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-Loki-

Errata hopes?

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Saw this in another faction sub form, and it's a fun discussion.

I'm hoping to see Teddy get a Df buff. Df 5 would be great, 4 would be acceptable. Df 3 is just way too low.

Also hoping to see something for the Gorar. Center circle is too vulnerable. Centerline would be much better.

I kind of want to see Illuminated get a nerf? Like maybe lose one of their defensive abilities. Right now they outshine anything in their SS bracket, in many factions. Even a couple of SS above it.

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Well, I doubt Teddy's going to get Df bonus. You should look at the big picture: every NB high cost beater is somewhat inferior to other factions counterparts, especially overpowered ones (Ashes & Dust) and plain bad designs (Yasunori). The thrice-damned Gaining Grounds 2017 didn't help, either. If you boost Teddy's survivability it will outclass Mature Nephilim and Nekima. If you boost all three there will be just uproar in other factions. Plus, design-wise, I think we were never intended as a big beatstick faction. All the changes I hope for is to make our big models niche, but playable. Back in gg2016 (the good one), Teddy was a niche model in Dreamer's crew, and personally - I sometimes played it with Pandora; Mature Nephilim has a potential to become niche beater in Titania's crew; Nekima would simply stay as our Fears Given Form vassal and 'best generalist beater you can get in this faction' choice. To make this happen, all we need is new, better Gaining Grounds, not errata.

My main problem with Goroar is not his hard to use, one-time only summon ability: I just hate that it doesn't have anything to do with its AP except walking. Higher Ca, or an ability to take Defensive Stance without throwing out a card would make it playable. Probably still inferior to Primordial Magic, but that's a problem with Magic.

In my regional meta, I haven't seen an Illuminated for a while. Maybe in Neverborn Lynch crews. I don't say it's a weak model - it's good for sure, but contrary to what you've just said it has huge competition both in Neverborn and Ten Thunders hiring pool. Here's a few Nb models 'in Illuminated's SS bracket, even a couple of soulstones above it', that can do things Illuminated cannot: Mr Graves, Lilitu, Thorn, Tooth, Doppelganger, Freikorps Trapper (we adopted him - let's just admit it), Rougarou.

Personally, I prefer to put my trust in new GG, not january errata.

EDIT:
I do hope the errata will fix our worst minion available: a minion so bad it's a 4 ss model not worth 3 ss; a summon so bad it's not worth to spend summoner's AP to bring it to the table (and it can be summoned by NON-master models!), not to mention a card; a model so bad both players and developers removed it from their awareness. Ladies and Gentlemen, I present you the plain garbage:

WICKED DOLL.

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Angel Eyes should get some boost for sure. Agree with guys from neighbor thread.

I think Illuminated will lose its main feature if you touch their defense. Their survival abilities are the main reason to take them out of Lynch.

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8 hours ago, -Loki- said:

I'm hoping to see Teddy get a Df buff. Df 5 would be great, 4 would be acceptable. Df 3 is just way too low.

I'm agree for a buff of Teddy...

We WANT Teddy as a henchman!!!:D

Jokes apart.. i've the solution teddy =10 ss

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6 minutes ago, TeddyBear said:

I'm agree for a buff of Teddy...

We WANT Teddy as a henchman!!!:D

Jokes apart.. i've the solution teddy =10 ss

That would make him summonable by Dreamer.

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6 minutes ago, Pikciwok said:

That would make him summonable by Dreamer.

I'm joking of course about henchman, but for me 1 ss left it's not such a bad idea..

For 11 stones (apart some schemes/strategies with pandora and dreamer) i prefere mature nephilim instead teddy always.

Like you said: if you think that Yasunori is 12 ss...(Although i do think with next errata they change Yasu at 13 ss for sure..) 

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7 hours ago, Pikciwok said:

If you boost Teddy's survivability it will outclass Mature Nephilim and Nekima.

How? Sure if he get's something absurd like Df 7, but a 1-2 pt Df increase isn't going to make Teddy outclass the Mature and especially not Nekima. The two of them are still Min 4 beaters, with the choice between a Mature and Teddy being less clear cut, but Nekima still being markedly better than both of them.

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I'd like if Teddy got a nice 0-cost Upgrade. Something that wouldn't outright outclass Retribution's Eye so something that didn't make him a better beater but rather did something clever. That way Summoning wouldn't be affected but he would become an interesting hire.

