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Pandora Tactica

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5 hours ago, INXVI said:

Hey guys, so I'm looking for some advice, I'm entering a Tournament tomorrow and I'm probably going to run Pandora for the first game. My lists are pretty solid for the other 2 games, but I've been struggling to make a list for the first game.

The strategy is Public Execution, with the schemes of Set Up (3), Hold Up Their Forces (4), Inescapable Trap (6), Vendetta (13) & Eliminate The Leadership (Always)

Initially, the schemes have a balance of killing, with keeping the enemy alive, both lists I've trialed over the past week have been successful in one area but not another. It almost feels like focussing on killing is the most potent choice.

On that note, could anyone help me build a list that could fare up well with this scheme pool? I don't own the Widoe Weaver, Insidious Madness or Emissary, but I own a lot of the other elements a Pandora crew needs.

Thanks :)

Ok, first of all - Pandora's upgrades. Because Eliminate The Leadership is in the pool I would suggest investing in some defensive upgrades: Aether Connection is IMHO a must, as well as full cache. Pick the Box Opens, if you  like it. Alternatively, you can take the Voices instead to paralyze beaters (and thwart opponent's plan to score the Strategy) - just remember that you should kill at least one model per turn with Dora. I don't recommend Woe is Me for this Strategy. I advise to take Rile them up as your third upgrade - that way you can reliably kill models that have damage reduction and/or pathetic melee attack, i.e. Ramos (Eliminate the Leadership!), Brutal Effigy. That would be 8 or 9 points spent on Dora only.

Speaking of Effigies - get one. It's cheap and durable, plus its (0) will save your bacon when models like 'Debt to the Guild'ed Francisco decides to Flurry you.

I would also take Iggy with Malifaux Provides - he can protect Dora (and other woes - if you take them) with his Martyr ability, then heal by eating one of Hold up their forces.

Take a model with Lure - either Lilitu or Baby Kade (or both :P ) to pull Dora (or other models) away from their scheme markers in order to avoid the Set Up. Kade with Depression can also kill things without too much armor, and with Lilitu you can score your own Set Up :)- she's got 4" :melee so she can also Hold Up their forces. Both models are Woes, too, so both Iggy and Pandora can protect them with Martyr. Side note - lure has a really long range so it's trivial to score first point of Vendetta with it.

Consider taking Mr Graves with 1k faces. If you're gonna start in the Corner deployment - just take him. He can kill stuff, he can survive a few blows, and he can gently show Pandora the door. 

Consider taking Doppelganger if you think you need a force multiplier.

If you want to do the Set Up - The Tooth should be your choice.

Take Thorn instead if you want solid, self-suficient model that would draw you some cards. Her good range can also help you Hold up their forces.

If the terrain favors gunlines - take Freikorps Trapper and a pack of Changelings, then go Vendetta. Changeling is the very best model in the game to score points from Vendetta.

I don't think Madnesses or Weaver fit well in this scenario, so don't worry about the lack of models. Emissary can remove Shed Blood Condition form enemy models, but he's far from necessary IMHO (third Martyr model would help though). Don't take Sorrows - they're good models, but they're squishy, too, and you will use Martyr mostly to protect Dora. That's just not the best scenario for them.

I love Poltergeist, I really do, it's a great totem, but - like most of suggested models here - it's not cheap. You'll probably run low on SS points so just be that lazy, boring guy and take Primordial Magic as a card-cycling, cheap activation. You can even use it to score Set Up.

Just remember to write a little report after the tournament, I'm curious now :)

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On Saturday, January 20, 2018 at 10:17 PM, Pikciwok said:

Ok, first of all - Pandora's upgrades. Because Eliminate The Leadership is in the pool I would suggest investing in some defensive upgrades: Aether Connection is IMHO a must, as well as full cache. Pick the Box Opens, if you  like it. Alternatively, you can take the Voices instead to paralyze beaters (and thwart opponent's plan to score the Strategy) - just remember that you should kill at least one model per turn with Dora. I don't recommend Woe is Me for this Strategy. I advise to take Rile them up as your third upgrade - that way you can reliably kill models that have damage reduction and/or pathetic melee attack, i.e. Ramos (Eliminate the Leadership!), Brutal Effigy. That would be 8 or 9 points spent on Dora only.

Speaking of Effigies - get one. It's cheap and durable, plus its (0) will save your bacon when models like 'Debt to the Guild'ed Francisco decides to Flurry you.

I would also take Iggy with Malifaux Provides - he can protect Dora (and other woes - if you take them) with his Martyr ability, then heal by eating one of Hold up their forces.

