Arcanist Masters and their keyword models [M3E]

[Adran]

I like painting flame, so Backdraft is a good choice for the Fire Golem (and the whiskey gamin look cute). I also like Ferdinand Vogel and the beast within, especially from a M2E rules perspective as well. So those would be my picks.

[Clockwork_Fish]

Kinda feel like the Medical Automaton should be versatile.  I get that it's a robot, so obviously goes with Hoff, but in current edition it heals living models, which are few and far between in a construct crew.

[retnab]

Agreed, it feels like it's mostly Augmented just to give GuildHoff some Living help (which on its own is weird, since I don't know when he'd want to hire Living Guild?)

[Gnomezilla]

It’s a cheaper route to heal Hoffman himself, which helps now that he can’t heal himself. I am having trouble getting used to that.

[WWHSD]

14 hours ago, Clockwork_Fish said:

Kinda feel like the Medical Automaton should be versatile.  I get that it's a robot, so obviously goes with Hoff, but in current edition it heals living models, which are few and far between in a construct crew.

It was versatile for most of the closed beta but got a 1SS cost decrease and got the Augmented keyword near the end. That kept it the same cost to hire as it had been when it was Versatile for all of the masters but Hoffman. There were a handful of models across the different factions that got a similar treatment. 

[Ludvig]

Haha, so Hoffman got it themed because it doesn't synergise with his crew? I better wait for the cards before going bonkers on the themed purchases.

Anyone got the inside scoop on what models Mei Feng will likely use often/always? Got her box obviously so apart from those.

[Boomstick]

49 minutes ago, Ludvig said:

Ayone got the inside scoop on what models Mei Feng will likely use often/always? Got her box obviously so apart from those.

In addition to her box, Mei makes good use of Metal Gamin and the Rail Golem (renamed the Metal Golem), Willie, as well as Sparks and the Mechanical Porkchop from the Bayou (haven't used Sparks yet and the MechChop seems like it might need a tweak, or maybe I just need to support it better). I expect Foundry will be getting new keyword models going forward, but for right now she does fine with the versatile models from her factions.

[retnab]

Everyone who was Foundry still is. I don't like the Bayou models personally but the Arc and 10t ones are all good to great

[Gnomezilla]

3 hours ago, Ludvig said:

Haha, so Hoffman got it themed because it doesn't synergise with his crew? I better wait for the cards before going bonkers on the themed purchases.

I need to write ‘It Removes Conditions on its Melee Attack’ onna post-it note and stick that to my forehead. Maybe then I’ll remember that use of the automaton. Not that Guild is short of condition removal, but automatons are cheaper sources.

Or maybe it’s the same skein of thought which made Pneumatic Upgrades in the first place: someday he will be required to hire from the rest of the living faction for counter-pick tech, let’s make it less suicidal this time.

[WWHSD]

4 hours ago, Ludvig said:

Haha, so Hoffman got it themed because it doesn't synergise with his crew? I better wait for the cards before going bonkers on the themed purchases.

It's got plenty of stuff on its card that works with models that aren't living and it uses the Power Token mechanic that Hoffman is build around. There's a handful of Augmented models that are Living other than Hoffman (Joss, Howard, Steamfitter, etc). It just became a cheaper hire for Hoffman but stayed at the same cost that plenty of other crews had been willing to pay when it was Versatile. 

[Franchute]

5 hours ago, Gnomezilla said:

 and stick that to my forehead. 

You might not see there though 😊

Hoffman's bonus action can remove conditions as well if I remember correctly.

[Morgan Vening]

13 hours ago, Franchute said:

You might not see there though 😊

Hoffman's bonus action can remove conditions as well if I remember correctly.

He can. But it's "conditional". Hah!

Requires having less Power Tokens on the target than on a friendly model you have Power Tokens on. This shouldn't be an issue for the most part, but it might require some work and timing to get it done.

There's also some questions regarding timing that I hope get hammered out.

[Franchute]

19 minutes ago, Morgan Vening said:

He can. But it's "conditional". Hah!

Requires having less Power Tokens on the target than on a friendly model you have Power Tokens on. This shouldn't be an issue for the most part, but it might require some work and timing to get it done.

There's also some questions regarding timing that I hope get hammered out.

Hahah!

Regarding timing: since you can target more than one model, what I was doing was to first remove tokens from the model from which I wanted to remove the condition so that it would have less tokens than another model nearby, allowing me to then give this model a token from the model nearby to remove the condition. Are you saying that this was not necessarily correct depending on how you interpret timing?

[Morgan Vening]

2 hours ago, Franchute said:

Hahah!

Regarding timing: since you can target more than one model, what I was doing was to first remove tokens from the model from which I wanted to remove the condition so that it would have less tokens than another model nearby, allowing me to then give this model a token from the model nearby to remove the condition. Are you saying that this was not necessarily correct depending on how you interpret timing?

It has to do with when things are locked in, and it's unclear when that happens.

"Choose up to two friendly models within range. Move one Power Token from each chosen model to a different model within range with less Power Tokens. Then, this model may end a Condition on each model that gained a Power Token."

The issues, depending on how you interpret whether transfers are simultaneous or consecutive, I covered in a post in the Guild Forum.

