Pandora Tactica

[Ozzy]

Just to be clear:

1. Pandora Quick Rundown: [...] The Bad [...] Can be rendered toothless by a Crew that ignores pulses and auras (Von Schill and his Freikorps)
"Freikorp Suit" only ignores damage from Pulses and Blasts. Not Auras.

2. Upgrades: [...] Pandora/Woe Upgrades [...] Cry For Me: [...] Again, do note the phrasing. The blast affects ALL models, including friendly models and Pandora! Might be a sneaky and situational way to push Pandora out of the way too, since succeeding the Wp duel will trigger Fading Memory.
"Dark Thoughts" causes a Simple Wp Duel and "Fading Memory" triggers on opposed Wp duels against enemy models.

Best Wishes
Ozzy

[frostwolf428]

@le_sphinx Mr. Tannen could replace an insidious madness how often do you run him with Mr. Graves?

For this mysterious emissary what action are you normally copying? same question for the changelings and I assume the changelings are used to provoke more WP scheme run and jut tie up other models?

With Widow weaver I love the idea of lowering peoples WP but I know if I saw it hit the board I'd go "KILL IT!! KILL IT NOW!!!" I guess the only thing to do is buy her and hope my opponents  are a little slow about killing her

I love how Pandora has three different builds she can use. The woe is me build just being her and at least 2 models that bring condition and whatever you feel like using sounds like it will have a lot of versatility. 

I can have enough love for two  

[I'm a Teapot!]

I tried copying vasilisas aura for -1wp in 4" and it was good. I tried copying the poltergeists aura for negative wp duels and it was super effective! The poltergeist is kind of an epizentrum of dmg for pandora and with the emissary you can apply that to a huge area or double stack it vs henchmen or masters. Most of the time I have to decide between the poltergeist aura and if I need it or another misery aura. Sometimes, if I really need to protect someone, matyr can be the right choice. 

Copying nimble from barbaros makes a good turn 1. Also I love to play the hooded rider as a side threat for lategame. In that case I like to copy his masks ability, so I can reliably summon 2 changelings in turn 2. For the rare occasion when I play the emissary as a tanky frontliner, copying armor 2 from a waldgeist, or incorporeal from a sorrow, or disguised from tuco/serena if I'm playing against things like the viks. 

Running an Adze and scoring Claimjump with it and the emissary without spending ap seems fun. 

Overall I've had the most succes with poltergeist aura vs Henchmen and Masters, and Misery vs little things. 

[le_sphinx]

4 hours ago, frostwolf428 said:

@le_sphinx Mr. Tannen could replace an insidious madness how often do you run him with Mr. Graves?

For this mysterious emissary what action are you normally copying? same question for the changelings and I assume the changelings are used to provoke more WP scheme run and jut tie up other models?

Yeah I really like Mr. Graves as well! Usually he pushes Pandora turn 1 and try to secure area with his "little" stick after. He is my choice when there are not too many killy schemes. In other case (if there will be a lot of murder) I take Teddy. Sometimes even Teddy+Baby Kade. So everything depends on schemes. Mr. Tannen has a nice synergy with Graves and they look cool together in one crew. Another thing is that Mr. Graves can be a big "fire magnet". Sometimes opponents try to do their best in destroying him. IMO, that's not too bad. If opponent tries hard to hit him, the rest of your crew won't suffer these hits.

Madness/es can be used in supporting Pandora with its/their aura and condition applying. However, I think their stronger side is scheme run, because of really respectable Wk and "incorporeal".

I think Teapot listed the best copying opportunities for Emissary. I can only add Tannen's "cooler" aura here.

Changelings are good for schemes and they can add more flexibility to your crew.

[frostwolf428]

1 hour ago, le_sphinx said:

Yeah I really like Mr. Graves as well! Usually he pushes Pandora turn 1 and try to secure area with his "little" stick after. He is my choice when there are not too many killy schemes. In other case (if there will be a lot of murder) I take Teddy. Sometimes even Teddy+Baby Kade. So everything depends on schemes. Mr. Tannen has a nice synergy with Graves and they look cool together in one crew. Another thing is that Mr. Graves can be a big "fire magnet". Sometimes opponents try to do their best in destroying him. IMO, that's not too bad. If opponent tries hard to hit him, the rest of your crew won't suffer these hits.

