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Ming

Jack Daw

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7 hours ago, Ming said:

I'm going to play new Jack for the first time today. Any tips for roster and gameplan?

Do you have an Idea on what you’ll be facing? Also, do you know if you will be playing him as an Outcast or Resser?

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Surely as an Outcast) I will be playing against a Neverborn. Here's the encounter:

Wedge Deployment 
Reckoning 
• Harness the Ley Line (3) 
• Search the ruins (4) 
• Hold Up their Forces (6) 
• Outflank (9) 
• Deliver a message (11) 
• Vendetta (13)

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  • I would almost surely take Harness the Ley Line as Tormented have scheme dropping tech, but aren't very good at running too far. They also make areas of the board bad for your opponent. It's Jack's best scheme in my opinion.
    • Get a Crooked Man, a Guilty, and a Dead Outlaw. Bonus if you have Wanted Criminal on someone.
      • Walk Guilty up twice. If in range of an enemy due to Wedge Deployment, go ahead and try to Share Guilt
      • Put up too greedy to die with the Dead Outlaw, charge with run and gun, hit the Guilty with a low tome do deal 2 damage and have him drop an enemy scheme marker. That lets you push another tormented (Montresor or Crooked Man), 3 inches towards the marker. If you took Wanted Criminal, draw a card too. At this point you can use covetous cravings or shoot again
      • Walk with the crooked man and use Malifaux Mining Law to either drop a scheme marker on a crow, or convert the enemy scheme marker previously dropped to a friendly one on a mask. Either way, that lets you push another tormented model due to Too Greedy To Die. 
      • From here on, use your crooked man every turn to drop scheme markers on the centerline with his bonus action. If you have ways of healing the Guilty, you can attempt to drop multiple enemy scheme markers through the Dead Outlaw + Guilty combo, then convert them all through Malifaux Mining Law + Shifting Sands, but realistically, your opponent isn't going to let you and you need a tome every time.
      • Protect your Crooked Man at all costs. It's got a great attack and can score Harness on its own, but it's the easiest model in your crew to kill
    • If you take a Hanged (Which I would)
      • If an enemy model is on the centerline, try hitting it while burning a stone/card for tomes and drop scheme markers through Draw Out Secrets.
      • If you're desperate for markers, you can hit your own guys on tomes to get those markers out, but it's at least 2 damage a pop with the potential of forcing yourself to discard cards.
  • The next best one would be Vendetta. If you can, let the Hanged take it, as everything else but Montresor dies fast in your crew.
    • When you know the next attack would send your Vendetta target below half health, use a 13 of Masks (or a 13 + stone) to:
      • If within 10 of the target but target is engaged, Horrifying whispers on a mask to place
      • If within 10 of the target, and target is not engaged (preferable), Toss the Noose on a mask to place
      • If within 20 of a Guilty (least preferable), use horrifying whispers on the guilty + mask, then Toss the noose +mask on Target, potentially having to focus to overcome engagement/concealment.
      • If you want to protect your Hanged from being taken off the board after you revealed it as being the holder of vendetta, you can have Jack push him back with the punishment trigger, attacking your own models if needed.
  • Search The Ruins is doable, but relies mostly on your Hanged being on the other Half of the board and hitting on tomes. Another alternative is to use the Midnight Stalker. If you go this route
    • During Deployment, place the Midnight Stalker in LoS of Montresor but not in LoS of Jack. This gives the Stalker the Tormented Characteristic due to Hidden in Plain Sight on his card.
    • Use Montresor to Obey the Midnight Stalker, preferably ending behind terrain or a model that still blocks line of sight to Jack. If possible, Obey again (You'll be dragging Montresor around with pushes, don't worry about him "wasting actions" at this point
    • Due to Wedge Deployment, the Midnight Stalker should be able to activate on the enemy half of the board on turn 1, being fast because of Invader. From here on, it should be very easy to drop markers all around the board for Ruins, with Crooked Man/Jack/Hanged contributing the odd marker or 2.
  • I never take Hold up their forces. The resilient models are too expensive, everything else is squishy and, aside from the Guilty, never wants to be engaged with anything. Neverborn also has lots of Deadly Pursuit and Butterfly Jump, so it's not worth it.
  • I would skip on Outflank too. The Tormented have a lot of mobility tricks now, but the direction of the pushes depends on the position of other Tormented, especially enemy models. You're not really going to get pushes towards the two edges of the centerline. Crooked men could be decent at it because they can stay there and drop 2 markers per turn on the line, but they blow up so fast with Df 4, only HtW, and no independent means of escape. I always lose this guy first.
  • For Deliver a message, I usually find that the first point is a freebie, the second one depends almost entirely on the activation order on the last turn. Your best bet would to be use something to drop a scheme marker close to the enemy master, have them move away, then have a Hanged charge in on a tome and drop another one. If your opponent is experienced, he's going to either wait to activate his master last and just move away, or he'll use marker removal (forage/shifting sands etc) as the last action of the game. So, honestly, only take it if you want 1 guaranteed VP (I think the second point on this scheme is one of the worst ones we have)