 

[Gnomezilla]

I can’t read that @Morgan Vening, could you give us the précis?

Frankly, at this point, with the addition not only of the automatons but also the general action, I’d be open to possibly reverting that to the ‘less restricted but take an Injured penalty for using it’ option. I threw my conniption fit back when condition removal was a 6ss investment for Guild instead of something your totem available for free could facilitate. (Which reminds me there’s another master which currently has a free action with a prerequisite he and his totem can’t fulfill alone—now to remember whom and hopefully get that mended. Put prerequisites on spammable actions, fine, but don’t hinder those 25% of available master actions you don’t get to attempt multiple times.)

[Morgan Vening]

19 minutes ago, Gnomezilla said:

I can’t read that @Morgan Vening, could you give us the précis?

Frankly, at this point, with the addition not only of the automatons but also the general action, I’d be open to possibly reverting that to the ‘less restricted but take an Injured penalty for using it’ option. I threw my conniption fit back when condition removal was a 6ss investment for Guild instead of something your totem available for free could facilitate. (Which reminds me there’s another master which currently has a free action with a prerequisite he and his totem can’t fulfill alone—now to remember whom and hopefully get that mended. Put prerequisites on spammable actions, fine, but don’t hinder those 25% of available master actions you don’t get to attempt multiple times.)

Here's the cut-n-paste.

Quote

 

"Choose up to two friendly models within range. Move one Power Token from each chosen model to a different model within range with less Power Tokens. Then, this model may end a Condition on each model that gained a Power Token."

So, we now know what the missing bit was. Not bad. Conditional, both due to opposition (crews devoted to Condition spread), and due to timing (Hoffman wanting to act early), but not bad.

Do wish it didn't have the "with less Power Tokens" requirement. Just makes thinks clunky. You want to drain two models with one PT, to give a model a fourth and fifth? Whatevs. There's no restriction on Transfer Power, so I'm not thinking it's needed here.

Also, it raises issues of timing.

I have two Guardians with 2PT. One Peacekeeper with one PT. Can they both move a PT to the Peacekeeper? Or do they do it one at a time, meaning the second Guardian can't because the Peacekeeper doesn't have less?

Or, same situation, but can the second Guardian give the first Guardian a PT? So that the Condition removal can apply to the first Guardian?

Or, I have one Guardian with 2PT, and a Peacekeeper with 1PT. I choose these two models. Guardian gives a PT to the Peacekeeper. Peacekeeper now with 2PT gives a PT back to the Guardian. Both get Condition Removal. Or does the "to a different model within range" mean "other than the two selected" (which would prohibit this), or does it mean "other than the model it's coming from" (which wouldn't).

 

 

•  

[Gnomezilla]

Yeah, just wiping out that subordinate clause wouldn’t break anything, would reduce confusion, and would reduce wordiness. Let’s campaign for it.

[Clockwork_Fish]

On 1/14/2019 at 9:09 AM, WWHSD said:

It was versatile for most of the closed beta but got a 1SS cost decrease and got the Augmented keyword near the end. That kept it the same cost to hire as it had been when it was Versatile for all of the masters but Hoffman. There were a handful of models across the different factions that got a similar treatment. 

Okay, that actually makes sense.

[mythicFOX]

<MODHAT> 

I've pinned this thread, and unpinned all the master specific M2e threads.

</MODHAT>

[Gnomezilla]

But do we get a pinned token for it?

Which reminds me. Steamfitter sculpts are super awesome but also super distinctive, so not good raw material for Arcanist proxy models. If I get the Other Side’s Kassa Okoye model, and plunk her down as an Arcanist, what would she make a good proxy for?

[Adran]

1 hour ago, Gnomezilla said:

But do we get a pinned token for it?

Which reminds me. Steamfitter sculpts are super awesome but also super distinctive, so not good raw material for Arcanist proxy models. If I get the Other Side’s Kassa Okoye model, and plunk her down as an Arcanist, what would she make a good proxy for?

Do you still want her to be usable in TOS? Because I can't think of an obvious 40mm model she could count for with out a bit of Stretching.  The easiest would be Sandeep or Carlos, I think

 

[Gnomezilla]

8 minutes ago, Adran said:

Do you still want her to be usable in TOS? Because I can't think of an obvious 40mm model she could count for with out a bit of Stretching.  The easiest would be Sandeep or Carlos, I think.

Oh. Right. I would have to re-base her, arachnid-and-swarm style. Magnets or custommeeple inserts.

[cromlyn]

Huh. Sandeep's third string of poison minions gets rafkin to join kudra and the poison gamin. Bit baffled why hes gone arcanist.

 

Mithridization for everyone!  Except sandeep who remains a little embarrassed by the idea.

[Adran]

50 minutes ago, cromlyn said:

Huh. Sandeep's third string of poison minions gets rafkin to join kudra and the poison gamin. Bit baffled why hes gone arcanist.

 

Mithridization for everyone!  Except sandeep who remains a little embarrassed by the idea.

I don't think rafkin has kept academic. He was never arcanist, just hirable by sandeep.

[cromlyn]

Any reason not to have neverborn beasts for marcus?

His box rattler has switched faction after all..