Madness/es can be used in supporting Pandora with its/their aura and condition applying. However, I think their stronger side is scheme run, because of really respectable Wk and "incorporeal".

I think Teapot listed the best copying opportunities for Emissary. I can only add Tannen's "cooler" aura here.

Changelings are good for schemes and they can add more flexibility to your crew.

I think I would use Graves to push Tannen more often since he is only walk 4 and Pandora has some movement tricks of her own.

I'm surprised by the Teddy baby Kade choice, while I think its a cool and very thematic choice its 18ss and a lot of set up to get the high damage when I could just higher Nekima for 13ss and please let me know if there is something I'm missing there. 

As I played that first game I liked how the Madness messed with the enemy/supported Pandora but I agree they really felt more like scheme runners

I'm not sure if I'd hire changelings with Pandora but if another model is making them for me, I'll certainly use them. 

 

@I'm a Teapot! OH! I thought he could only copy actions now I understand why he would be used more.  I love the idea of getting 2  flip auras up and since they are both on 50mm bases that's a pretty big area

Also Incorporeal you take 1/2 damage from ML and SH attacks. Is that damage round up or down? I assume down, but I wanted to find it in writing. I failed to find it in the core rule book mind you I was looking though it on my phone and with drop box so not the best why to look things up. 

[Nikodemus]

1 hour ago, frostwolf428 said:

Also Incorporeal you take 1/2 damage from ML and SH attacks. Is that damage round up or down? I assume down, but I wanted to find it in writing. I failed to find it in the core rule book mind you I was looking though it on my phone and with drop box so not the best why to look things up. 

It's up. Page 20 in the small rulebook has it:

Quote

 

Rounding

When the rules require a player to divide a number, the result is rounded up to the nearest whole number (one half of 7 would round up to 4, for instance).

 

 

[I'm a Teapot!]

Fun thing: I think you could take copy the bonus range ability from the bandersnatch to give the emissary range 4/9 for a turn =D

[HydroMog]

1 hour ago, I'm a Teapot! said:

Fun thing: I think you could take copy the bonus range ability from the bandersnatch to give the emissary range 4/9 for a turn =D

only if your buried though.

and as for the teddy + kade thing. its to help get kade into the 1" sweet spot to hit for +4 dmg while next to another friendly model. though it does take a turn to get there since "wheres teddy" is a 2 ap.

[I'm a Teapot!]

7 hours ago, HydroMog said:

only if your buried though.

and as for the teddy + kade thing. its to help get kade into the 1" sweet spot to hit for +4 dmg while next to another friendly model. though it does take a turn to get there since "wheres teddy" is a 2 ap.

Damn I missed "while buried"... sry

I got to try copying copycat from a changeling and using it to copy pandoras actions while being near the poltergeist.

Ive also thaught about copying tucos def trigger, but it seems like a worse version of copying vasilisas aura.

Wall Climber from a grootslang might also be nice.

[Da Git]

On 04/12/2017 at 6:48 PM, I'm a Teapot! said:

I've also had a lot of positive experience playing Aeslin in the woe is me list and Aeslin is really really good vs the void crew aswell.

Hi! If possible, would you be able to elaborate a bit on this one? 

I'm kinda in the "Aeslin's terrible"  camp! 

Cheers! 

[le_sphinx]

20 hours ago, frostwolf428 said:

I think I would use Graves to push Tannen more often since he is only walk 4 and Pandora has some movement tricks of her own.

I'm surprised by the Teddy baby Kade choice, while I think its a cool and very thematic choice its 18ss and a lot of set up to get the high damage when I could just higher Nekima for 13ss and please let me know if there is something I'm missing there. 

I'm not sure if I'd hire changelings with Pandora but if another model is making them for me, I'll certainly use them. 

