A sneak peak to errata

[trikk]

40 minutes ago, FunWithKnives said:

No SS cashe increase for VS 

 

I play against a competitive VS and man, he hurts as hell even with the 1 cache o0.

 

9 minutes ago, Zebo said:

Well, probably only a nerdrage, but I've been facing Marcus crews the most, and I'm not really confortable with Trappers being more expensive than Cojo or the Razorspine Rattler, and costing the same than the Slateridge Mauler. With Sh 5, the main function of my Trappers was to force my opponent to waste cards. 

 

But well, the life continues and the lists evolves. Bas things happens.

I see/use Trappers pretty extensively. I have at least one in every OC list and I fielded 2 with Nellie quite often. I`ve never seen anyone good use the two mentioned above. Also they are not Mercenaries which means they have a lot less usages.

[Zebo]

Seeing the Katanaka Sniper profile, probably the Trapper cost should be 7ss, but I feel that Marcus crews were really strong, and Von Schill's quite more weak. With this last errata Marcus crews have been improved, while Von Schill's have been nerfed (always talking about Freikorps crews). 

 

Also, with 3ss Desperate Mercs I doubt my Freikorpsmann will see many games. 

[trikk]

6 minutes ago, Zebo said:

Seeing the Katanaka Sniper profile, probably the Trapper cost should be 7ss, but I feel that Marcus crews were really strong, and Von Schill's quite more weak. With this last errata Marcus crews have been improved, while Von Schill's have been nerfed (always talking about Freikorps crews). 

 

Also, with 3ss Desperate Mercs I doubt my Freikorpsmann will see many games. 

How many crews included the Rattler and Cojo?

[Zebo]

About 75% of the games I've played versus Marcus included at least one of them (or both), and 90% included de Hoarcat. We usually don't play very competitive (as I've been saying, I play almost exclusively Freikorps models) and I've won and lost versus lists with them. 

 

Also, I've never seen anyone (out of me) using the Specialist. That means that he should cost less than the Trapper? 

[trikk]

3 minutes ago, Zebo said:

About 75% of the games I've played versus Marcus included at least one of them (or both), and 90% included de Hoarcat. We usually don't play very competitive (as I've been saying, I play almost exclusively Freikorps models) and I've won and lost versus lists with them. 

 

Also, I've never seen anyone (out of me) using the Specialist. That means that he should cost less than the Trapper? 

You misread my argument. Did the decrease in Specialist increase VS power level?

[DXXXVIII]

Well my 2 cents:
Riders being 10SS now allows Rider Levi to get them for 40ss and still have 10ss to spare. Not sure wether i wish for terracotta warrior and oathkeeper on 3 Riders or rusty alyce reactivating mech rider every turn. However: BIG BUFF to Rider Levi.
Guilty are an "ok" tax now kinda for jack. make someting tormented and then 4ss for a tarpit/throw-away model. Thats o.k. but stilll feels... weird.
Small buff to karina, summoning students.
Taelor... Didn't fit her niche as an anti-summoning beater. Still does not. Broken mechanic stays broken even if cheaper. :-/
Bishop now being 9SS instead of 10 or being scrambling bishop for 10ss instead of 12... Scrambling bishop might become a schemer o.O
Desperate mecenaries. 3 SS for a significant minion with disguised that refunds 1 SS if it dies? I'm sold. Fielding them with new viks-upgrade that can sisterbuff minions now to torpedo them into opponents might love them  Just ordered more of them... might want to field 4 of them now.
Specialist being 7SS now? His Df and walk is still shitty. But started to like them with new schill.  You could argue that theyre still 8SS but Wyrd added +1 walk to them
Hans: Was a Niche pick... is still a niche pick for the same niche, just cheaper. 
Johan 7SS... Damn, that hurts. But be honest, he was the best model in malifaux. Being 7 SS is still good. even at 8SS if you slap scramble on him, hes still worth his price.
Trapper: To me they're too expensive at 7SS... they cost teh same as an specialist now.  but they'll get replaced by the new op-6SS-Freikorps-model anyway  Probably more a nerf to neverborn than to Outcast.
A&D now being the most expensive model in game. Hehe, but i ran him allways at 15ss (equipped with scramble) so nothing really changed.
And now... SCRAMBLE. I allready picked it alot... now with it being cheaper it's a great way to counteract the weakness of many outcast-models... low walk. or to buff some models to new scheme-ness. Montresor with scramble, Midnight stalker with scramble or bishop with scramble... thats fun...  Yamaziko with Scramble
Nurses: Thats a bummer, Jack loved nurses :-/
Yamaziko: What wyrd wrote. Yamazikos price got reduced by one. What i'm reading: Yamaziko got walk 5 now.
Terracottas for levi are still great. even more so if they can protect riders now
Misaki-Nerf? Hmm... yes, she was a bit disgusting but more so on TT side than outcast. I'm even thinking wether or not Bisento's our way to go at outcast.

