Small Mek Posted July 25, 2018 Report Share Posted July 25, 2018 Sad to see all those iconic masters leave... I just have to find a way to play dead man's hand Lilith with her avatar. It would look extremely fluffy coming back to malifaux to dissapear again. Stupid base sizes... Speaking of avatars, they are going back to paperweight state. Am I correct? (No more official proxying). Also... will the app be updated, or will it remain in 2nd edition? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LunarSol Posted July 25, 2018 Report Share Posted July 25, 2018 18 minutes ago, Teluriel12 said: I see a lot of maybes, absolutely not clear and so forth...If I wanted to gamble, I will play the lottery. So I have to spend time, money and effort to painting a crew, where I will be at the whim of an individual whether I can play at a tournament? Or do I now have to buy a backup crew + additional miniatures just to be sure that I can play at all. The arguments that you bring forward really dont help at all. While I sympathize, the best advice I can give right now is wait and see. Play with what you got and see where the new stuff works out. Even if Collodi ceases to be in M3E, he's one model in that box set. The rest might very well find a home, possibly with Dreamer or Zoraida or Pandora or who knows? It might be very possible to play with most of your existing stuff with just a model or two, which, in the wake of a major shake up, you'll likely be able to get relatively cheap from someone looking to sell something of theirs also affected by change. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malovane Posted July 25, 2018 Report Share Posted July 25, 2018 1 minute ago, Teluriel12 said: I see a lot of maybes, absolutely not clear and so forth...If I wanted to gamble, I will play the lottery. So I have to spend time, money and effort to painting a crew, where I will be at the whim of an individual whether I can play at a tournament? Or do I now have to buy a backup crew + additional miniatures just to be sure that I can play at all. The arguments that you bring forward really dont help at all. The only uncertainty is #2, as we don't currently know the future of the character or even much about M3E. #1 and #4 are absolutely certainties of use. I'm not sure how you would even begin to prepare for tournament competition without engaging in casual/practice play, at the very least to learn the rules and such. Regardless, lets assume you only ever play in tournaments. #3 is still a conditional certainty. You can improve that certainty by talking with the TO. You can further make #3 an absolute certainty by organizing the tournament yourself. Regardless, I see a lot of unfounded fear regarding your ability to make use of the purchase. I understand the concern regarding tournament use, but your purchase is only a waste if you let it become one. We don't even have a clear idea on the release window for M3E yet, so there is nothing stopping you from getting out and playing M2E now. You absolutely have the ability to get value from your spent money and effort. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mason Posted July 25, 2018 Report Share Posted July 25, 2018 6 minutes ago, Small Mek said: Speaking of avatars, they are going back to paperweight state. Am I correct? (No more official proxying). There are currently no plans to carry Avatars forward into 3rd edition. That doesn't mean that it won't (or will) happen in the future, just that at the moment, we're focusing on getting the core rules and models updated and balanced. 3 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patzer Posted July 25, 2018 Report Share Posted July 25, 2018 To everyone who got robbed of their favorit master (like me with Lilith), First, the handful of masters who arent getting m3e treatment from the get go might get it further along. We got more masters during the whole of m2e, and I think it is safe to say that the ones that is buried as of now will probably be the ones that the designers will think about first when its time to add some new masters to the game. So dont threat just yet. Second, there is so much new stuff to try!!! Have a flexible mindset about it, you loose something you like, but you get to play a bunch of cool new masters and versions of old masters. There is a ton to get excited about even if you feel that you have been left out. And, if you tag a long for the m3e ride an old friend might be waiting for you a few stops a head 2 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malovane Posted July 25, 2018 Report Share Posted July 25, 2018 1 minute ago, Mason said: There are currently no plans to carry Avatars forward into 3rd edition. That doesn't mean that it won't (or will) happen in the future, just that at the moment, we're focusing on getting the core rules and models updated and balanced. Rather expected, good to know, but still sad to hear. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LunarSol Posted July 25, 2018 Report Share Posted July 25, 2018 1 minute ago, Malovane said: Rather expected, good to know, but still sad to hear. The transformation mechanic is so cool in theory, but I get the struggles with it. I have kind of wondered if it could be done in a way where every Master avatar'd into the faction Emissary. Not sure how exactly that would work though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fetid Strumpet Posted July 25, 2018 Report Share Posted July 25, 2018 The only thing I don’t like from the initial news dump are two things: 1: like others I don’t like invalidating a previous choice. The story can certainly continue and have those masters be playable. 2: unless the release is far further along than I suspect, or unless the closed beta is going to be short and a massive open will be coming soon, I suspect, but certainly could be wrong, that interest in the old edition will tank until the new is revealed. Other than that love everything I’ve heard. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gnomezilla Posted July 25, 2018 Report Share Posted July 25, 2018 One thing I missed: if Viktoria is Viktoria no matter what, you can use ANY of the Viktoria models that strike your fancy, in any combination of silly mascot suit or punk rock armor or battle bikini. No more need to distinguish Blood as the less armored one or the kneeling one. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
