I think it's time to do something with Sandeep...

[Rillan]

4 minutes ago, Ludvig said:

@Rillan

To you filth it up as well or do you play more easygoing lists compared to the Sandeep player?

We have a lot of guild here so min 5 ignoring all reducions from a Queller is the norm rather than an exception for me. Sam behind a house threatens the entire center of the board Sonnia puts up a flame wall between Sandeep and the mages so he can't ignore conditions before seting him on fire and companioning to Sam with debt for example. Peacekeeper that is immune to conditions with nimble and extra damage is also and option.

Not sure how other factions would handle it since I mostly play with and against guild but Reva ignores everyting and can probably hit him from her deployment. Nico is Nico, neverborn can spam a few stitched and steal actions with Collodi, force activaion order in a number of ways, suck stuff in with Lilith's push at ca 7 or if their wp is too good for tangle or use Lilitu pounce traps. Belles, A&D, fast + nimble Yas. Those are a few things that should outrange him. Walking something up into a gunline is rarely a good plan regardless of who you are facing and I believe most factions have decent min damage and ways to bypass reductions as well as condition removal.

This year our community got in pretty slowly. We don't have tested book 5 models yet and its hard to pull out Sandeep player since he claimed he quits Malifaux. So can't tell u nothing about Book 5 vs Sandeep.

In previous games it was like Sandeep on turn 1 summons bunch of gamins and just out-activates u so it's not so easy to catch him as u described.

I agree u offered good options and same goes against u when opponent knows what are u going to do.

 

[daniello_s]

14 minutes ago, Ludvig said:

 I'm sure Sandeep against pre errata Levi would be an interesting match.

Most definitely it would.

[Ludvig]

@Rillan A lot of masters can be really disheartening when you aren't super hardcore yourself but are trying to have a fun casual game. It's a tricky balance to walk. As a decidely casual player these days after trying to be competitive I feel that the conception of being unbeatable can be bad enough when you are trying to get people interested. It's a bit tricky to balance against what tournament players ask for.

[Rillan]

6 minutes ago, Ludvig said:

@Rillan A lot of masters can be really disheartening when you aren't super hardcore yourself but are trying to have a fun casual game. It's a tricky balance to walk. As a decidely casual player these days after trying to be competitive I feel that the conception of being unbeatable can be bad enough when you are trying to get people interested. It's a bit tricky to balance against what tournament players ask for.

U misunderstood. It's not me quiting, Sandeep player left us. But i agree with u. (Or i misunderstood your point) As far as i remember Malifaux states that whole masters in game are playable but tricky horse is once u come in game u find out that 50% masters are outsiders 40% are good and 10% are dominant. New players don't think about it. They like their models and u don't play hardcore mode unless it necessary but with time all find out that some are good and some bit weaker. Of course skill is important and when u compare two enough skilled players single mistake comes to a win/loss result, but for newbies when they find out that there are masters that can beat almost anyone its huge. And today's Sandeep's nerf theme hysteria proves it.

I would be really happy if Wyrd gave to whole masters same impact on the game like Sandeep has but if  it wont happen then i support those guys that Sandeep should have weak point.

[Ludvig]

I meant stuff like running into full powered Sonnia or Nico your first few games can make people drop the game entirely, I imagine Sandeep could feel the same. Players with solid experience will be more inclined to try and find a sollution and have the models to support some experimentation. It sucks to have to tell someone that their current colection is the scissors to the other players rock.

Sounds like we agree, I just wasn't being clear.

[daniello_s]

1 hour ago, Ludvig said:

@Rillan A lot of masters can be really disheartening when you aren't super hardcore yourself but are trying to have a fun casual game. It's a tricky balance to walk. As a decidely casual player these days after trying to be competitive I feel that the conception of being unbeatable can be bad enough when you are trying to get people interested. It's a bit tricky to balance against what tournament players ask for.

That's true. When i started playing Malifaux I was running Viks and my fellow players were so unhappy with me sling-shooting Pokey into their models that two or three guys left the game. Really. I know Viks are far far from being OP but for new players even such small issues can be enough to run off from playing Malifaux (not to mention if they see current Nico, Sandeep or few other masters).

[Freman]

On the Levi subject, the reason he went to nothing is because his card, including his damage tracks, was originally written with the assumption that you'd be burning his wounds to get positive flips. That's why the damage tracks all very low for a master (except his melee severe). With channelling reduced to one incidence of focus he's hitting minimum damage more often, where 1 or 2 just isn't enough. He needs new damage tracks, possibly 2/4/6 for melee, and 3/4/5 for unmaking.

[hemgath]

My personal advice is :
Just an advice, after reading all this theads (don't wan't to make more controversy just wan't to give a personal advice ) Sandeep is very strong and i really love to play him... but:

-If Sandeep is in the viewfinder, we certainly must take a look too to Shenlong, Colody, Zipp, Nelly and Nicodem. For have and equitable balanced errata...

-Global attack on:  Sandeep, Oxfordian, Myranda / IE (and certainly steamfitter in a few time) can disgust arcanist player to play Arcanist or simply disgust them to play M2E... It's look like a Popular Anger. Until the next

- We certainly must wait during the year for look real Sandeep result (actualy is really not first in UK or simply on Logfaux), for have a real concrete global analysis.

- Maybe take a look for the Arcanist Leader actualy played... and try to balanced "the rest" for help arcanist to try other way than "Auto Sandeep Crew" (Ironside / Marcus in secondary plan, and nearby no place for other master in competitive way)

Playing agains't Sandeep my 2 cent:
- One of the best way for beat sandeep is clearly destroy is hand...
- Cut the beacon LOS (like cut the LOS for warding rune).
- One other thing, try to don't take care about Banasuva... and target real things on the table Generaly, don't play agains't sanddep crew, just try to win
- Remember: No gamin in 6 from Sanddep casting  point = No banasuva
- If you planed to have a sandeep match... Sue & Taelor are very good models wathever your faction... ^^
- Sandeep is susceptible to condition, particulary like paralyzed (or mood swing)
- You can make very terrible things with Obey or Alpha capa
 

[daniello_s]

4 minutes ago, hemgath said:

-If Sandeep is in the viewfinder, we certainly must take a look too to Shenlong, Colody, Zipp, Nelly and Nicodem. For have and equitable balanced errata...

Patience my young Padawan. Patience...

Their time will come...

😆