Take a model with Lure - either Lilitu or Baby Kade (or both :P ) to pull Dora (or other models) away from their scheme markers in order to avoid the Set Up. Kade with Depression can also kill things without too much armor, and with Lilitu you can score your own Set Up :)- she's got 4" :melee so she can also Hold Up their forces. Both models are Woes, too, so both Iggy and Pandora can protect them with Martyr. Side note - lure has a really long range so it's trivial to score first point of Vendetta with it.

Consider taking Mr Graves with 1k faces. If you're gonna start in the Corner deployment - just take him. He can kill stuff, he can survive a few blows, and he can gently show Pandora the door. 

Consider taking Doppelganger if you think you need a force multiplier.

If you want to do the Set Up - The Tooth should be your choice.

Take Thorn instead if you want solid, self-suficient model that would draw you some cards. Her good range can also help you Hold up their forces.

If the terrain favors gunlines - take Freikorps Trapper and a pack of Changelings, then go Vendetta. Changeling is the very best model in the game to score points from Vendetta.

I don't think Madnesses or Weaver fit well in this scenario, so don't worry about the lack of models. Emissary can remove Shed Blood Condition form enemy models, but he's far from necessary IMHO (third Martyr model would help though). Don't take Sorrows - they're good models, but they're squishy, too, and you will use Martyr mostly to protect Dora. That's just not the best scenario for them.

I love Poltergeist, I really do, it's a great totem, but - like most of suggested models here - it's not cheap. You'll probably run low on SS points so just be that lazy, boring guy and take Primordial Magic as a card-cycling, cheap activation. You can even use it to score Set Up.

Just remember to write a little report after the tournament, I'm curious now :)

Thanks so much for such an in depth response mate, I'll definitely take it all into account. This is my first tournament, so it'll be pretty tense but I'm looking forward to it :)

I think I'll probably run Voices Pandora, in the test game, my opponent had 6 models, so paralyzing 1/2 of his crew was amazing (while it lasted at least)

My base list usually consists of Graves, Doppel, I love them so much. Doppel has a habit of loving and hating me (I once blacked 3 times in one game when using her 😂) 

Thanks again though mate, let's see if I can pull it off 😉

Thought I'd throw in the result below.

So, I went with Voices Pandora, taking Eliminate Leadership with Vendetta. Lilitu scored 2 on Vendetta, he looked so confused when I lured The Tooth, because of her positioning meaning she wouldn't move far. I missed out on the 3rd point as he used some positioning shenanigans which resulted in her dying when 3 VP felt so close 😂

I managed to kill Lucius, my opponent plays him really well, but my crew had been depleted by a combination of a pouncing Rougarou, and Mr Graves. My hand was abscent of crows to the point it was painful 😂 but we had a good laugh about it, especially since he knows Pandora so well, it's his main master I believe. 

The game ended 8-6, with some close card flips leading to VP being lost and gained. 

The other 2 games went great, I won them both, putting me 4th. I got an Alt Titania from the mystery box, and I love the model so much! It's thrown me off balance now though, as I was going to buy and focus on learning the Dreamer next month, but I can't turn down the chance of fielding that model and card 😮

Edited by INXVI
Added the Tournament Results below, to save posting a 2nd time in a row.
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Hi!

It's my first time in Malifaux.

I'm a Pandora player (obviously) and i have a tournament next week, that's why i come here for some many tips.

I have many question:

If i have a Dopple, the Mysterous emissary its worth?

What lure model it's more worth? (Lilitu, Graves or Beckoners?)

 

 

Thanks!!!

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@Noodles

Hey mate, I'm in a similar situation to you, as I've played about 10 games with Pandora, but I can let you know what I've learnt so far. 

Now both models have a lure, high CA value so they are pretty reliable, this is something Kade's lacks, but it serves for the purpose of placement and pounce in his case :). Something I think people forget about the Beckoner, is the the 4' push, in any direction. Not only is it built in, but this allows the Beckoner to push away from a risky situation, she is frail after all, whilst also opening up a charge lane for one of your models, which Lilitu may have blocked. Brilliance is nice to have, although it will provide no synergy, it does mean that the model would be on negative flips when targeting her, so strats such as 'Public Execution' are a little less frightening for her. 

Onto Lilitu, she has 4' engagement range, which is just amazing in my experience. She can tie up multiple models, for Hold Up Their Forces, interact from a distance in Ply, and protect your markers in other schemes or the strat to name just a few. Her whip can give paralyzed, which has potential if you manage to summon the Poltergeist, and putting yourself on + flips helps her achieve what needs to be done. Plus regen +1, because who doesn't love healing? 

