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Pigapult's Full Load action:

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Choose a friendly Sz 1 model within 2".The chosen model gains Slow and is placed anywhere within range. Until the End Phase, it cannot take Interact Actions. Shockwave 2, Mv 15, Damage 2 centered on the chosen model.

As I read it, "centered on the chosen model" means, that the model is treated as a shockwave marker and (2) is measured from it's base edges.

Rulebook p31:

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Any model that the Marker touches or that is affected by the () must pass the simple duel noted in the Shockwave or suffer its effects.

So here is my question: does the placed Model take the duel generated by shockwave? Is it treated as touching itself?

P.S. I know, that a model is not in base contact with itself, but wording of Full Load doesn't use "base contact".

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The shockwave effect goes in a pulse from the dropped marker.

Pulses do not affect the object they originate from. 

(Both are from page 31)

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23 minutes ago, Adran said:

The shockwave effect goes in a pulse from the dropped marker.

Pulses do not affect the object they originate from. 

(Both are from page 31)

My second quotation was from p.31. Models, touched by shockwave marker, are also affected. So if I drop the shockwave marker right under a model on a 30mm base, it will be affected by shockwave.

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46 minutes ago, Adran said:

The shockwave effect goes in a pulse from the dropped marker.

Pulses do not affect the object they originate from. 

(Both are from page 31)

I really wanted to agree with you in the feeling that this wasn't supposed to be able to damage the thrown model, but the trigger on that action says otherwise:

Quote

"Loaded" Ammo: If the chosen model is a Stuffed Piglet and it was not killed by this Action, it may take the Bacon Bomb Action.

The only way the "Loaded" Ammo trigger makes any sense is if the thrown model takes damage.  The only thing* in that action which causes damage is the Shockwave.

[* No, I'm not going to argue here about throwing stuffed piglets into hazardous terrain.  Attribution of damage caused by a Place effect into hazardous terrain can be its thread.  :tome]

I think there are still some action that end up making things act like Shockwave markers (instead of placing Shockwaves where they are located), but this can't be one of them.

So the result seems to be:

  • Full Load produces Shockwave 2, Mv 15, Damage 2 centered on the model.
  • If Full Load places and kills a Stuffed Piglet, that sets off Demise(Volatile Pig), :new-Pulse:2 must each pass a TN 11 Mv duels or suffer 2 damage and gain Injured +2.
  • If Full Load places and then doesn't kill a Stuffed Piglet, the built-in trigger on Full Load lets the Stuffed Piglet take Bacon Bomb,  :new-Pulse:2 TN 11 Mv duel or suffer 3 damage and gain Injured +1 and the stuffed piglet dies without setting off its Demise.

So it's going to be two pulses off of a Stuffed Piglet most of the time, if the Bayou player wants it.

 

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14 hours ago, solkan said:

 

I really wanted to agree with you in the feeling that this wasn't supposed to be able to damage the thrown model, but the trigger on that action says otherwise:

The only way the "Loaded" Ammo trigger makes any sense is if the thrown model takes damage.  The only thing* in that action which causes damage is the Shockwave.

[* No, I'm not going to argue here about throwing stuffed piglets into hazardous terrain.  Attribution of damage caused by a Place effect into hazardous terrain can be its thread.  :tome]

I think there are still some action that end up making things act like Shockwave markers (instead of placing Shockwaves where they are located), but this can't be one of them.

So the result seems to be:

  • Full Load produces Shockwave 2, Mv 15, Damage 2 centered on the model.
  • If Full Load places and kills a Stuffed Piglet, that sets off Demise(Volatile Pig), :new-Pulse:2 must each pass a TN 11 Mv duels or suffer 2 damage and gain Injured +2.
  • If Full Load places and then doesn't kill a Stuffed Piglet, the built-in trigger on Full Load lets the Stuffed Piglet take Bacon Bomb,  :new-Pulse:2 TN 11 Mv duel or suffer 3 damage and gain Injured +1 and the stuffed piglet dies without setting off its Demise.

So it's going to be two pulses off of a Stuffed Piglet most of the time, if the Bayou player wants it.

 

The trigger makes sense without the line about if the Model is not killed. And for 99.9% of the time it would cause no issues. But I can imagine the rules questions being asked about what happens if the Piglet is killed by Hazardous terrain then you would have to decide does it get to do the bacon bomb before it dies, or not, and then you have to try and resolve the fact that the piglet has died twice and gets to do both the bacon bomb pulse and the death from an attack action pulse. (Probably, I would need to stare much harder at the timing rules to try and work it out)

Hazardous terrain is a lot more common this edition so adding extra text just for that is possible.

There is a little wiggle room in that the Dropped Marker generates the pulse (according to the rules) and all models inside the pulse area or overlapping the object that generated the pulse excluding the  object that created the pulse are affected by the pulse.

So the stuffed piglet generated the pulse, but does it count as the model that created the pulse, which has a couple of side issues. does the damage/kill count as done by the Pigapult or the Stuffed piglet (or both), and can the pigapult hurt itself with a shockwave?

But I'm still happy with the Stuffed pig being immune to the damage of the shockwave because it is the point of origin. It is not a model overlapping the origin, it is the marker that is generating the pulse.

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My understanding is the stuffed pig isn't the shockwave marker, but it is centered on them.

 

Since a 30mm model can't stand on a 30mm marker and block it, I would say that means the shockwave would still hit the stuffed pig and effect it

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27 minutes ago, wizuriel said:

My understanding is the stuffed pig isn't the shockwave marker, but it is centered on them.

 

Since a 30mm model can't stand on a 30mm marker and block it, I would say that means the shockwave would still hit the stuffed pig and effect it

That's something I hadn't thought of, and reading the wording of "Suddenly Doves" and "Arson" I think you are probably right, there is a separate shockwave marker that just happens to exactly fit under the pig. So the pig is topuchign the marker and effected.

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