Wicked Dolls are indeed quite bad but when I've been winning, I've sometimes summoned them up for a laugh. They can pile on quite some damage in a sorta weird roundabout way if they manage to survive. And the heal thing can be surprisingly useful. But the problem with both is that they are so ridiculously squishy.

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Agree with wicked dolls.

I would also love some buff for vasilisa. She is so squishy it's ridiculous for an henchman.

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Completely agree with buff to Angel Eyes. Aeslin should get a def buff like armor and no :ranged in her attack as that would make her viable. In general, our henchmen are on the meh side...

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14 hours ago, le_sphinx said:

Angel Eyes should get some boost for sure. Agree with guys from neighbor thread.

I think Illuminated will lose its main feature if you touch their defense. Their survival abilities are the main reason to take them out of Lynch.

I mean, I'm not saying to do anything drastic, but between Terrifying, Armour, Regeneration and a self heal, they outclass models 2-3ss higher than themselves when you add in their powerful Ml and Sh attacks (that don't actually need Brilliance to be powerful). There's a reason whenever a new Neverborn 7ss-9ss minion comes out, most people say 'they're good but they're no Illuminated'. Mostly I want to see them dropped a touch for the health of the faction. Losing one of those defensive abilities wouldn't make them worthless outside of a Lynch crew, but it might make more people start looking at other minions. I'd probably go for Regeneration, as with their self heal it just seems a bit much.

Agreed with Angel Eyes. I so want to use her but out of the starter box models, she's the one I'm never tempted to put on the table. I love the idea of a purely range damage focused henchman for Neverborn, but she just doesn't bring it for her cost.

8 hours ago, santaclaws01 said:

How? Sure if he get's something absurd like Df 7, but a 1-2 pt Df increase isn't going to make Teddy outclass the Mature and especially not Nekima. The two of them are still Min 4 beaters, with the choice between a Mature and Teddy being less clear cut, but Nekima still being markedly better than both of them.

This is what I was getting at with Teddy. Right now, for his cost, you take something else. He's a glass cannon, but he's just too fragile, often dying before reaching what you want dead. I do like @Math Mathonwys idea of an upgrade though. Dropping his SS cost isn't a good idea, as he's still a good summon for Dreamer at 11ss using Tannen. He's in a weird spot that as a summon, his ss cost is fine, but as a hire, he's just not great. A 0 cost upgrade to buff him is a good way around that.

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21 hours ago, Pikciwok said:

My main problem with Goroar is not his hard to use, one-time only summon ability: I just hate that it doesn't have anything to do with its AP except walking. Higher Ca, or an ability to take Defensive Stance without throwing out a card would make it playable. Probably still inferior to Primordial Magic, but that's a problem with Magic. 

On 04/01/2018 at 9:00 AM, -Loki- said:

Also hoping to see something for the Gorar. Center circle is too vulnerable. Centerline would be much better.

Yes! To both of these ideas. But especially what Pikciwok said. The Gorar really needs Ca5, so he can actually contribute to the game. 

The resserection is totally dependent on the opponent. Give him something he can do proactively. Ca5 would give those attacks a use rather than just throw away attacks. 

They could even be Ca6 since they target Wp, which is usually higher than Df. 

I'd also love to see Aeslin get Armour so she can actually get good use out of her attacks and auras in the thick of it. She's also literally wearing a tree! 

There are lots of other models that could use small buffs as well, but these are the big ones for me personally. 

Agree with what others have said about Teddy, Df4, sounds about right. 

I'd love to see Wing Buffet become a (0) on the Mature so it can actually see use, but that's a really minor thing. 

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Angel Eyes should get a buff for sure, she's so nice model, with loads of potential, just a bit overpriced, if she got positive flip for shooting her riffle (like freikorps traper) that would make her usefull, both on her own and with changelings.

Teddie's DF +1 (for example via simmilar upgrade like the one Lelu got) would be nice.

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I would be very surprised to see new upgrades coming out in this errata, as that isn't an errata, that is a new release. 

If wyrd were to do another range of those upgrades to under used models,  I would expect to see them out in a book. 

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An idea I just had for Aeslin is, rather than errata-ing her base card, make Queen's Champion restricted to both Titania and Aeslin (Rare 1). Don't know if it'd be good or not, but it's kinda interesting!