For the strategy, Jack is really good at reckoning. His crew isn't great at killing multiple models at once, but it excels at setting up those kills for later on. So the fact that you have to spread some conditions and upgrades on turns 1-2, then slowly increase the targets that you can reliably kill, fits perfectly within the rules of the strategy.

So, my recommended hires for this game would be:

Jack
Ligeia (I wished she were a bit more useful)
Montresor - 9
Hanged + Servant of Dark Powers - 10
Guilty 5
Crooked Man 7 (I wish he wouldn't explode so easily)
Dead Outlaw 6

That's your first 37 stones. I always take a cache of at least 6 due to the suit reliance of the Hanged. so that would bring you up to 43.

You could bring the cache down to 5 stones and get the Midnight Stalker

You could bring the cache down to 5 stones and leave Servant of Dark Powers out, then hire the Hodgepodge Emissary - This is because the crew desperately needs heals given how frequently your models get hit. The emissary also grants a push + marker drop with, within the Too Greedy To Die aura, is actually 2 pushes. That's a really good deal. Having the regeneration trinket on either Jack or the Hanged helps a lot, although the tiny range on all of the Emissary's auras mean you're not benefiting from them often.

Anyway, these are all suggestions, and they could be immediately invalidated by the master/terrain you see, but it's the framework I'd have in mind for this game. Hope it helps!
 

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Thank you for advice. Didn't manage to read it before the battle though. Wanted to test the Crew, made some mistakes and found out some abilities midgame.

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Just to be sure. If I use Dead Outlaw and count my own Guilty as an enemy model, do I steel need enemy markers for Drop It and At Gunpoint?

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All references to friendly and enemy on a card are related to that card

Drop it will drop markers that count as enemy to the dead outlaw.

At gunpoint needs the Guilty to be near a marker that the dead outlaw considers an enemy

Guilty as charged makes no difference to these, other than allowing you to use the friendly Guilty as the targeted enemy model. (And if it is counting as an enemy model, it can't relent I believe)

 

 

 

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8 minutes ago, Ming said:

Thank you. Never thought about not being able to relent - are you sure about it?

No, its a funny interaction that has only just shown up with this new guilty rule. But as far as I can tell if you are treating it as an enemy model for the purpose of the action, you can't also be counting it as a friendly model for the that action, so you can't make use of the relenting rules.

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12 minutes ago, stonecrowe said:

@Saduhem in your post, you made reference to hanged using stones for suits, but they aren't soulstone users. Am I missing something? 

They have Attuned, so they can use stones

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2 hours ago, Adran said:

No, its a funny interaction that has only just shown up with this new guilty rule. But as far as I can tell if you are treating it as an enemy model for the purpose of the action, you can't also be counting it as a friendly model for the that action, so you can't make use of the relenting rules.

That's correct. Relenting refers to a model one models consider friendly. No relenting. Same for obeyed enemies, actually.

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