How's Ply for Information look for Colette?

[WWHSD]

I was looking over the GG18 schemes and it seems like Colette may be great for Ply for Information. Activate Colette early in the turn and have her Prompt a few models most likely to get tagged by your opponent.  Her aura also allows Minions and Showgirls to get the Gathered Intel condition using a zero action which seems like it will be big. 

Am I overestimating how strong Prompt will be in this strategy? Are there other Arcanist masters that have better tools to score this strategy?

Using an entire activation from a master to score the strategy seems like a solid use of that activation since each point scored in Ply kind of represents a two point swing (since only 1 crew can score each round).
 

[WWHSD]

It also seem like having models with a 3 inch close attack will be an advantage in this strategy. 

Models Colette can hire with a 3 inch close attack:

Carlos 

Captain

Cojo

Johan

Taelor

 

Are there any that I missed? Carlos looks like he’s the only model with a 3 inch close attack that can benefit from Colette’s zero action interacts aura.

[KingCrow]

I had played in, and won, a tournament at the beginning of the month that had Ply for Info as the second round strategy and I won 10-2.  I played vs a Zoraida crew that brought their Emissary so they had an easy way to get rid conditions, which sucked. Originally I posted this in the Colette thread and then again on the Facebook page and the idea of the crew got a lot of flak.  Everyone thinks that using the Dancing Blade is terrible but trust me, its actually pretty good. I believe Colette is awesome for this strategy and plan to continue to use her when whenever this strategy comes up.  

The list I used was:

Colette with The Dancing Blade, A Lady's Secret and Caberet Choreography - 3 stones (Could easily get rid of CC but I wanted to experiment with it.  I usually had 1 bird available on the board the whole game)

Amina with Imbued Protection and Warding Runes

Carlos with Stunt double and PP

Johan

Union Steamfitter

Performer

Arcane Effigy

Started off with summoning a couple birds and a prompt and then every turn after that, I was attacking.  With her applying burning or getting a card, min damage of 2 and that auto slow, it was VERY easy to control the AP of the enemy crew.  Amina was amazing at controlling as she usually does and PP always gave me a marker within 8 inches.  I would prompt maybe once every other turn or so to get something in better positions but being able to get the trigger on her Saber for a free attack and another slow at 8 inches away is GOOD.  A lot of people have said how terrible the upgrade is but after a few games with using it, I am very impressed.  With Colette basically being unable to die due to her triggers and the Armor +1 from the Steamfitter, she was nigh unkillable.  The Steamfitter can also drop 2 scheme markers a turn and I'm thinking of bringing along a Union Miner somewhere in the crew.  Plus, Johan can heal about half the crew.  Now saying that, I would only take this into a heavy interact game which is what Colette likes to play.  

The thing about Ply is that you can't just reduce the enemy down to a few models because when they activate, they can just get the condition and deny it to you.  Playing as Colette helps alleviate this issue with her Prompt but it can still be difficult to work around.  This crew is meant to control the AP of the enemy and emphasize your own.  Giving 2-3 models Slow each turn means that's less models that are Focusing to hit harder, moving and interacting, etc.  I think using Colette for this strategy is a good idea.

[Ludvig]

41 minutes ago, KingCrow said:

 

Started off with summoning a couple birds and a prompt and then every turn after that, I was attacking.  With her applying burning or getting a card, min damage of 2 and that auto slow, it was VERY easy to control the AP of the enemy crew.  Amina was amazing at controlling as she usually does and PP always gave me a marker within 8 inches.  I would prompt maybe once every other turn or so to get something in better positions but being able to get the trigger on her Saber for a free attack and another slow at 8 inches away is GOOD. 
 

I'm not following, the trigger only discards a scheme marker, how is she getting extra attacks?

[KingCrow]

24 minutes ago, Ludvig said:

I'm not following, the trigger only discards a scheme marker, how is she getting extra attacks?

