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Returning lucius buys


izikial

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next month when the Guild Investigator comes out I think that will be a good buy. Terracotta Warrior if you don't have one- even though it went up a point with the new errata I think it's still worth it to swap upgrades around and protect one of your beater minions or enforcers. Arguably Lucius might be better in Guild (Witchling Thralls and Monster Hunters) but I like him in Neverborn too though Neverborn doesn't have the same level of beaters that Guild has... I like Stitched Together with him, I am considering picking up Ferdinand Vogel (Arcanist Mimic) when he comes out too. 

 

I could also see some potential for Illuminated as well though I don't know that it wouldn't be better with Lynch. 

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Haha my bad, totally spaced on that. Anyways, Rugarou or Illuminated are great as minion beater models to give issue command to. Autumn Knights (I prefer Thorn with him as she's fairly self-sufficient and give me cards (which Lucius loves to have) but push-pounce combo with the Tooth is also really good.) Changelings are really good. Mr Tannen has a lot of utility. I really like corrupted hounds as there's a lot of little tricks you can run with them. I've heard he also likes Stitched Together.

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I can second the recommendations for the Autumn Knights (particularly The Claw, since his ranged attack benefits from Elite Training). If you get them, Master Queeg can be a good choice if you don't already have him, as he can give them extra 0-actions and is available with Surprisingly Loyal.

Terracotta Warriors are still worthwhile. You can switch in corner-case upgrades like Legalese as necessary, and they're excellent as protectors. The card cost  involved is minimal if you take Deep Pockets (his new 2 SS upgrade).

Rougarou can work very well with Lucius and Queeg, but you really want to have scheme markers and models with pushes or Lures to make the most of them. For those reasons, they go very well with the Autumn Knights, all of whom can drag models in and put out scheme markers with particular attacks. If you had to pick between them, I'd get the Knights first.

In my view, Lucius doesn't really need Will-o-the-Wisps (peons), the Bandersnatch (buried most of the time), Cyclops (enforcers) or Hinamatsu (not that it's out yet). Serena Bowman might be interesting, but I don't think she's worth taking in Lucius over something like a Doppelganger. He might be good with Bultungin (when they're released), since he can push them with Issue Command and switch places with What Lackeys Are For. I don't really know enough about Grootslang and Ferdinand Vogel to comment.

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20 hours ago, Haagrum said:

Terracotta Warriors are still worthwhile. You can switch in corner-case upgrades like Legalese as necessary, and they're excellent as protectors. The card cost  involved is minimal if you take Deep Pockets (his new 2 SS upgrade).

I agree, but I still struggle with it. My struggle isn't the issue of 6 pts vs 5 pts; it's the overall issue of 6 pts that aren't "doing much" for me vs something like a Stitched Together that is bringing a lot of potential damage output. I agree with the upgrade swap- first he is going to swap out Surprisingly Loyal for something else (Pact/Aether Connection/Condescending) and then later can switch me to Legalese. He can also do some other upgrade swap tricks for me elsewhere in my list as well. However, past that he is doing Mold of the Other each turn to protect either my Doppleganger or a minion which can be valuable but he has got to stay within Rg: 6 to cast it and within 12" and LOS for them to use Ancient Protection.... these aren't impossible or even really challenging if I am not playing a real aggressive rush but are limitations.

Past that (which arguably is quite a bit) he isn't really doing anything. Granted the things he is doing may be really useful but he doesn't really have any good damage output. He isn't that survivable (WD: 4) so even with Armor +1 he still goes down to two hits from anything that matters and then he isn't around when I need him to switch me to Legalese. 

If I don't take him then I lose some flexibility with upgrade swaps, some tricks, some damage prevention on some key models; but I don't need to take Surprisingly Loyal in the first place (he was my only out of faction in one version of my standard list though this will change once Guild Investigators come out) and can just take Aether Connection/Pact/or Condescending to begin with and not need to switch and I can take another Stitched for punch or two Corrupted Hounds or one Big Beater for some alpha strike capability in addition to minion tricks. 

I am mixed on the issue and unfortunately get more theory-faux than opportunities to play real games and test it out enough times to get the information needed to make an informed decision. 

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53 minutes ago, thewrathchilde said:

I agree, but I still struggle with it.

<snip>

I am mixed on the issue and unfortunately get more theory-faux than opportunities to play real games and test it out enough times to get the information needed to make an informed decision. 

No argument there. Terracotta Warriors are not auto-includes for Lucius, by any means. However, they offer a lot to a Neverborn Lucius which no other model can provide. In a pinch, they can also do extra damage with their self-damaging trigger, and they are surprisingly durable with damage reduction, decent Df, and Issue Command's heal trigger.