It’s ok for Tannen just spend his activation for double walk. The “cooler” aura is his main weapon. Also should be noted he applies a condition when using his attack. 

Well, no doubts that Nekima is very useful, but.. I don’t have her In comparison with Teddy she is more reliable for sure - min 4 damage, melle expert instead of “flurry”, better characteristics. Both have some stuff against Wp, which is good for Pandora. Teddy+Kade costs 5ss more, but they are two murder models = two activations with 8(!) possible attacks. Teddy has flurry and inbuilt trigger with ability to push the target. Baby has “pounce” to react on those pushes. Yeah it’s hard to do that combo in practice, but sounds nasty, isn’t it? And they have solid placing-pushing synergy as @HydroMog mentioned.

Changelings are really good minions for just 4ss and the opportunity to summon them is an amazing! I had some greedy doubts before purchasing Emissary and these creepy boyz, but now I am really happy with them. Some experienced forum members inspired me with their suggestions in “Dreamer tactica” thread

On 12/5/2017 at 6:42 PM, I'm a Teapot! said:

Running an Adze and scoring Claimjump with it and the emissary without spending ap seems fun. 

Oh mate! You generate so freaking genius ideas!! 

Does it mean that if Emissary copies Tannen’s aura and enemy toches two of these auras, he will need to discard two cards before cheating?

[I'm a Teapot!]

3 hours ago, Da Git said:

Hi! If possible, would you be able to elaborate a bit on this one? 

I'm kinda in the "Aeslin's terrible"  camp! 

Cheers! 

Well first of all aeslin has a claw atk targeting wp, so there is a lot of use for this in a pandora crew. She also has the passive wp duel on activation in her engagment. And I've loved Aeslin vs Tara because her (0) that discards a schememarker to generate an aura that gives enemies around her (-) to casts is brilliant vs the Nothing beast, the scion, void wretches and aionus. Also her Atks are casts and therefore ignore incorporeal.

I also like to bring her if I expect lures of any type in the enemy lines. Her other (0) just makes you immune to lures if you position carefully. Its more of a sideeffect but my opponents told me that they felt like spending stones on their belles/Lilithu/Beckoners felt pretty wasted in those games where turn 1 and 2 Aeslin protected my crew and in later turns they were already dead or lures didnt matter as much anymore. 

Aeslin does relatively weak dmg on her own, but she is phenomenal in a pandora crew in my opinion. I find myself charging a lot more with Aeslin than I use her range atk tho.

I've also started to try Vasilisa with Aeslin or Candy in a Pandora list. That trick with obeying people to disengage from pandora/aeslin/candy can wreck people so hard. Usually the enemy doesnt expect Candy or aeslin to charge you early and then I gladly stone for each obey and keep some high cards for vasilisa, because every obey is worth 3 or more wp fails for all misery auras in range. I'll even double walk aeslin into melee for this.

Pandora and Aeslin in melee with any model in the game (lets say they didnt charge, just got into melee somehow and didnt do dmg with their activations) Pandora usually summons 1-2 Sorrows early and the emissary tries to get into range and copy misery. So let's say 1 misery from pandora, 1 from a Sorrow, 1 from the emissary as a bad case scenario. Vasilisa Obeys the enemy = 3 dmg, makes the model try to walk out of engagement, you controll all flips and its pretty easy to fail them on purpose. This means 3 misery damage from Pandoras disengaging strike and 3 misery damage from Aeslins disengaging strike. 
9 times 1dmg from a single Vasilisa obey and she is free to do it a second time and normally I manage to get more then 1 Sorrow into the heat of the battle. Obviously this ignores armor, incorporeal and hard to kill.

If nothing has died to misery before, it now did and the poltergeist gets summoned. And whenever the poltergeist gets summoned in the frontline of the enemies, the pandora player has a good time.

Be aware of arcane shield and the new titania upgrade tho. =D

[Angelshard]

IUnfortunately not it's one card not +1 so it doesn't stack.

@Da Git aeslins never been terrible, she's just been a bit too squishy and had too much difficulty dealing serious damage.

With Pandora she's a lot better than with titania (at lest in my opinion).

