]

Same as you. I don't put enough Distract to be able to use it at full effect but it has already permitted me to place a Distracted +1 Judge in the arms of the  Duet, for example.

 

It can be seen as a lower version of Presto Chango (no Mask required, lower TN) but don't underestimate the Delay Trigger that hand out Slow. It can be really good versus a beater that you need near you (for Take Prisoner, for example) but you don't want that he kills half your Crew. It can also be a cheap way to take one of your models out of a melee without using the Disengage Action and lose movement.

 

In the right circumstances, it is a good action but you don't use it that often. I should have used it less than ten times in thirty games. Even a 2 inches place effect can be effective when you want to mess with the placement of your opponent's models to deny him a point in certain schemes (Take Prisoner, Outflank, Claim Jump, Hold Up their Forces). The more I play Colette, the more I find that activate her late in a turn gives her a huge nuisance role by screwing opponent's plans or by scoring her own points without possible retaliation.

 

Concerning your idea of dealing Distract, I don't know if it would be OP but it will make the action more attractive for those (like me) who struggle putting mass Distracted but you will be less inclined to use it on your own models.

 

[LeperColony]

I find that I activate her early in early turns, and later in mid/late turns.  If my opponent doesn't have the ability to ignore resist triggers, I often fling her as far forward as I can as fast as I can to absorb attention.

[Vangerdahast]

 

I often delay her activation Turn 1. It permits me (with Presto Chango) to take back a model that I may have a bit overextended. The opponent think that he will charge the Rider or the Duet at the end of Turn 1 or beginning of Turn 2 and he suddenly faces Colette. Generally my opponent changes his mind or charge Colette but then it is ending with a buried Colette. 

 

[LeperColony]

7 hours ago, Vangerdahast said:

 

I often delay her activation Turn 1. It permits me (with Presto Chango) to take back a model that I may have a bit overextended. The opponent think that he will charge the Rider or the Duet at the end of Turn 1 or beginning of Turn 2 and he suddenly faces Colette. Generally my opponent changes his mind or charge Colette but then it is ending with a buried Colette. 

 

Sounds like we have pretty different play styles.  Which is probably an indication I'm doing things wrong...

[Vangerdahast]

You are not necessarily doing things wrong. It can just be a matter of personal playstyle.

Perhaps also that Colette's playstyle authorizes different ways of playing her effectively.

 

Do you have success with Colette or losing often? In the last case give us details on your lists, the Masters you face often, the Schemes you are choosing. Perhaps we could help you to obtain better results.

 

[LeperColony]

I haven't had a chance to play a lot of M3E yet, so I wouldn't say I'm struggling.  Haven't lost on Colette thus far, though my opponents are also learning their crews so I don't put too much stock in these results.

It's more that I'm just going to have to play more to see if a forward focused strategy is viable.  I suspect even if it is workable, sometimes I'm just going to get completely flattened.

[madaxeman]

On 7/19/2019 at 9:47 AM, Adran said:

Rough sequence to just gain actions -

Duet activates. Does 2 actions. Uses bonus action to dance apart. 1 of the corephyee counts as that activating corephyee.

Activation ends. Opponent gets to activate.

2nd corephyee activates uses bonus action to dance together, the duet continues the activation with 2 actions.

Having now tried this, yep it makes sense 🙂

Presto-changing a dove which was handily sat next to the Duet with an already-activated enemy beater (that believed itself to be safe, being the thick end of 18" away from the Duet) - and then hitting it 4 times with attacks on 7 (Duet) and 6 (solo Coryphee), before reforming ... very dispiriting for the opponent! 

[Adran]

2 minutes ago, madaxeman said:

Having now tried this, yep it makes sense 🙂

Presto-changing a dove which was handily sat next to the Duet with an already-activated enemy beater (that believed itself to be safe, being the thick end of 18" away from the Duet) - and then hitting it 4 times with attacks on 7 (Duet) and 6 (solo Coryphee), before reforming ... very dispiriting for the opponent! 

I don't know the exact board lay out, but I think you probably undersold your duet.

You ought to have been able to make all the attacks at stat 7, you don't need to take any of the actions (other than the bonus actions) as a coryphée. You can reform at the start of the Coryphée activation and then the duet will carry on that activation.

And just to make things worse, you could have probably got the reformed duet to charge, allowing you to also get the Blade rush bonus damage...

 

[madaxeman]

ooooohhhhh 

[Croaker13]

So, I have this idea… It’s probably a little too cute (as opposed to effective), but it might catch an opponent off guard. I haven’t tried it yet though, so please let me know if I’m being dumb.

 The general plan it to create some powerful area denial by pairing Cassandra up with an Ice Golem.