allyouneed Posted July 25, 2018 Report Share Posted July 25, 2018 Is anyone in the beta already? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyris Posted July 25, 2018 Report Share Posted July 25, 2018 1 minute ago, Fetid Strumpet said: The only thing I don’t like from the initial news dump are two things: 1: like others I don’t like invalidating a previous choice. The story can certainly continue and have those masters be playable. 2: unless the release is far further along than I suspect, or unless the closed beta is going to be short and a massive open will be coming soon, I suspect, but certainly could be wrong, that interest in the old edition will tank until the new is revealed. Other than that love everything I’ve heard. Honestly, given the scale of what they're trying to do I could easily see testing going on for a year or more. 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malovane Posted July 25, 2018 Report Share Posted July 25, 2018 Just now, LunarSol said: The transformation mechanic is so cool in theory, but I get the struggles with it. I have kind of wondered if it could be done in a way where every Master avatar'd into the faction Emissary. Not sure how exactly that would work though. The mechanic/concept was cool, but very janky, while also extremely unbalanced. I always wished they would have just been alternate versions of the character more akin to the versioning of warlocks/warcasters in Warmahordes. If we can have masters "retire" why not have them undergo dramatic changes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zalabar Posted July 25, 2018 Report Share Posted July 25, 2018 31 minutes ago, Malovane said: Even after the release of M3E, it doesn't stop you from playing M2E. Sorry, had to highlight this one; this argument is objectively false. It has been brought up regularly with miniature games and edition changes; I've seen it for Warmahordes v1 to 2, then 2 to 3, Malifaux 1 to 2, and WFB to AoS. I could say it about Relic Knights too, but someone would've had to play Relic Knights. The cultural pressures of tourney play, new shiny models, new rule support, and comparative ease of pick up games grind out the older version every time. These games are not RPGs, where the competitive players are counteracted by the difficulty in picking up a new system, and there's not a terribly functional concept for competitive play, and pick up games aren't really a thing. You noted Necromunda, which is a really good counter example. I am curious how many people play Chainmail. Or more pertinently, Warhammer 40k 6th ed. Or Squats. To place the onus on someone to compete against a newer edition of the same game because they're frustrated by a surprise sunset on their purchase is not cool. Please stop that one. I disagree on 2 as a viable argument, as it essentially gets to the core of the concerns; the impression is clearly that these purchases will not be supported when the assertion is that they would be. Telling them that they might get support is kinda missing the reason they're annoyed. Arguement 3 (Dead Hand and TO etc) are addressed elsewhere, but generally you get more people playing with accepted tourney structure and minimal adjustments. Unless there is a very compelling counter reason, Dead Hands are probably going to be exceptions. Arguement 4 is true. Of course, so were Avatars. I can't say I've used one outside of the beta test, but I might be very wrong here. What have you seen? And to the general thread, 3rd edition looks awesome, I love how the cards appear to have taken cues from TOS, and I want those faction headers as wall scrolls. I am a bit concerned with the Malifaux's app's future. I use it religiously and got more than a few friends to buy the decks. What plans does Wyrd have with that regarding 3rd ed? 2 8 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malovane Posted July 25, 2018 Report Share Posted July 25, 2018 1 minute ago, Kyris said: Honestly, given the scale of what they're trying to do I could easily see testing going on for a year or more. Gencon 2019 would be my earliest guess. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Venomsuit Posted July 25, 2018 Report Share Posted July 25, 2018 5 minutes ago, allyouneed said: Is anyone in the beta already? They said it's going to start shortly after Gencon, so I assume that's when invites would start going out. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bedjy Posted July 25, 2018 Report Share Posted July 25, 2018 @MasonPlease Wyrd keep the standard card size ! I like to keep my material in a perfect shape and I don't think there are sleeves for the card size you've chosen. Anyway, fantastic work, I'm really looking forward to testing all those ! 