A question on the Misters

[DonCheadle]

"...the Old Firm. Nuisances eliminated, obstacles obliterated, bothersome limbs removed, and tutelary dentistry."

What place do Graves and Tannen have in or lists? I purchased the lot of them for lore reasons (having read Neverwhere I couldn't resist) and I've faced Graves a bunch whenever put up against Neverborn, but we already have a bunch of pushing as it stands. So my question is, what purpose does the lot (or individually) have in clan lists?
 

[Nikodemus]

First up, I can't actually see your text since it's the same colour as my forum background. I got around it, but quoting so other people who have the same issue can see it.

13 minutes ago, DonCheadle said:

What place do Graves and Tannen have in or lists? I purchased the lot of them for lore reasons (having read Neverwhere I couldn't resist) and I've faced Graves a bunch whenever put up against Neverborn, but we already have a bunch of pushing as it stands. So my question is, what purpose does the lot (or individually) have in clan lists?
 

Graves:

At 8ss he's significantly cheaper than Emissary or Sensei Yu. He tags along when I want my pushes without compromising my crew on either durability or hitting power, both of which he does well considering his cost. He doesn't have any must-have upgrades either so I can usually afford to slap him the Low River Monk fix upgrade. That or some random one for Show of Force. Easy to use well.

Tannen:

I'm still experimenting with him, but have played 5 maybe close to 10 games with him so that's something. For me it's all about Cooler aura (6'' discard a card before cheating). Cooler, Manipulative and very often Death Contract upgrade (when an enemy kills him they must discard 2 stones or 2 cards or die). I park him to a good position and passively drain the enemy as turns go by. He's hard to assess since most of what he does is passive. But when used well he does make it expensive for enemy to do things. Far less universal than Graves though. If strat & schemes don't reward bunching up, he's not going to catch multiple enemies into his aura. His only defensive tech is manipulative and Death Contract, but neither stops him from getting killed. I've lost him a few times when I shoved him too far forward and enemy just killed him start of the turn for cost of a few cards. And some crews/players, they just don't care if they can't use their hand effectively. He gets in when I have 6+1 spare ss in a pool that encourages bunching up.

Hard to use well. Might be good, might not be, but I enjoy playing him all the same.

I should add I rarely use both in the same crew. That's something I need to test out during remainder of 2017. Graves doesn't need Tannen but Tannen could in theory benefit greatly from Graves keeping up his manipulative. 

[DonCheadle]

Great reply, but I still have some questions. 

Do you think either of them synergizes better with some masters over others? 

I heard Asami wants Tannen for summoning purposes, which was my main excuse for buying him since I wanted to branch out from Shenlong and Lynch into the demon-spawning hairess. 

[Nikodemus]

I don't play Asami, but on paper sure. Off the top of my head Yokai are summoned on 9, Obsidian Oni 11 and Jorogumo 13. Would be nice to summon murder monkies on a 7, but I don't know if its 6ss nice. I've actually used Tannen most with Shenlong. Giving Tannen a push turn 1 helps him walk up to a good position turn 1, ideally letting me activate him late turn 2 but still keep his Cooler aura relevant from the start.

I don't focus on synergies all that much with either model. They're just good models. And I like how I painted mine Graves is more likely to be in if I don't have a lot of pushing in the crew already. Tannen, at this point anyway, is something I throw in if s&s fit and I have points to spare.

[Jesy Blue]

I've been trying to see if they fit in a Lucius Guild crew, as they are both mimics; it's a hard fit, but I only half heartedly am looking as I don't play Guild yet.  

I have found use of Graves in Brewmaster, pushing people into Drinking Party ring(s), but only as a tertiary choice.

[Ludvig]

@Jesy Blue They fit nicely with Lucius, I play them all the time even in guild. This is the thunders though so they won't get much use from Lucius.  

[tomjoad]

Tannen w/ Asami: Not bad, but also maybe not worth it. Again, Tannen REALLY only pays off when his Cooler aura is doing work. If you can use it to force your opponent to discard a bunch so they cannot defend themselves from Asami's Devoured Whole trigger, then he's good. If you're using him to get that +2 on  for your summoning...well, just recall that there are as many  in the deck that will get a -2, so you lose a lot of his value right off the bat. Games where you can get the action bunched up and you keep enough pressure on enemy hitters that they can't take time to kill Tannen, he is awesome. Other games he'll just be 6ss that would have been better off on another 10T Brother or Terracotta Warrior.

[Adran]

17 hours ago, tomjoad said:

. If you're using him to get that +2 on  for your summoning...well, just recall that there are as many  in the deck that will get a -2, so you lose a lot of his value right off the bat. 

Most of the time I find people only go for summons when they have the card in hand to make it work. because of this, you are often going to be able to take advantage of the bonus, and were going to have to cheat over the failures already. Especially when you need suits. That 13 wasn't going to succeed before you made it an 11 but that 7 all of a sudden can summon a Yokai. 

If you start having TNs (or triggers) with , then he becomes something that you need to consider. 

[Haagrum]

On 07/12/2017 at 12:11 AM, Jesy Blue said:

I have found use of Graves in Brewmaster, pushing people into Drinking Party ring(s), but only as a tertiary choice.

They're both useful to Brewmaster, if you can get the Drinking Contest bubble going. It's hard to escape the bubble anyway, but it's even worse when Tannen makes cheating hurt, and when Graves can shove you straight back into the bubble.

[Nukemouse]

I've been looking at Tannen as a good help to brewmaster, since the discard hurts when you are likely to lose several cards to pick your poison. His ability to hand out bored at a distance also seem's useful.

[ElPuto]

8 hours ago, Nukemouse said:

I've been looking at Tannen as a good help to brewmaster, since the discard hurts when you are likely to lose several cards to pick your poison. His ability to hand out bored at a distance also seem's useful.

I was trying to find something to add at my 10T Brewie, and here it goes. I always had the solution under my nose.