That way, she'd get the armour she so desperately needs, she'd ignore the cover penalty to hit with her gun, and she'd drop a metric crap-ton of scheme markers, which are always useful.  Plus you'd have the benefit of knowing where Queen's Champion is going to go to reduce its randomness.  It'd also free up the upgrade slot on Titania.

On the other hand, now you're paying 11ss and an upgrade slot for Aeslin and means you can't put Queen's champ on big beaters like Nekima...

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I like the fact that The Queen's champion can be anyone, it tells a bit of Titania's power when she can make anyone that much deadlier on a whim. It also allow a broader range of models to play with the upgrade. As for Nekima, i think it's a strong combo, but not over the top for all the complication of getting it going and the total cost of this duo. It is also very fluffy considering the events of the last book.

Gorar, Angel Eyes, Young Nephilim could use some help.

Illuminated could get toned down imho, to me they seem to be far more effective than anything i can field at that cost when it comes to combat...but i don't have enough game experience with them to know for sure.

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7 hours ago, Sybaris said:

I like the fact that The Queen's champion can be anyone, it tells a bit of Titania's power when she can make anyone that much deadlier on a whim. 

Gorar, Angel Eyes, Young Nephilim could use some help. 

It's a little off topic, but for my idea, you could still put it on Titania and have it function exactly as now, you'd also just have the option to start it on Aeslin though if you wished. 

Aeslin would probably still need to be dropped to 8ss though... 

I agree with Angel Eyes needing a boost, I'd also add the Scion of Black Blood to that list. However as Starter set models, I don't think they should get Errata'd. I'd be much happier if they just got some upgrades in Wave 6. 

Yeah Young (and to a lesser extent, Mature) Nephilim could certainly use a slight buff

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Mature is in a bad place because of Nekima. It's more self reliant since it gets native :+fate to its Ml and he's a great Retributions Eye carrier and is overall fine for 11ss, but 2 stones more gets you Nekima who has a raft of other benefits.

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8 hours ago, -Loki- said:

Mature is in a bad place because of Nekima. It's more self reliant since it gets native :+fate to its Ml and he's a great Retributions Eye carrier and is overall fine for 11ss, but 2 stones more gets you Nekima who has a raft of other benefits.

Pure Theoryfaux, but I think Mature Nephilim may find its niche in Royal Titania's Court Crew. I think about a core of 4 models: Titania, pukeworm, Emissary and the Mature. Pukeworm helps in card cycling to get those :crowEmissary needs. After placing first Hungry Land Marker, Emissary's summoning skills get reliable. Titania turns Mature into Fae - thanks to that he has access to 'Fae Squeal', as well as Titania's and Emissary's heals and armor buffs. Mature Nephilim brings to the crew the best Ml attack Changelings can copy (:+fate on attack, Min. damage 4) as well as some pushes to send enemies into Hungry Hungry Markers or threat range of Changelings. That's a solid, well synergized core with 23 ss left for some utility, scheme runners, or models you just like to play. Please do note that neither Nekima nor any other big beater in our faction can substitute the Mature Nephilim in this list.

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Something from the new errata appeared in malifaux app:P
We got several SS discounts:
Beckoners, Lelu, Baby Kade and Tuco each dropped 1 stone, all of them being 6 SS now
Bunraku are 5 SS
Hooded Rider dropped 2 SS, now he is at 10
Vasilisa and Spawn mother go down to 8 SS
Bad Juju 7 SS
What do you guys think?

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14 minutes ago, Le gob said:

Nothing about Angel eyes, Aeslin and the Groar?

Seems like no. Maybe just not yet, we saw only cost changes for now.

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12 minutes ago, Redline said:

Seems like no. Maybe just not yet, we saw only cost changes for now.

Storm and Sinister Reputation got a change in-text.

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1 minute ago, trikk said:

Storm and Sinister Reputation got a change in-text.

Oh. Didnt know that, as I havent purchased cards in the app. Sorry:mellow:

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41 minutes ago, Le gob said:

Nothing about Angel eyes, Aeslin and the Groar?

This is truly sad... I know they probably won't (and IMO shouldn't) errata Angel Eyes, I was really hoping for something for the other two.  I'd even be willing to settle for Aeslin to drop to 8ss...

Otherwise, I quite like the changes!

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