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January 2018 Errata

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8 hours ago, Treehouse said:

@Merchant

Infinity also has streamlined weapons. And you have to print out a list every time you play beforehand, otherwise you will have to browse through all the options available.

Infinitys weapon list is a faction list in itself. It's hardly streamlined. They had a streamlined weapon list back at the start of N2, but it's gotten increasing bloated every book. It's gotten even worse in N3 adding more types, and some skills also affecting how a weapon works (Breaker Rifle, a Rifle with a new ammo type, on a model with Marksmanship works differently to a model without Marksmanship). It's not umcommon for my weapon listing on my printed army list to be bigger than my actual list. And then you still need to cross reference things in the book unless since there's so many ammo types and skills that affect how things work.

Malifaux might have entirely custom rules for every model, so a model with a pistol might have a different Sh stat, damage track, built in effects and triggers compared to the guy next to him with a pistol, but at least it's all right there on the card in front of you. The only time you need to check the rulebook is for core game rules, rather than model rules.

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So further review.  

Still disappointed that the Arcanist got more out-faction balance (which is good) but no real in-faction balancing.  I'd be curious to know what other faction players think of the out/in-faction balancing.

Surprised not to see these models:

  • Mouse in Arcanists, he is simply over-costed and awful
  • Gremlins - well a notable model is the Bayou Gremlin, very good for 3SS.  It was not directly touched but had a semi-errata given other models (notably Guild Guard and Desperate Merc) became 3SS.  So now they are no longer a truly uniquely cheap include.  In-faction wise they are not as much of a problem next to certain other now cheaper models now.  So maybe not as auto-take and unique as before.  Still surprised they were not touched.  Changes really hurt the Stuffed Piglet which recently got more expensive and now sees a huge swath of better competition in the 3-4SS Gremlin range.
  • Not sure in Guild, they seem to have done pretty well.
  • Neverborn - the Wicked Doll seems like it could have used some help.
  • Outcasts - not sure if their is anything huge here, I thought it seemed well-rounded.
  • Rezzers - I still think that Rotten Belles need -1 Wd (down from 7 to 6).   
  • TT - Orian seems like she could really, really use help especially given certain other TT's got cheaper, Beckoners got cheaper and the mercenary Performers were untouched.

Surprised to see all of the Emissaries were left alone.  These guys are all pretty much a mixed bag and I think need some real work to balance across the faction emissaries and with regards to the 0SS upgrades within the faction.  These guys are still problematic.

Generally like the broad direction of the errata.  Obviously its impact in conjunction with GG2018 is going to be critical.  What will the meta be saying in June?  

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Wicked Doll is in an even worse place now. At 4ss it was already rarely hired, but just 1ss more for a Bunraku? Even those that hired Wicked Dolls before will probably just hire Bunraku now. Even more baffling is none of the abilities that summon a Wicked Doll use its cost, so dropping to 3ss would only affecting hiring.

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That is the indirect nerf in action, in effect when a particular model gets a point change then the comparable models around its value get stronger or weaker in proportion to the change of the other model.

So yeah the Wicked Doll got worse because a similar but generally superior model, which also has the same crew synergies, got cheaper while the poor Doll did not.  Same action as what is a kinda nerf for the Bayou Gremlins because they are not the only 3SS significant minion any more and overall a number of mid-range and cheaper models got point reduced meaning the Gremlin spam lists are going to be (1) more diverse and not mostly Bayou's and (2) will face more activation number competition from other factions, notably Outcasts and Guild.  

I'm not actually a huge NB player so I'm not sure how the Wicked Doll would roll as a 3SS spam significant minion.  

But I'll note that now Gremlins, Guild and Outcasts have 3SS significant minions available for enlarging crews.  Rezzers with their huge summoning powers rarely had real activation control/outnumbering issues.  So Arcanists, TT and NB seem to be the crews which face the points/model number crunch the worst now.  Although I've read (but not seen and confirmed) that activation control is less of a thing in GG2018.

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Neverborn have a couple of 3ss minions already. Wisps are 3ss minions that have some good utility such as controlling enemy AP, though not Significant, and Corrupted Hounds which lose Insignificance if there are more than 1 and they're within 5" of each other, which are rather speedy and good for schemes.

I doubt Wicked Dolls being 3ss would do much on the low cost spamming front.

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10 hours ago, Seadhna said:

Are we sure that the no reduction clause has been removed from Storm Misaki?

Yeah I was wondering the same thing. That 4" reduction in range fixes nothing.

A friend of mine had a really good idea to fixing it actually: Crows can make you cheat damage in spite of minus flips but another suit is required to throw our those blast markers. 

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8 minutes ago, Erik1978 said:

Yeah I was wondering the same thing. That 4" reduction in range fixes nothing.

A friend of mine had a really good idea to fixing it actually: Crows can make you cheat damage in spite of minus flips but another suit is required to throw our those blast markers. 

I would say the text Aaron posted is the whole new thing, it replaces the old ability - shorter range, no word about irreducable damage, so it's gone.