 

[Zebo]

10 minutes ago, trikk said:

You misread my argument. Did the decrease in Specialist increase VS power level?

Until now, Specialist has been a totally waste of 8ss in all of my games but 1 (sure is my fault), son no, te cost reduction of the Specialist to 7ss doesn't increase Von Schill power level. Only reduced my waste of ss to 7 instead of 8. XD

 

Beign honest. I understand and like much of the errata. Since the reduced cost for the overpriced mercs (not sure about the Bishop reduction) to the increase of Johan. 

 

Just saying that I don't like the Trapper new cost. And I can understand that they were almost an auto take, but still don't like. 

 

Also disappointed with VS and Freikorpsmann not errated. It's getting harder to play full Freikorps lists. 

[trikk]

54 minutes ago, Zebo said:

Until now, Specialist has been a totally waste of 8ss in all of my games but 1 (sure is my fault), son no, te cost reduction of the Specialist to 7ss doesn't increase Von Schill power level. Only reduced my waste of ss to 7 instead of 8. XD

So why do you assume that Rattler veing cheaper is a buff to Marcus?

 

VS doesn't need any changes. I agree about Freikorpsmen tho

[Freman]

At 3 stones Desperate Mercenaries do seem like a decent choice. They're normal human movement. They have a 2" range Ml4 attack, a 10" range Sh4 attack, and disguised. They're significant. Their damage track is not bad if you actually manage to land a hit. I think we'll see them more often now.

[CapnBloodbeard]

Interesting.  I know Trapper is an auto-take for many, even as a mercenary.  But I sorta feel like 7SS is pushing him a bit too far.  He seems slightly too expensive now, and that may just come down to his damage track.  Maybe he needed a slight buff elsewhere.  

I guess it probably makes him a bit more situational than he was before.  Hans dropping is really interesting, and now either could be the better take, situationally.  

Johan going up....I don't really take Johan much anyway, just too slow for my liking, I really don't feel like he's worth 7 SS.

I suppose making the Trapper more expensive will force people to reconsider their 'auto-takes' and on that sense, it's probably a positive change.  I always just felt like the trapper didn't do enough damage to make him all that exciting.  I often take him, but I don't often find he has a significant impact on the game.  Making my opponent hide a lot is probably the biggest impact.  I think that at 7SS there are a lot of other ways to use 7SS, or even 5-6SS and save a SS or two (maybe for upgrades).  

Specialist to 7SS?  With Scramble he's now 8SS as opposed to 10SS.  I think that's starting to fix him.  At 7SS, Trapper is probably going to be a better model than he is though, but perhaps in some situations?  

Bishop dropping is interesting and a little unexpected.  Taelor.....I still can't see me taking her unless I expect to face summoning.  Even then, 'maybe'. 

Scramble dropping 1 SS is perhaps on the most exciting changes.  2 SS was always really expensive, and always left you questioning the value of it - eg turning Johan into an 8SS model, or Specialist into a 10 SS model, for what's still pretty ordinary walking.  Sure, that's not the only way to use it.  

 

Now?  It's a valid consideration on pretty much any model.  