The trigger on the A Lady's Secret upgrade gives her a free attack with increased range.  Plus it gives her a trigger to not discard scheme markers when using Disappearing Act.  It's a 2 soulstone upgrade so it's a bit expensive but I got probably 6 or so extra attacks throughout the game I used it in so I'd say it's worth it, especially with a Ca 7 attack that can target either Df or Wp.  Plus, Amina can get soulstones back so that helps too.

[SevenThirtySeven]

On 12/20/2017 at 12:35 PM, WWHSD said:

I was looking over the GG18 schemes and it seems like Colette may be great for Ply for Information. Activate Colette early in the turn and have her Prompt a few models most likely to get tagged by your opponent.  Her aura also allows Minions and Showgirls to get the Gathered Intel condition using a zero action which seems like it will be big. 

Am I overestimating how strong Prompt will be in this strategy? Are there other Arcanist masters that have better tools to score this strategy?

Using an entire activation from a master to score the strategy seems like a solid use of that activation since each point scored in Ply kind of represents a two point swing (since only 1 crew can score each round).
 

Yea, I played a Ply game w Alex Schmid last Sunday, and we were talking about that.  I took Sandeep and he took Lilith, but we realized how strong obey masters could be in this strat for the exact reasons you mentioned.  As for using all 3 AP of the master, I'm not sure.  I think 2 would be just fine, esp if you get to go first.  In a close game, 2 seems to be the magic number of plys.  It makes it so that opponent has to jump through so many hoops to even match you, let alone beat you, which can leave them exposed for rest of your crew.  You are right in that I think it can be a good investment since only one crew can score strat each turn.  

Activating first would be a big deal in this situation, so while Neverborn or Lucius crews can take dopple, I'd prob try to fit Seize the Day into Colette's upgrades.  But it would put a ton of pressure on opposing crew.  

Good for arcanists in particular is the steamfitter, who will allow your key models w Ply to ignore severes from the opponent to remove it.  I was lucky in that Alex and I ended up tying this game, but I outscored him 3-0 in the strat bc I usually went first in turn due to Seize the Day and my steamfitter kept buffing my Ply models so it was very hard for him to remove the condition.  For other factions, impossible to wound models would be a good choice (Deep obv helped in this situation).  

I also think small tanky crews are great in Ply.  The fewer ply targets you give opponent, the better it is when you can get up 1 or 2 ply conditions each turn.  If you have a ton of cheap activations its actually a hindrance for the strat.  Alex ended up killing everything except for my steamfitter and Sandeep but he couldn't score the strat even late in the game when he had a big model advantage. @KingCrow's crew selection looks solid.  Johan would be good bc of offensive condition removal.  I take automaton for the same reason.  

 

[Ludvig]

A ton of cheap activations along qith multiple offensive condution removals should let you wait until they've gone with all their models, remove their condition and then put it on as many models as you need.

[KingCrow]

2 hours ago, Ludvig said:

A ton of cheap activations along qith multiple offensive condution removals should let you wait until they've gone with all their models, remove their condition and then put it on as many models as you need.

What faction has access to multiple offensive condition removal?  I can only think of TT with Chiaki and the Monks having access to multiple, in-faction models.  

[SevenThirtySeven]

2 hours ago, Ludvig said:

A ton of cheap activations along qith multiple offensive condution removals should let you wait until they've gone with all their models, remove their condition and then put it on as many models as you need.

That is a way to play it. But risky. How many models have offensive condition removal that doesn't require a suit? Mysterious emissary comes to mind, but not many others.  And while you are waiting out the activations, if you are playing vs good player, lots of things can happen. 

In this game, I had Warding Runes on my two tanks and reinforced sheet armor on my ply models, so it made removing the conditions difficult for him, either w his emissary or focused attacks. 

Ive also found that while a lot of activations is great for turn 1, it can be less useful in subsequent turns when you want your best models to go first. 

[SevenThirtySeven]

5 minutes ago, KingCrow said:

What faction has access to multiple offensive condition removal?  I can only think of TT with Chiaki and the Monks having access to multiple, in-faction models.  

Johan is a merc. But I agree with your point, I don't think offensive condition removal is as easy or accessible as Ludwig claims.