Emissary can copy casting expert or curse of Autumn as needed. 

As leaves on the wind makes all those incorporeal models in a traditional. Pandora crew a bit harder to remove and can really mess with a lot of support pieces. 

Her close attack might not be the best in the damage department, but it targets wp. 

Teapot answered first and better. That's what happens when you cook while trying to answer.

[le_sphinx]

14 hours ago, Angelshard said:

IUnfortunately not it's one card not +1 so it doesn't stack.

But will it work with two Poltergeist's auras? Just need to be 101% sure

[Angelshard]

I'd say yes. As long as the enemy is within 2" of both models he gets a  from each.

[Nikodemus]

"Distraction: Enemy models within aura-2 of this model suffer - to WP duels"

Nothing in there says or implies that it doesn't stack.

[I'm a Teapot!]

Auras generally do stack unless they have that kind of wording that curse of the autumn has. "...one or more models with this ability..."

[spikes]

On 12/5/2017 at 8:34 AM, Ozzy said:

Just to be clear:

1. Pandora Quick Rundown: [...] The Bad [...] Can be rendered toothless by a Crew that ignores pulses and auras (Von Schill and his Freikorps)
"Freikorp Suit" only ignores damage from Pulses and Blasts. Not Auras.

2. Upgrades: [...] Pandora/Woe Upgrades [...] Cry For Me: [...] Again, do note the phrasing. The blast affects ALL models, including friendly models and Pandora! Might be a sneaky and situational way to push Pandora out of the way too, since succeeding the Wp duel will trigger Fading Memory.
"Dark Thoughts" causes a Simple Wp Duel and "Fading Memory" triggers on opposed Wp duels against enemy models.

Best Wishes
Ozzy

Updated. Thanks for the catch!

 

On 12/7/2017 at 2:16 AM, I'm a Teapot! said:

Well first of all aeslin has a claw atk targeting wp, so there is a lot of use for this in a pandora crew. She also has the passive wp duel on activation in her engagment. And I've loved Aeslin vs Tara because her (0) that discards a schememarker to generate an aura that gives enemies around her (-) to casts is brilliant vs the Nothing beast, the scion, void wretches and aionus. Also her Atks are casts and therefore ignore incorporeal.

I also like to bring her if I expect lures of any type in the enemy lines. Her other (0) just makes you immune to lures if you position carefully. Its more of a sideeffect but my opponents told me that they felt like spending stones on their belles/Lilithu/Beckoners felt pretty wasted in those games where turn 1 and 2 Aeslin protected my crew and in later turns they were already dead or lures didnt matter as much anymore. 

Aeslin does relatively weak dmg on her own, but she is phenomenal in a pandora crew in my opinion. I find myself charging a lot more with Aeslin than I use her range atk tho.

I've also started to try Vasilisa with Aeslin or Candy in a Pandora list. That trick with obeying people to disengage from pandora/aeslin/candy can wreck people so hard. Usually the enemy doesnt expect Candy or aeslin to charge you early and then I gladly stone for each obey and keep some high cards for vasilisa, because every obey is worth 3 or more wp fails for all misery auras in range. I'll even double walk aeslin into melee for this.

Pandora and Aeslin in melee with any model in the game (lets say they didnt charge, just got into melee somehow and didnt do dmg with their activations) Pandora usually summons 1-2 Sorrows early and the emissary tries to get into range and copy misery. So let's say 1 misery from pandora, 1 from a Sorrow, 1 from the emissary as a bad case scenario. Vasilisa Obeys the enemy = 3 dmg, makes the model try to walk out of engagement, you controll all flips and its pretty easy to fail them on purpose. This means 3 misery damage from Pandoras disengaging strike and 3 misery damage from Aeslins disengaging strike. 
9 times 1dmg from a single Vasilisa obey and she is free to do it a second time and normally I manage to get more then 1 Sorrow into the heat of the battle. Obviously this ignores armor, incorporeal and hard to kill.

If nothing has died to misery before, it now did and the poltergeist gets summoned. And whenever the poltergeist gets summoned in the frontline of the enemies, the pandora player has a good time.