[Davos]

4 hours ago, DXXXVIII said:

Trapper: To me they're too expensive at 7SS... they cost teh same as an specialist now.  but they'll get replaced by the new op-6SS-Freikorps-model anyway  Probably 

 

Which OP Freikorps model is that?  Cause really not of them are "OP".  Engineer is great and all, but still not game breaking or meta-defining by anymeans

[Kaos]

I expected a point reduction for abominations...

Ashes and dust and Johan being hit was pretty much expected. But doesn't look like the buffs remotely balanced the nerfs.

Other factions got plenty of SS reductions and quite few increases. I think outcasts and gremlins got hit harder this round.

And raise the cache of Leveticus to 2 after last year turbonerf was something due.

[MetaphoricDragn]

hmmm, I've  never looked to deeply into Hans, but now I'm curious about the Hans vs Trapper debate.

[LexLock]

2 hours ago, Kaos said:

I expected a point reduction for abominations...

Ashes and dust and Johan being hit was pretty much expected. But doesn't look like the buffs remotely balanced the nerfs.

Other factions got plenty of SS reductions and quite few increases. I think outcasts and gremlins got hit harder this round.

And raise the cache of Leveticus to 2 after last year turbonerf was something due.

I think the point cost reduction on the Desperate Mercs is pretty huge for everyone other than Hamelin, and Viks with activation control is going to be spooky.

I'm honestly surprised by the AnD nerf, they never struck me as particularly good for their cost compared to something like Nekima, Archie or even Langston. AnD just doesn't bring enough Killy to the table for 13ss and I'd already started replacing them with the Midnight Stalker when it came to scheming. I guess they're still quite good at holding an area of the board though and I'll find it easier to justify AnD with scramble now.

[Raimu]

10 hours ago, DXXXVIII said:

Well my 2 cents:
Riders being 10SS now allows Rider Levi to get them for 40ss and still have 10ss to spare. Not sure wether i wish for terracotta warrior and oathkeeper on 3 Riders or rusty alyce reactivating mech rider every turn. However: BIG BUFF to Rider Levi.
Guilty are an "ok" tax now kinda for jack. make someting tormented and then 4ss for a tarpit/throw-away model. Thats o.k. but stilll feels... weird.
Small buff to karina, summoning students.
Taelor... Didn't fit her niche as an anti-summoning beater. Still does not. Broken mechanic stays broken even if cheaper. :-/
Bishop now being 9SS instead of 10 or being scrambling bishop for 10ss instead of 12... Scrambling bishop might become a schemer o.O
Desperate mecenaries. 3 SS for a significant minion with disguised that refunds 1 SS if it dies? I'm sold. Fielding them with new viks-upgrade that can sisterbuff minions now to torpedo them into opponents might love them  Just ordered more of them... might want to field 4 of them now.
Specialist being 7SS now? His Df and walk is still shitty. But started to like them with new schill.  You could argue that theyre still 8SS but Wyrd added +1 walk to them
Hans: Was a Niche pick... is still a niche pick for the same niche, just cheaper. 
Johan 7SS... Damn, that hurts. But be honest, he was the best model in malifaux. Being 7 SS is still good. even at 8SS if you slap scramble on him, hes still worth his price.
Trapper: To me they're too expensive at 7SS... they cost teh same as an specialist now.  but they'll get replaced by the new op-6SS-Freikorps-model anyway  Probably more a nerf to neverborn than to Outcast.
A&D now being the most expensive model in game. Hehe, but i ran him allways at 15ss (equipped with scramble) so nothing really changed.
And now... SCRAMBLE. I allready picked it alot... now with it being cheaper it's a great way to counteract the weakness of many outcast-models... low walk. or to buff some models to new scheme-ness. Montresor with scramble, Midnight stalker with scramble or bishop with scramble... thats fun...  Yamaziko with Scramble
Nurses: Thats a bummer, Jack loved nurses :-/
Yamaziko: What wyrd wrote. Yamazikos price got reduced by one. What i'm reading: Yamaziko got walk 5 now.
Terracottas for levi are still great. even more so if they can protect riders now
Misaki-Nerf? Hmm... yes, she was a bit disgusting but more so on TT side than outcast. I'm even thinking wether or not Bisento's our way to go at outcast.