[WWHSD]

35 minutes ago, KingCrow said:

What faction has access to multiple offensive condition removal?  I can only think of TT with Chiaki and the Monks having access to multiple, in-faction models.  

Tehnically, Arcanists do. You’d need to proxy a Medical Automaton for it and the condition removal is a trigger for an attack on a suit that is not built in.

Guild has Witchling Stalkers for offense removal. 

[KingCrow]

1 hour ago, WWHSD said:

Tehnically, Arcanists do. You’d need to proxy a Medical Automaton for it and the condition removal is a trigger for an attack on a suit that is not built in.

Guild has Witchling Stalkers for offense removal. 

I was asking about multiple models with offensive condition removal.  The Automaton is one and I know the Effigy has it but the Effigy is only good for friendlies.  Johan is technically an Outcast even though he is a Merc that is seen in a lot of M&SU crews.  What other models of ours has offensive condition removal? 

I think most factions have maybe one or two models that have this ability since it is so powerful. 

[WWHSD]

20 minutes ago, KingCrow said:

I was asking about multiple models with offensive condition removal.  The Automaton is one and I know the Effigy has it but the Effigy is only good for friendlies.  Johan is technically an Outcast even though he is a Merc that is seen in a lot of M&SU crews.  What other models of ours has offensive condition removal? 

I think most factions have maybe one or two models that have this ability since it is so powerful. 

I was interpreting “multiple models” to include things like the Automaton that aren’t Rare 1.

[SevenThirtySeven]

3 hours ago, WWHSD said:

I was interpreting “multiple models” to include things like the Automaton that aren’t Rare 1.

Yea, I'm not buying that one. Not sure the economies of scale w a non-rare model that shares the same suited trigger. Only so many high tomes in the deck.

I don't think there are enough models w offensive condition removal in the game to make it as much of a utility as it could be yet. 

Vs. a smart opponent, you better believe those models w offensive condition removal are dying first in games where they can impact the strat.

[WWHSD]

1 hour ago, SevenThirtySeven said:

Yea, I'm not buying that one. Not sure the economies of scale w a non-rare model that shares the same suited trigger. Only so many high tomes in the deck.

I don't think there are enough models w offensive condition removal in the game to make it as much of a utility as it could be yet. 

Vs. a smart opponent, you better believe those models w offensive condition removal are dying first in games where they can impact the strat.

I’d think that you take something like multiple Medical Automatons more for redundancy and coverage than you do multiple removals per turn. Their offensive removal is kind of crap as well since its on a one inch close attack that’s only Ml5. 

I don’t think most factions have good enough offensive condition removal for that to be their plan A in Ply. If think that most of the time Johan might be better off trying to “remove” the condition through vigorous application of his relic hammer.

[Ludvig]

I was thinking Johan + whatever you have in faction so Chiaki or automaton, stalker etc. 

Haven't tried it though, maybe going elite and trying to get ply on most of your models before they can is better. Not a fan of relying on initiative though, you'd still need consition removal and probably want a way to chain to ensure points.

[SevenThirtySeven]

4 hours ago, Ludvig said:

I was thinking Johan + whatever you have in faction so Chiaki or automaton, stalker etc. 

Haven't tried it though, maybe going elite and trying to get ply on most of your models before they can is better. Not a fan of relying on initiative though, you'd still need consition removal and probably want a way to chain to ensure points.

Of course, no plan is foolproof. It's all about putting together a crew that gives you the best chance.  I agree having 1-2 sources of condition removal is good in this strat as a threat. Would say the same for Public Execution too.  But I've had success in both with smaller, tanky crews.

 

Only reason why I brought it up is bc activation control was so dominant in GG17. Activating last and (a) putting claim jump markers and denying opponents', (b) pushing out enemies from extraction marker range and putting your models in range, (c) engaging or pushing key enemy models for interference, (d) pushing enemy models away from stash markers, etc etc etc was a go-to tactic in every game. It's just nice to have strats that don't mandate that the crew which activates last has such a supreme advantage.

Activation control will always be good. It's a core part of the way the game has been designed. But I feel it's been balanced out in some of the new strats, which I think is awesome.