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Davos

Levi Questions: Can I kill myself?

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Ok, so here's a question I'm working on: Can I kill Levi, during his own activation, to re-position him?  The rules (as seen in the last file update) are as follows:

"Costs:

In addition to the suit needed to declare them, some Triggers have an additional cost that is listed in italics after their name. These costs must be paid when the Trigger is declared or no other portion of the Trigger may be resolved. If a Trigger’s cost requires the performing model to suffer damage, that cost cannot be paid if doing so would reduce its Health to 0 or below." pg 12, Core Rules

"If the Action has any costs in italics, they must be paid now. If the costs are not paid, the Action fails; skip steps 3, 4, and 5. If an Action’s cost requires the performing model to suffer damage, that cost cannot be paid if doing so would reduce the model to 0 Health or below." pg 23, Core Rules

So, as written, you cannot spend an action if the COST of said action would kill the model - a seen with Levi's Channel restriction; If cannot be used if you have less than 3 health.  

Now, my question is centered on: 

 Sanguine Evocations - - - - Look at the top 3 cards of this modelís Fate Deck, discard any number of them, and place the remaining cards back on top of the deck in any order. This model suffers 1 damage for each discarded card.

There is no "cost" for the action to go off (at least based on my interpretation of the wording of the ability/ he Rules of Action Cost.)  You only take damage IF you choose to discard cards.  So, If my Levi has 3 or less wounds, and I declare Sanguine Evocations, can I discard cards equal to my wounds to kill Levi, proccing his Demise Ability, to reposition him somewhere else on the board, and continue with his activation?  In essence, top of Levi's activation, Sanguine Evocation, discard cards, Levi dies, Demise pops him from a waif, he continues his activation.

 

 

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You also want to read Page 33

Choosing to suffer damage

A model can never choose to suffer damage if this damage would put them below 0 health.

But I don't think this Action is Levi choosing to suffer damage. So I think as written he can use it to kill himself

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This particular interaction was used a few times in beta battle reports to kill friendly models, and I raised the question then, yet it remained unchanged. It seems intentional that Leveticus can kill his own that way. (I am never quite in position to eat the health of A&D for heals, but that’s on my to-do list. I have eaten the health of a waif for what would have been a net gain, had my opponent then taken care to block Leveticus from healing and then killed him. Did not expect a no-heal prohibition from Ten Thunders, lemme tell you.)

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10 hours ago, Davos said:

So, If my Levi has 3 or less wounds, and I declare Sanguine Evocations, can I discard cards equal to my wounds to kill Levi, proccing his Demise Ability, to reposition him somewhere else on the board, and continue with his activation?

Discard a number of cards that may or may not be in excess of Levi’s remaining health.  If it were written as a cost, or that you discarded a number of cards equal to the damage suffered, you’d be limited to remaining wounds.

Then Leveticus is going to be healed back to 8 because the excess damage (that would take you negative) just gets ignored.

 

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11 hours ago, solkan said:

Discard a number of cards that may or may not be in excess of Levi’s remaining health.  If it were written as a cost, or that you discarded a number of cards equal to the damage suffered, you’d be limited to remaining wounds.

Then Leveticus is going to be healed back to 8 because the excess damage (that would take you negative) just gets ignored.

 

Perfect, that was my thinking/reasoning exactly.  Its a good way to kill him to restore health.

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