The thread was about good options for Lucius from Waves 4 and 5. Terracotta Warriors are definitely worth considering, if you're after a 6 SS toolkit rather than a beatstick.

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On 1/15/2018 at 2:27 AM, Ludvig said:

Bultingin seem tailored to Lucius but haven't been released. Try get to take a pretty badass atta k when they are pushed which combos well with his built in push.

I've proxied Bultungin with Lucius and they're amazing with him.

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7 hours ago, Angelshard said:

Remember that terracotta can throw a card to avoid the damage from his trigger. That makes him quite effective if you have some :ram in your hand.

No it can't? At the very least it is highly debated and should lead to a judge being called over to settle it. His trigger says that the model acts as if it had been the original target and the terracotta can't use that ability if it the attack was targeting it. What does the text "as if it had been the original target" accomplish if it doesn't affect abilities that care who was the target?

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Ok im looking at getting tatania so that gets me some of the autume guys and girls. 

Like the rugaru idea, but they seem interchangeable so there lower on the list

Love ferdinand vogal but half of him dosnt realy do anything for lucius and the othere half isnt to great as it is a bit lucius light. So hes a latter buy

Bultunginginthing will be on the list when its released

Teracota worriors are just not appealing to me. The sentiment above i agree with that they seem meh except for one thing. And asteticly i dont hate them they just dont fit with my image. 

Thanks guys

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1 hour ago, Ludvig said:

No it can't? At the very least it is highly debated and should lead to a judge being called over to settle it. His trigger says that the model acts as if it had been the original target and the terracotta can't use that ability if it the attack was targeting it. What does the text "as if it had been the original target" accomplish if it doesn't affect abilities that care who was the target?

Are you talking about the Terracotta Warriors :ram trigger "Until I shatter" on their Clay Fist attack?  Because I'm pretty sure that's what Angelshard is referring to and it says nothing about changing targets. 

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38 minutes ago, Durza said:

Are you talking about the Terracotta Warriors :ram trigger "Until I shatter" on their Clay Fist attack?  Because I'm pretty sure that's what Angelshard is referring to and it says nothing about changing targets. 

I thoughr we were referencing Lucius' defensive trigger from surprisingly loyal that lets you put the damage and effects on a guardsman or mimic instead of Lucius. My bad.

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Lucius is better with Fae than mimics a lot of the time as they often benefit more from his + flips.

There are exceptions like Graves, doppelganger and Candy who "can" benefit from his buff but for the most part mimics are missing a 6-8 stone minion "beater".

This leads to his crew being largely reliant on either Lynchs addicts, Titanias Fae gaurdsmen or lilith/Neimas Nephilim for hitting power.

The strongest combinations I've found with him in neverborn make use of rougarou, Knights,  Queeg and then a mix of hounds, Pathfinders,  mounted guard and occasionally the emissary.

I look forward to bultingin and vogels release.

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I hate auto correct etc...

I dislike mercs with neverborn but can imagine them being impressive.

With the ram trigger handing out focus I personally prefer explosions, love Pathfinders for that especially with Queeg.

I was going suggest the specialist for blasts if you must hire mercs and remembered he's an enforcer.

I also enjoy running swamp fiends with Lucius for his expeditions -one conversion I want to do will be a bayou Lucius holding a handkerchief to his mask in repulsion.

Minion wise this "can" be interesting with silurids continous attack, waldgiests range and an additional way of throwing Juju etc round the board.

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  • 2 weeks later...

@Vorschlag Would you recommend getting the Queen's Return box, or just the Autumn Knights box? Is Aeslin, in your opinion, a viable Henchman in this set-up? That reminds me, still need to do that Autumn Lucius conversion we talked about last year.

Performer is the only Merc I've ever cared about for Lucius, myself.

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Aeslin is great "if" you are going for Lucius emissary build and focusing on the multiple free attacks with backstab.

She "can" also be great with set ups for hound charges.

Other than that it's just the benefit of having the Fae queen as an alternative leader who will enjoy the company of all the Fae Lucius already likes.

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24 minutes ago, Vorschlag said:

Aeslin is great "if" you are going for Lucius emissary build and focusing on the multiple free attacks with backstab.

She "can" also be great with set ups for hound charges.

Other than that it's just the benefit of having the Fae queen as an alternative leader who will enjoy the company of all the Fae Lucius already likes.

Thanks, that sounds like a lot of fun. I've been meaning to use more Backstab.

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39 minutes ago, Vorschlag said:

Aeslin is great "if" you are going for Lucius emissary build and focusing on the multiple free attacks with backstab.

Sorry, can you spell this combo out a bit more? I'm having trouble seeing what makes it amazing. 

How do you get free Backstabs? 

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