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Tangle Shadows sacrifice


Sir Andersen
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Tangle shadows is really good for running a fast model forward then swapping it with a beater. Neat! That's not what this is about however.

Let's say I want to Tangle Shadows specifically to pull in an enemy. Maybe I want to do some cheeky growing, maybe I just want to murder fools. Given that this is dependant on enemy placement I can't really expect the model I swap forward to be in a good position. In fact if my opponent has any experience with Tangle Shadows I should probably expect it to be in a pretty bad situation.

Therefore I kind of consider the model I throw forward a "sacrifice". A trade for whatever effect I get from pulling in the enemy. A big expensive beater seems a bad candidate for this unless I have out-activated my opponent.

 

So what would you use in this situation? I can basically think of 2 avenues of approach. Either you sacrifice something as cheap as possible (corrupted hounds seem PERFECT for this, with Black Blood being a nice bonus) or you go with something that's hard to kill, like a Waldgeist or an unactivated Doppelganger. The tough model will probably still die, but will require some effort from the opponent and hopefully cling to life long enough to eat up some activations at least.

What would you recommend for this tactic?

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I'm not sure I would build to include a sacrificial target, and I might pick my tangle shadows target less to put my own models at risk. But as you say, Corrupt hounds are good, as would depleted, and defensive stance terror tots.

The whole thing seems to be an unplanned way of using it, very dependent on board position. I''d happily sacrifice any model from my crew if I thought it was going to help me win.

In the olden days (1st edition) the normal plan was to do this with a model that could activate right after Lilith so you were not throwing out a hopeless sacrifice. Of course the chain activation rules have changed since then, and that's a bit harder to do, but its another way to consider it. 

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With Frame for Murder a thing, I'd say you can pick whatever the hell you want.  In those situations, I'd rather feign a big beater going forward so it isn't obvious that it's my FfM target when I try to keep it alive through enforcer and minion attacks, but as soon as a henchman or master come at it, suddenly I don't have cards to cheat with.  If I throw a sacrifice forward, I'm basically guaranteeing I'm only getting 2 points from it.  I can sustain a big guy through enough attacks to let the 3 point kill come in.

Other than that, I typically use it on Lilith

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I ran a swampfiend crew with Lilith this weekend with Juju + EF as the Sacrificial lamb. As a little bonus he even had a Bandersnatch packed on his back. Killed 2 models before my opponent was able to kill him. And he comes back as soon as something other than Bandersnatch dies. 

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Stitched together might be an option, their "rotten contents" deals 2 dmg with 2" reach as a "defence" trigger, they can do serious damage and gets soft cover with their (0) which may drain some cards, plus it reactivates if it goes down to Hard to kill. Not something you want up in your face and still annoying to deal with 

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8 hours ago, Mununkulus said:

I ran a swampfiend crew with Lilith this weekend with Juju + EF as the Sacrificial lamb. As a little bonus he even had a Bandersnatch packed on his back. Killed 2 models before my opponent was able to kill him. And he comes back as soon as something other than Bandersnatch dies. 

FFM doesn't work on bad juju, as he never actually dies. 

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Hound would work especially if you can somehow black blood bomb it with a shaman before it dies.

Juju with eternal fiend and fears given form could be gross especially if you've given him black blood.

Same thing applies with stitched as above  rotten contents plus black blood.

Candy with fears if it's the first activation especially as she can run away home and possibly repeat the following turn.

Depends if fluff/theme/aesthetics bother you.

 

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I would say that using tangle shadows effectively depends on when in the round you run it. 

If its at the start of the turn theres usually a model from the enemy crew thats moved forward ready for the others to move up. You can always tangle that one and then dump a set of trees the other side of your newly placed model to slow the enemy down. 

The other way is to use it later in the turn when most of the models  have activated. That way you're putting your model into a bunch of already activated ones so they can then go to town on them.

As to what model to use. Doppleganger's quite a good one. Especially if you can get an insidious madness up there too. Or if you're running a nephilim crew put a terror tot up there but keep it in wthin 6" and line of site of other nephilim so that if it dies your other models get to move up to the killer. Very nice if you have Nekima waiting in the wings ready to go kill crazy.

I've also found mature nephilim are quite good. They're farily robust with armour and will only really be taking 1 activations worth of damage before they start wailing on your opponent's crew. Great if you have a few high tomes in hand to get charge through off and hit your opponents 'safe' models in their backfield.

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13 hours ago, Joel said:

this is where barbaros actually comes in handy - he can extract himself with his nimble and charge the target you tangled back in your own lines.

plus he's just really tough, so if he can't break away he can go defensive and probably tank the world.

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Thanks to everyone who has contributed so far. Getting a lot of good ideas to consider.

 

One thing that was especially under my radar was the idea of an, as of yet unactivated, Candy. Manipulative to (maybe) stay alive and then run away home after an activation of being a pain. This clocks especially hard on my radar since, unlike doppelgangers or stitched together, I actually already have her.

Sure it's not the OBVIOUS theme, but I don't see any good argument for why the murderous psycho girl couldn't team up with the murderous psycho mother :D

How terrible would you say it is to try and deal with a (still Manipulative) Candy with Fears Given Form and black blood (given by a shaman)?

Last time I used Candy she was too good. Deployment was close, so run away home pretty much let me unbury her within easy reach of the action every time.

 

Lot of other stuff is good as well. And yeah as has been pointed out, a lot of it is in the execution as well. The where and when. I just like to approach it from the angle of "which model am I using for this, and with that in mind, what sitations am I looking out for"

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