I personally prefer Lilitu, but a Beckoner still has potential, especially after that stone drop. 

Hope this helps, I might have missed something, but hopefully the pros will help enlighten you further :D

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Thanks! It's realy helful.

But i have one more quesion!

It's about "dealers", in my case i have Nekima, but it's very expensive and it's great damaging, but its only this damaging :c.

I see the Emissary and maybe its better? (less points, WP duels and copy habilities, but hit a lot less)

and..if i have a Emissary, the dopple worths?

 

Now my core is:

Pandora (Woe is me, Depression, Aether Con)

Nekima

Dopple

x2 Fields Reporters

Beckoner

I have 12 points left and i dont know what to spend

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The scheme pool will probably determine how you structure your list a bit more, any ideas on what the scheme pool may be?

I personally lovr Nekima, there's something so satisfying about dropping 4 damage on an enemy without a sweat, but it often means I over extend her. Her primary focus is punching, however she doesn't necessarily need to go head first into the enemies face. She could pick off annoying models, or fast movers you might struggle with otherwise. With Pandora, you can dictate activation orders, therefore if Nekima finds herself regretting the last charge, she may live to fight on. She's also a great distraction, but at a hefty cost. 

I guess the Emmisary fills a different role, he can copy front of the card abilities with his Conflux, meaning Candy & The Emm can got crazy causing duels. His damage spread isn't bad, but can still kill, he's durable too, so you can sorry less about the beater stood in front if him, if it comes to that. Summoning changelings is always nice, but in some scheme pools you may wish to keep them safe, he also requires a mask, meaning less Sorrows. Oh what I wouldn't give to let Pandora have instinctual 😂

If you can give us an idea on the schemes and strategy that would help, but the main thing is, enjoy yourself, I had my first tournament a week ago and it was a great experience!

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1 hour ago, Noodles said:

I dont have ideas about scheme pool until the start xD.

Thats why i try to make a solid core.

ya but your core will change depending on the playstyle your going for. but this is generally mine for summoning pandy.

pandy (woe,depression,connections)

3x wisp

iggy

doppelganger

emissary (pandy conflux) 

this lets me keep pandora alive longer with 2 sources for martyr and has plenty of conditions to hand out. i dont use reporters simply because it feels like they are wanting to do other stuff than just hand out conditions, while the wisps are dedicated to that and can drop schemes while doing so.

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Guys question regardless “misery”.

For example, a model is killed by multiple “misery” auras from Pandora and two sorrows. How to figure out who exactly killed that model? 

 

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16 minutes ago, le_sphinx said:

Guys question regardless “misery”.

For example, a model is killed by multiple “misery” auras from Pandora and two sorrows. How to figure out who exactly killed that model? 

 

The Pandora player decides the order in which it happens.

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10 hours ago, I'm a Teapot! said:

 which is wonderfull for public executions ;)

This is the main reason of asking:D

There will be a tournament this Sunday. Public executions will be the strategy for round 1. Other schemes are eliminate the leadership, undercover entourage, show of force, search the ruins, take one for the team.

Yesterday I tried out Titania for some practice, but I think Pandora and her “misery” avalanche should be better there.

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12 minutes ago, le_sphinx said:

This is the main reason of asking:D

There will a tournament this Sunday. Public executions will be the strategy for round 1. Other schemes are eliminate the leadership, undercover entourage, show of force, search the ruins, take one for the team.

Yesterday I tried out Titani for some practice, but I think Pandora and her “misery” avalanche should be better there.

Oh boy, that schemepool... it screams pandora lure bubble in the middle and kill everything with sorrows and then drop search the ruins and entourage or take show of force. 

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15 minutes ago, le_sphinx said:

This is the main reason of asking:D

There will a tournament this Sunday. Public executions will be the strategy for round 1. Other schemes are eliminate the leadership, undercover entourage, show of force, search the ruins, take one for the team.

Yesterday I tried out Titani for some practice, but I think Pandora and her “misery” avalanche should be better there.

Be careful tho: 

if you give shed blood to a sorrow that hasn’t activated yet, make sure it will be in LoS to an enemy at the end of its next activation or the condition will be removed. This is super easy to forget. This also enables scoring public execution in isolated places. 

You can kill something out of activation with misery while being out of los and then when that sorrow activates, walk or place via misery loves company to get into los at the end of the activation. 