 

The specific plan is something like this:

You include Cassandra (8ss), an Ice Golem (10+1ss) and a Silent one (6+1ss) for a total of 26ss (leaving you 34ss for the rest of the crew). Deploy them fairly close together.

Turn one Cassandra uses Upstage on “Ice Pillars” to create a pillar 8” in front of the Silent One. She then moves towards the “target area”. The Silent One uses the ice pillar to (hopefully) create another two pillars up to 12” further up the board.  The Ice Golem should then walk towards the area and stand within 1” of the Ice Pillars. If you need it there right from turn one, have Colette move it up with Presto-Chango. That might even allow the golem to put up the Blizzard aura right from the start.

From then on, the Golem will simply squat next to the pillars and dare anyone to get close. Cassandra can either do her own thing from then on, stay close in order to put up a Blizzard aura without the Golem needing to use actions to do so, or you can have her stand 8” away from the golem and have them both put up a Blizzard, in order to cover more ground.

The Silent One can stand a bit further back and provide the golem (and possibly Cassandra) with Ice Pillars and healing.

 

All of the above would obviously be easier in a Raspy crew, but people won’t expect it in Colette, so they might not be prepared to deal with something as hard-hitting and tough as an Ice Golem that’s being supported with a supply of Ice Pillars.

 

What do you all think?

[DoomKnight473]

I'm a big fan of Collette in 3e the strategy and Scheme pools are good for her while she dies struggle with Reckoning adding Coraphes and Carlos/Cassandra can make her pretty good at it. She also has the bonus of a cheap healer in her keyword. My only problem with her is that if you're opponent leaves her alone she is needing to use her actions to get herself in position

[Croaker13]

The Mannequin Long Shuffle.

After getting punished rather harshly for being a bit too obvious with my deployment during my last game , I came up with this maneuver.

The general idea it to use a Mannequin’s “Mechanical Assistant” ability to move it across the board in one turn, and possibly drop a scheme marker, without telegraphing which direction you are moving until midway through the turn. Ideally, you’ll do this turn one, in order to get it safely away from the enemy’s big hitters and in place to score a strat./scheme turn two. You might also want to activate some of the rest of the crew first, in order to gauge what the opponent is doing before committing to a direction.

Instead of writhing a 500 word description, I’ve tried to illustrate the maneuver with pictures (see below).

There are a number of variations you could think up, including using Angellica’s “Give them an encore” and Colette’s “Practiced Choreography” to gain even more reach, but I think it’s already fairly complex, so I didn’t want to muddle the picture even further.

I will mention, however, that after the 3^rd activation (Colette moving Cassandra with “Presto Chango”), you still have the option to move the Mannequin the opposite direction in a double-feint. You’ll lose some distance, but if the Mannequin double-moves after being dragged by the dove, it can still get about 20” up the board, which should put it in position to move and drop a scheme marker in turn two.

 I’d love to hear your thoughts about this.

 

[Vangerdahast]

For me it requires too much setting for the result ( good positionning or one scheme marker Turn 1). There are more AP efficient ways to obtain the same result.

If you want to delay Cassandra and Mannequin activations, play your Doves. In many cases you have more models than your opponent and he will not always use his pass tokens. You can gain an activation by splitting the Duet and reform it later.

Depending on the deployment, your idea can be problematic. Might be good in Corner Deployment. In Flank, ennemy models will be near and can counter it easily. In Standard and Wedge depends if the opponent spreads his models or groups them.

In order to hide my intentions, I prefer deploying Cassandra + Angelica on one flank of the table and Duet (+Mechanical Rider often) on the other flank. Then you can put a Scheme Marker Turn 1 far away from your Deployment Zone and away from ennemy models on one flank.

In your example Cassandra finishes her activation approximatively 25 inches from your starting point (corner of the table). In Corner Deployment, if you place her at the edge of the deployment, she is at 12 inches from the corner. After three walks she will be at the same point (perhaps it little bit far) and the mannequin can be dragged all along. Then the Mannequin can walk and interact. On the other flank, Duet (if you split it) can move 24 inches or 18 inches and interacts.

 

Perhaps I may be wrong, so if you feels that it can work, test it and tell us your results.

How many models have you in your Crew. For me, generally 9 and it is enough to delay activations in order to be able to adapt to the opponent's moves.

 

[Croaker13]

I haven’t really settled on a ”normal” number of models in the crew yet, but I agree that, due to bringing three doves for free, Colette will usually have more models than the enemy turn one.

You are probably correct that it’s fairly fiddly. However, it’s only meant to be a supplement to “normal” play. You should still do the all the other Performer shenanigans, and moving Cassandra and a Mannequin up one side of the board is often something I’d like to do anyway, so the opportunity cost of this “play” shouldn’t be too great.

I’ll report back once I’ve had a chance to stress-test it in actual play.