2 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LunarSol Posted July 25, 2018 Report Share Posted July 25, 2018 5 minutes ago, allyouneed said: Is anyone in the beta already? If they were, announcing so publicly would probably be a decent way to get kicked out. 3 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teluriel12 Posted July 25, 2018 Report Share Posted July 25, 2018 2 minutes ago, Zalabar said: Sorry, had to highlight this one; this argument is objectively false. It has been brought up regularly with miniature games and edition changes; I've seen it for Warmahordes v1 to 2, then 2 to 3, Malifaux 1 to 2, and WFB to AoS. I could say it about Relic Knights too, but someone would've had to play Relic Knights. The cultural pressures of tourney play, new shiny models, new rule support, and comparative ease of pick up games grind out the older version every time. These games are not RPGs, where the competitive players are counteracted by the difficulty in picking up a new system, and there's not a terribly functional concept for competitive play, and pick up games aren't really a thing. You noted Necromunda, which is a really good counter example. I am curious how many people play Chainmail. Or more pertinently, Warhammer 40k 6th ed. Or Squats. To place the onus on someone to compete against a newer edition of the same game because they're frustrated by a surprise sunset on their purchase is not cool. Please stop that one. I disagree on 2 as a viable argument, as it essentially gets to the core of the concerns; the impression is clearly that these purchases will not be supported when the assertion is that they would be. Telling them that they might get support is kinda missing the reason they're annoyed. Arguement 3 (Dead Hand and TO etc) are addressed elsewhere, but generally you get more people playing with accepted tourney structure and minimal adjustments. Unless there is a very compelling counter reason, Dead Hands are probably going to be exceptions. Arguement 4 is true. Of course, so were Avatars. I can't say I've used one outside of the beta test, but I might be very wrong here. What have you seen? Fully agree with this...also: Ive just asked for some kind of positive feedback/story to people who are in my situation from Mason. Im sad to say Ive received as only reply”you can use Collodi in casual play and in tournaments which will allow dead mans hand”...not even a glimmer off “were sorry about your situation”. 1 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mason Posted July 25, 2018 Report Share Posted July 25, 2018 4 minutes ago, bedjy said: @MasonPlease Wyrd keep the standard card size ! I like to keep my material in a perfect shape and I don't think there are sleeves for the card size you've chosen. There are! Item one on the checklist, that was. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lusciousmccabe Posted July 25, 2018 Report Share Posted July 25, 2018 20 minutes ago, Small Mek said: Sad to see all those iconic masters leave... I just have to find a way to play dead man's hand Lilith with her avatar. It would look extremely fluffy coming back to malifaux to dissapear again. Stupid base sizes... Master Nekima proxy much? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lusciousmccabe Posted July 25, 2018 Report Share Posted July 25, 2018 6 minutes ago, Zalabar said: Sorry, had to highlight this one; this argument is objectively false. It has been brought up regularly with miniature games and edition changes; I've seen it for Warmahordes v1 to 2, then 2 to 3, Malifaux 1 to 2, and WFB to AoS. I could say it about Relic Knights too, but someone would've had to play Relic Knights. I played Relic Knights! ....once. 😎 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LunarSol Posted July 25, 2018 Report Share Posted July 25, 2018 Just now, lusciousmccabe said: I played Relic Knights! ....once. 😎 I actually assembled my KS stuff last week after someone was looking for a game. The new edition is not too bad, honestly. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daniello_s Posted July 25, 2018 Report Share Posted July 25, 2018 12 minutes ago, allyouneed said: Is anyone in the beta already? Even if the you know, NDA Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erik1978 Posted July 25, 2018 Report Share Posted July 25, 2018 Quote It's really cool you can take two masters together. I can't wait to see how this works! This is something I fail to see improving the game. Right now, 2 Masters in the same crew would be impossible to predict and too powerful to play, due to the many combinations and the power of just 1 master. Feel like taking on Zoraida and Pandora at the same time? Or do you feel like controlling them at the same time? Your mind would explode. If that's actually playable in 3rd I fear the game has become very simple compared to 2nd. I really hope you prove me wrong, like the other hired Master has limited power in some way, to bring it down to earth a bit. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gnomezilla Posted July 25, 2018 Report Share Posted July 25, 2018 7 minutes ago, Malovane said: Gencon 2019 would be my earliest guess. Mine too, and to be honest I’m not sure I want to commit my time to a beta that long. I want to wring the last drops out of second edition. And there’s at least one Lilith player in my meta who is likely committed to playing her as much as possible before the roof of Nythera shuts over her head. It’s dependent on the meta, I suppose. If other folks have applied, then I’ll be testing alongside them. I just hope we do t do so straight through for a full year, even though the game deserves it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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