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3 hours ago, I'm a Teapot! said:

Oh boy, that schemepool... it screams pandora lure bubble in the middle and kill everything with sorrows and then drop search the ruins and entourage or take show of force. 

Another thing is deployment. There will be close deployment - perfect environment to lose some friends:lol:

Yeah my plan is to take”ruins” and “entourage”.

Thanks for suggestions about “shed blood” and LoS. This is important point.

Also I think Emissary can work well here. The trigger on his attack can remove “shed blood” from enemy. Also another “misery” or “martyr “.

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On 30/01/2018 at 5:40 AM, HydroMog said:

... while the wisps are dedicated to that and can drop schemes while doing so.

Note that Wisps are insignificant, so won't be dropping scheme markers or anything else that requires interacting. But their Feed On The Lost ability can get scheme markers down with a little set up. 

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7 hours ago, le_sphinx said:

Another thing is deployment. There will be close deployment - perfect environment to lose some friends:lol:

Yeah my plan is to take”ruins” and “entourage”.

Thanks for suggestions about “shed blood” and LoS. This is important point.

Also I think Emissary can work well here. The trigger on his attack can remove “shed blood” from enemy. Also another “misery” or “martyr “.

The emissary got buffed significantly by gg18. In ply and public executions I take it with every master.  And it gets even better when you play Zoraida and there you're able to multiply the effectiveness of that vp deying machine. 

And once your opponent takes Asami and you have the mysterious emissary you just have a great time. 

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so, I took Neverborn to a small event over the weekend and used Pandora in 2 of the 3 games (ply and ours - going with collodi for public executions)

 

Pandora lists I ran were similar.

for Ply against Sandeep I ran:

Pandora (box, fugue, fears given form)

Pmagic, doppleganger, lust, lilitu, 2 insidious madness, 2 changelings

I took surround them (scored 2) and undercover entourage (scored 3) and got 2 from the strategy too to win 7-4.

takeaways: fugue not as useful in this matchup as I'd hoped - mainly due to practised production (set up and trap were also in the pool) - and I lost lust too easily in this game.  Changlings were excellent on ply.

 

for the other Pandora game it was Ours vs. Hoffman:

Pandora (box, rile, fears given form)

Pmagic, doppleganger (1k faces), lilitu (1k faces), lust (retributions eye), 3 madnesses

I took show of force (scored 3) and take prisoner (scored 3), and got all 4 from the strategy - winning 10-3 and take prisoners happened to each other.

take aways: rile up is amazingly powerful - 4 incites and/or the ability to strike at range on any target and ignore damage reduction is very good.  Pandora deleted a model a turn with ease.

Lust amazing this game, breaking up the hoffball on her own, re positioning things to prevent scoring and slowing them down.  Even smacking the peacekeeper for 9 wounds was useful.  once she died, the other picked up the eye...

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1 hour ago, Joel said:

Changlings were excellent on ply.

How did you use them?

I found them are not that useful at this strategy, cause they don't have engagement range. So I thought that they can't get "gathered intel". Am I mistaken?

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On 2/20/2018 at 11:29 AM, le_sphinx said:

How did you use them?

I found them are not that useful at this strategy, cause they don't have engagement range. So I thought that they can't get "gathered intel". Am I mistaken?

as corwin said. :) 

their ability to move for a (0) to get into postion helped too, and coupled with lilitu in the crew, they could copy her lure to bring things into position (or get them out of position).

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12 minutes ago, Joel said:

as corwin said. :) 

their ability to move for a (0) to get into postion helped too, and coupled with lilitu in the crew, they could copy her lure to bring things into position (or get them out of position).

Yes mate. My bad!

However, they can’t copy Lure for sure, cause they perform copied attack with strength 4 and without any suits. Unfortunately, Lure has a Tn with two suits.

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Hey everyone.  Struggling with the 8-10 stone range for Pandora.  I love Barbaros (conceptually and visually), but I keep seeing negative reviews of him online (Alex Schmid put out a pretty negative video on him this morning. Is anyone having good success with him in Summoning Dora?  If you are, are you running any upgrades on him?

Second question: how many models do you typically hire in Summoning Dora crews?  I've been leaning towards 9 lately, but could drop to 8 to get another big model in there.

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I dont think Barbaros is awful... nimble, pushes and the challenge are all useful and he more often did well than not for me. Usually I just stick a thousand face on him.

I have yet to play him with Pandora but I doubt he is worse with her than with Lilith or Dreamer (he is probably more synergistic with Pandora if anything)

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