Be aware of arcane shield and the new titania upgrade tho. =D

Can I quote this in the starting posts?

[I'm a Teapot!]

4 hours ago, spikes said:

Updated. Thanks for the catch!

 

Can I quote this in the starting posts?

Of course.=)

[Xaos]

How about this:

Pandora (Box Opens)
Poltergeist
Widow Weaver
Mysterious Emissary (Conflux of Sorrow)
Sorrow
Sorrow
Sorrow
Insidious Madness
Insidious Madness

What do you think?

[Le gob]

I tried Pandora (Woe is me) today on headhunter against lady Justice.
The begining was really hard, but it worked out pretty well once I managed to summon the totem and 2 sorrows at the begining of turn 3.
Barbaros helped immensely to take the agro off the sorrows.
I ended up wining 8-4 with only Lady J left on the table at the end of turn 5.

The sorrows are relatively easy to summon, and 5ss is too expensive to buy in the initial list, I'd rather take something else instead.
On turn 4, I had 4 sorrows on the table and the damage output from Pandora was insane.

So my experience was the engine is slow to get running, but once you do, it's damn efficient.

[Pikciwok]

On 17.12.2017 at 10:22 PM, Xaos said:

How about this:

Pandora (Box Opens)
Poltergeist
Widow Weaver
Mysterious Emissary (Conflux of Sorrow)
Sorrow
Sorrow
Sorrow
Insidious Madness
Insidious Madness

What do you think?

Playable. I would change one Sorrow for Iggy. I tried 3 Sorrows before and IMHO it's too much. Iggy is another Martyr, plus he allows the Emissary to copy Martyr. 3 Martyrs make your crew very survivable.

[Corwin]

I played my 2nd game of Pandora with woe is me vs Homman and did extremely well. I had
Crew Name: Pandora crew 1 50ss 
Leader: Pandora - Cache:(3)
   On Wings of Darkness 1ss 
   Woe is Me 2ss 
   Fears Given Form 1ss 
Primordial Magic 2ss 
Candy 9ss 
   Depression 1ss 
   A Thousand Faces 1ss 
Widow Weaver 8ss 
Doppleganger 7ss 
   A Thousand Faces 1ss 
Insidious Madness 5ss 
Sorrow 5ss 
He had Ryle, Howard, metal gaming, hunter, watcher, and a warden.

He was  close together the Hoff bubble making him easy to get most of his crew in my auras. Power loop being a condition made summoning more sorrows a sinch. Bottom of 2 I double walked the madness in the middle of his crew having everyone but the watcher and the warden in his discard to cheat aura. Top of 3 i cheat initiative with the doppelganger Pandora makes a sorrow incites for the push to get in the midde of everyone and inflicts twice wiping out his hand, killing the hunter leaving Hoffman with one wound in Candy's FGF (from 1000 faces) to die on activation. He called it there.

[Pikciwok]

In my opinion Pandora has the upper hand over Hoffman, nevertheless: congratulations

I really like your Candy configuration. I haven't used mine since that cursed gg2017 came out and I miss her. Hopefully new Gaining Grounds will be more gracious for her.

I'd like to suggest you taking more soulstones in the cache: it would help you with survival, summoning, and getting that sweet sweet trigger on Incite.

[INXVI]

Hey guys, so I'm looking for some advice, I'm entering a Tournament tomorrow and I'm probably going to run Pandora for the first game. My lists are pretty solid for the other 2 games, but I've been struggling to make a list for the first game.

The strategy is Public Execution, with the schemes of Set Up (3), Hold Up Their Forces (4), Inescapable Trap (6), Vendetta (13) & Eliminate The Leadership (Always)

Initially, the schemes have a balance of killing, with keeping the enemy alive, both lists I've trialed over the past week have been successful in one area but not another. It almost feels like focussing on killing is the most potent choice.

On that note, could anyone help me build a list that could fare up well with this scheme pool? I don't own the Widoe Weaver, Insidious Madness or Emissary, but I own a lot of the other elements a Pandora crew needs.

Thanks