[Croaker13]

I got a game in yesterday and managed to do a field-test of my ”Long Shuffle” maneuver. I’m happy to report that it was a smashing success.

Game was 35ss Colette vs. Von Schill. Cursed Idols with Flank deployment. I took Breakthrough and Deliver a Message (sidebar: Turns out that getting the second point with Deliver a Message on Von Schill is really difficult).

I deployed as the defender and put most of my crew centrally in the deployment zone, except for a Coryphee Duet, which was placed on the left flank. My opponent also deployed most of his crew centrally, except for a scout who placed with From the Shadows on the right corner (from my perspective). It’s almost like he was afraid of getting too close to my Duet 😉

I was thinking about slingshotting the Mannequin into the opposing deployment zone to score breakthrough, but the first idol turned up on the left corner of the battlefield, where my opponent couldn’t get to it easily, so I went for that instead while the rest of my crew held up the enemy in the center of the board.

Cassandra and the Mannequin got close enough to the corner that Cassandra was able to double-walk and push the idol at the beginning of turn two. The plan was then to have the Mannequin heal her and move towards the enemy deployment zone. However, my opponent decided to use Hannah’s “Ancient Words” to bury and unbury the Duet next to Cassandra (well, it was that or have it activate right next to an already wounded Von Schill), so I simply had the Duet heal Cassandra and then drag the Mannequin towards the center of the board edge.

Next, the Mannequin activated to walk into the enemy deployment zone, drop a scheme marker and score me Breakthrough. It spend the rest of the game simply doing a walk/activate to get me the other point. At the end of the game, it had moved more than 60” and dropped four scheme markers in the enemy deployment zone, which I think is quite impressive for a four-stone model. In the end, I won the game 6-5.

The Duet could have done the same job, but IMO that would have been a waste of a 12-stone model.

I could also have reached the corner by simply deploying Cassandra and the Mannequin further up one of the “legs” of the deployment zone. However, that would have:

A: Given away my intention and allowed my opponent to counter-deploy some of his beaters.

B: Put them out of reach of the other corner, in case the first idol had dropped there.

Overall, I’m quite happy. This is obviously just one game, but I’m convinced that the basic idea has merit.

[DuBlanck]

I haven't been keeping perfect records, but I think I'm yet to reach turn 5 with more than three models left in the game when playing the Performers.

Distracted just isn't doing enough heavy lifting for me,  the ladies are delicate and fragile, and while I can deny fine, actually scoring VP requires that I put them in harm's way.

Typically turn 3 and 4 is spent watching my girls evaporate under Focused attacks.

 

How do you all keep the ladies safe?

I haven't really tried the Mannequins (one in one game), so perhaps more healing is the answer to keep them on their feet, but besides Colette, Coryphee and ovvasionally Cassandra, none of them actually seem to have the defensive tech tosurvive an enemy encounter.

[Jinn]

45 minutes ago, DuBlanck said:

How do you all keep the ladies safe?

I just don't hire the Showgirls. A typical Colette list for me might include:

• Colette + Doves
• Carlos/Cassandra (8SS)
• Coryphee Duet (12SS)
• Mechanical Rider (11SS) (maybe with Diesel Engine, +2SS)
• Angelica (7SS)
• Soulstone Miner w/ Magical Training (8SS)

I haven't taken this exact list before but I think it should actually be pretty solid even with a 2SS cache. The SS miner can generate stones and Colette can use the doves, so you have less reliance on a cache. In my last game with Colette (vs Viks) I ran almost this exact list, but with a Steam Arachnid instead of the Soulstone Miner. It died at the start of turn 2 in my deployment zone (Flank + Corrupted Idols), so I wouldn't recommend it. You could easily swap out the Soulstone Miner for a Mannequin as well if you wanted some backup healing for the living models.

This list is decently tanky (without relying on distracted + manipulative, which fails versus stones and is clunky to use as a defence) so long as you don't send the Rider into a big combat on turn 1 or 2. There are still plenty of crews who can threaten you but much less than if you rely on Showgirls/Ice Dancers.

[MuMantai]

What you can do is play Soulstone Cache on Colette and cycle your Doves for Soulstones.

Unually, to summon a dove, you need two suits, so card + stone or card + dove. With the Cache, you either use card + stone, but get a stone back, or use card + dove, and get your dove back plus a stone. Do that twice in the game and you have the cost of the upgrade back.

I have seen the same tactic with two caches and just kill the doves start of game for six stones and three cards, but that is a waste of good doves.

[Vangerdahast]

 

I play Colette with lists very similar to Jinn. Losing models is inevitable. I often have Colette, Duet and Cassandra at the end of a game. Choose your schemes with that in mind. For example, Outflank is very good for the  Performers. Concerning Strategies, try to play it in advance. For example, in Plant Expplosives, don't hesitate to drop two or three Strategy Markers in turn two. Perhaps your opponent will take one back but not all and by doing this, he is not attacking your models.