 

4 Riders cost 42 SS not 40 SS 

[DXXXVIII]

5 minutes ago, Raimu said:

4 Riders cost 42 SS not 40 SS 

3 Riders cost 10SS each.

one is summoned by donkey-rider with a cost of 10SS. Duuude

[Raimu]

1 minute ago, DXXXVIII said:

3 Riders cost 10SS each.

one is summoned by donkey-rider with a cost of 10SS. Duuude

Mech Rider was not errated, read carefully.

[DXXXVIII]

2 minutes ago, Raimu said:

Mech Rider was not errated, read carefully.

Duuude. Read again...

Levi never hired all 4 rider. he hired 3 and summoned one. Guess which one he'll be summoning.

[DXXXVIII]

6 hours ago, Davos said:

Which OP Freikorps model is that?  Cause really not of them are "OP".  Engineer is great and all, but still not game breaking or meta-defining by anymeans

I think the engineers are great.

I think they are op. But not as op to redefine the meta.

[Raimu]

6 minutes ago, DXXXVIII said:

Duuude. Read again...

Levi never hired all 4 rider. he hired 3 and summoned one. Guess which one he'll be summoning.

Ah, my bad, didn't get the morning coffee yet

[Freman]

Leveticus can take the riders, a couple of upgrades, and still have some stones in the kitty. That's pretty good.

[CapnBloodbeard]

14 hours ago, FunWithKnives said:

No SS cashe increase for VS 

 

 

I'm not so sure that he really needs it after his last buffs.  Because he's actually a beatstick and pretty schemey now.  

And with a reduced Scramble, there's a bit more mobility key players in his crew can have.  

Yes, it does mean that you probably really want the librarian in the crew because I think you really want Schill to stay alive as long as possible, but don't forget he has selective  to defence.  Specialist is actually playable now.  

 

 

[Kaos]

3 hours ago, LexLock said:

I think the point cost reduction on the Desperate Mercs is pretty huge for everyone other than Hamelin, and Viks with activation control is going to be spooky.

I'm honestly surprised by the AnD nerf, they never struck me as particularly good for their cost compared to something like Nekima, Archie or even Langston. AnD just doesn't bring enough Killy to the table for 13ss and I'd already started replacing them with the Midnight Stalker when it came to scheming. I guess they're still quite good at holding an area of the board though and I'll find it easier to justify AnD with scramble now.

Well looking at the bright side, Leveticus with ashes and dust and Langston, both of them with scramble, is definitely a thing. Brace for 2 killy missiles rushing up the enemy lines.

[apes-ma]

I think that now I will only be taking Ashes and Dust in crews that really want him (which for me is Leve), but I also feel like Scramble Bishop at 10SS is actually a pretty reasonable replacement for A&D in a lot of my crews (like Jack, or Parker). Guilty at 4SS is great, except when you take a nurse, then nothing changes... One particularly juicy buff here is having Terracotta Warriors go up to 6SS - they are anchors for Leveticus now which I think is pretty fantastic.

Aside from the general improvement thanks to Scramble halving in cost I am pretty disappointed that there isn't much that helps Parker out here. Although having access to Scramble Bishop at 10SS is pretty nice for any master, I don't think that's enough to help Parker feel like a more viable choice - he's still super clunky and inefficient. I mean I'll still play him all the time...

[PositronMike]

Guilty at 4 makes me very happy. I always took 2 at 5ss with Jack and now they have had a cost decrease they become even better with him. I don't think they will see an awful lot of play outside of a Jack list unless you want a cheap tarpit similar to the role depleted have in Neverborn. Bishop at 9 is again a very nice change, he nearly always made my Tara crew at 10ss but at 9 I think he is more likely to make his way into other lists. I can definitely see him now in a Jack list with Bigger they are playing the role of heavy hitter especially if Jack has the Writhing Torment upgrade.