Trigger is seperate so still there :)

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8 hours ago, -Loki- said:

Neverborn have a couple of 3ss minions already. Wisps are 3ss minions that have some good utility such as controlling enemy AP, though not Significant, and Corrupted Hounds which lose Insignificance if there are more than 1 and they're within 5" of each other, which are rather speedy and good for schemes.

I doubt Wicked Dolls being 3ss would do much on the low cost spamming front.

I'm not sure I would take Wickeds even at 3SS so there it's a bit of a wash, I think.

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3 hours ago, Tris said:

I would say the text Aaron posted is the whole new thing, it replaces the old ability - shorter range, no word about irreducable damage, so it's gone.

Trigger is seperate so still there :)

When I look at the upgrade in the app, it says "This model gains the following ability:" Then some text that is too small to read. And then the trigger with the cheat in spite of minus flips. Can anyone read that ability line?

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7 minutes ago, Erik1978 said:

When I look at the upgrade in the app, it says "This model gains the following ability:" Then some text that is too small to read. And then the trigger with the cheat in spite of minus flips. Can anyone read that ability line?

Don`t have the app myself, are you able to copy that text?

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Glad to see this erratum.

Some models were left alone (wicked dolls, young nephilims...) but perhaps it was to find them a better place in the faction next year (eg: perhaps it's not a cost problem).

In NB, McTavish was not problematic at his former cost, same as Nurses but hey, most swampfiend henchmen got -1SS so I won't complain.

Seeing a little love for Cojo and the Big cobra (can never remember his name) is very nice, although a damage dealing enforcer for 6SS is quite a bargain.

In brief I can't wait to try old toys. Thx Wyrd.

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I like it overall. I think cost adjustment is a nice way to breathe life into dusty models and put the squeeze on auto includes.

My wish list for models that need a SS +/-

- Wastrels; I don't think 3ss wastrels would be broken

+ Francisco and Papa Loco; I doubt a SS increase on both would affect them too much

+ Sue up to 9ss

- Mouse 3ss cuz I'd like to use him for once, and then Troubleshooters can join Bound By Law as having every model in it Erratad :P (if we include temporary shielding)

- Mannequins 3ss

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41 minutes ago, meows0r said:

I like it overall. I think cost adjustment is a nice way to breathe life into dusty models and put the squeeze on auto includes.

My wish list for models that need a SS +/-

- Wastrels; I don't think 3ss wastrels would be broken

+ Francisco and Papa Loco; I doubt a SS increase on both would affect them too much

+ Sue up to 9ss

- Mouse 3ss cuz I'd like to use him for once, and then Troubleshooters can join Bound By Law as having every model in it Erratad :P (if we include temporary shielding)

- Mannequins 3ss

If the increase on Loco and Francisco wouldn't affect them why bother? ;)

Loco is played with 1 or 2 masters, is easy to exploit and kind of meh since Hold This Change

Francisco is basically 9 because Wade In is stapled onto him ;)

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Wait. In this errata only cost change? Old "rule" is broken: all henchmen have an amount of a cost and a cache what 13 equaled (except for henchmen with cost 0). Why the cost of henchman changed and there are no changes of a cache?

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2 minutes ago, Necris45 said:

Wait. In this errata only cost change? Old "rule" is broken: all henchmen have an amount of a cost and a cache what 13 equaled (except for henchmen with cost 0). Why the cost of henchman changed and there are no changes of a cache?

It was mentioned up-thread, but they said that caches would adjust to reflect this.

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So with the power creep and now this cost reduction, I'm curious what this means for the game. As a company this seems like a solid way to sell more models. However are we going to see more spam in lists? Is the average model count going up by one or 2? How would this affect average game time? I'll be interested to see the results.

 

All that being said, I still don't see TT's henchmen being played any more. They went from bad to very situational.  

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Im fine with the point changes. The only thing I'm annoyed about is that my alt Rasputina set just showed up. Because of casting issues, Wyrd was nice enough to give us a bonus model, Festivus Arborus which counts as an ice golem. His card is now wrong. Seeing as you were just creating this model in December, was there no way to give him the new point cost of an ice golem, or were these erratas done over christmas holidays?

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12 minutes ago, Dstinct said:

 Seeing as you were just creating this model in December, was there no way to give him the new point cost of an ice golem, or were these erratas done over christmas holidays?

The  cards where likely printed months and months ago.

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On 1/8/2018 at 7:22 AM, WWHSD said:

It seems like having substantial changes via errata makes more sense during the summer instead of at the same time that the new gaining grounds drops. Hiring costs are fairly easy to predict the effect of so won’t cause a huge swing either way.

I'm assuming the reason is twofold. One, that Gaining Grounds as some suggest with defense of the Guild Guard change, is built on things working a certain way. And the other being that making sure all of the year's big events all have a consistent scheme set. Sure, you could have the GenCon 2018 and Adepticon 2019 be the single run, but it makes it simpler for Gaining Grounds 18 to be valid from early 2018 to the end of 2018, rather than from mid 2018 to mid 2019. Avoids confusion.

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