Don't mind Me and Agile allow to disengage and interact in the same activation, use it to achieve your schemes soon. Then your model can die, it should be too late for the oponent to deny these points. My opponents generally know very soon my chosen schemes (sometimes even before the beginning of turn 1) but they have difficulties to deny them. If you choose Schemes with markers, drop them as soon as possible and more than needed. The opponent can say "Oh well, I won't be able to retrieve all these Markers, let's fight".

I always take one Showgirl but keep her  away from combat. She can guard a marker in Turf War and reclaim it with Don't Mind Me. Generally, she uses Seduction on opponents or engage them to block interact actions. but she can be replaced with a Mannequin (Corruped Idols).

For more durability, you can try a list with a Duet AND two single Coryphees. No splitting of the duet but one single Coryphee is much tougher than a Showgirl for only one more point.

 

[Ogid]

1 hour ago, MuMantai said:

What you can do is play Soulstone Cache on Colette and cycle your Doves for Soulstones.

Unually, to summon a dove, you need two suits, so card + stone or card + dove. With the Cache, you either use card + stone, but get a stone back, or use card + dove, and get your dove back plus a stone. Do that twice in the game and you have the cost of the upgrade back.

I have seen the same tactic with two caches and just kill the doves start of game for six stones and three cards, but that is a waste of good doves.

It's a cool trick but it require some set up, the Recharge SS aura and the dove aura are only 3''.

However I have some doubts about the 2 SS cache trick... Recharge SS is an aura and auras aren't cumulative; however this aura is not affecting a model but the player's cache...

[SteampunkCake]

50 minutes ago, Ogid said:

It's a cool trick but it require some set up, the Recharge SS aura and the dove aura are only 3''.

However I have some doubts about the 2 SS cache trick... Recharge SS is an aura and auras aren't cumulative; however this aura is not affecting a model but the player's cache...

Auras are not cumulative with Auras of the same name.
So Recharge Soulstone triggers when a model within 3" is killed, you get a soulstone.

So you kill a dove within 3" for the suit on presto changeo, you draw a card due to demise and get a soulstone back due to recharge soulstone and then you get the summoned dove from the trigger. so net you are gaining a soulstone, but that requires an AP from Colette and a dove to be within 3".

The rest of the card is pretty much irrelevant on Colette, she doesn't want to be on the board for long and definitely doesn't want to be stuck in the middle of a big scrum to absorb SS from dying models. You would be better off just taking the 2 SS and leaving the upgrade.
 

[Ogid]

5 hours ago, SteampunkCake said:

Auras are not cumulative with Auras of the same name.
So Recharge Soulstone triggers when a model within 3" is killed, you get a soulstone.

You are probably right, however the aura rules prevent a model to be affected by different auras. But in this case the aura isn't affecting the dying model, but adding 1 SS to the cache of the player... so it could go around that ruling... maybe we should ask this in the rules forums to be sure.

5 hours ago, SteampunkCake said:

So you kill a dove within 3" for the suit on presto changeo, you draw a card due to demise and get a soulstone back due to recharge soulstone and then you get the summoned dove from the trigger. so net you are gaining a soulstone, but that requires an AP from Colette and a dove to be within 3".

It's not probably worth it... but it let her use Presto Chango with minimal resource lost; which may enable her to use that ability much more frecuently. It's clever, but I'm not sure how practical.

[SteampunkCake]

13 hours ago, Ogid said:

You are probably right, however the aura rules prevent a model to be affected by different auras. But in this case the aura isn't affecting the dying model, but adding 1 SS to the cache of the player... so it could go around that ruling... maybe we should ask this in the rules forums to be sure.

I'm not sure I get what you are saying?
A model can be affected by multiple auras at a time, just not multiples of the same aura.
Are you referring to the the smuggled soulstones aura on the Mechanical dove?
I think you are thinking of this paragraph in the rules:
Auras are not cumulative. If a model would be affected by multiple Auras of the same name (i.e., if the Aura would change its game state in some way), then it is only affected by one such Aura of its controller’s choice.

Smuggled Soulstones and Recharge Soulstone are different named auras so they both apply

[Ogid]

12 minutes ago, SteampunkCake said:

I'm not sure I get what you are saying?
A model can be affected by multiple auras at a time, just not multiples of the same aura.

I was refering to this bit:

23 hours ago, MuMantai said:

I have seen the same tactic with two caches and just kill the doves start of game for six stones and three cards, but that is a waste of good doves.

Impliying they kill the doves in presence of 2 Recharge SS auras to get 2 SS per dove killed.