Generalist Masters?

[Hargrave]

I keep waffling between outcasts and ressers,  and have some models for both, but I feel like I need to stick to one master and learn it before I go crazy buying models. Is there a master in either faction that works well for just about any scheme? Only ones I don't really care for are Von Schill, Misaki and Reva

[D_acolyte]

35 minutes ago, Hargrave said:

I keep waffling between outcasts and ressers,  and have some models for both, but I feel like I need to stick to one master and learn it before I go crazy buying models. Is there a master in either faction that works well for just about any scheme? Only ones I don't really care for are Von Schill, Misaki and Reva

For the most part I will skip the ones you have because I figure you already know them better then me.

Most masters can do or lead a crew that can do most schemes. My recommendation is to look at the drapes, I mean the other models/masters in a faction to decide which you would like. I often would say if you are looking to your master to run schemes then it is dire and something went way wrong or way right.

Reser wise Nicodem, Kirai and Molly tend to be very strong summoners. Of them I would say Kirai has the "most" trouble with some schemes because most tend to like to keep models in her bubble. Nicodem is not fast but can make your force more mobile or summon where he want. Molly similar to Kirai tends to like things in a bubble near her but also has one of the best scheme runners in the game.

Seamus and McMourning tend to be very mobile masters with various actions. McMourning like to poison people but also has a 0 action to push another model and place a scheme mark. I can not talk to much about Seamus as I tend not to see him.

Yan Lo can be fun but takes a works, in some ways if your looking for just a master that can do a little of everything he is probably it. He has a movement trick, can bring ancestors back to life, become more survivable mid game and can work with spirits. If you take him I would recommend no more then 3 ancestors at a time.

If your new to the game do not run Tara, one you will get less the feel of the resurs or the outcast and two she can get very complicated with activation order and her tricks.

The most restrictive masters on your collection of them will be Kirai, Molly and Tara.

In the outcast.

Leveticus and Victoria is supper killy but the Vics are more mobile.

Parker is very mean in scheme marker heavy pools so probably not what you are going for.

Hamelin messes with your enemy plan by preventing charges or making rats. He shines if all your enemies are near him.

Jack is a non killy masters and I tend to see him with non killy crews but they can do a lot of scheming and movement tricks.

 

Can you refine what you want in a generalist master? For instance do you want a combat master or something else? There are 19 different schemes and 5 different strategies some of this comes down to know what you want to play for. Also are you playing GG2016 or the main book schemes and strats?

 

 

 

 

[Four_N_Six]

When it comes to generalizing like that, I think you're better off considering the crew over the master.  Most masters can do any thing as long as you hire the crew accordingly.  Obviously some options are better than others in some situations, but you could use anybody for anything with the right supportive crew.

In that vain, I'd suggest either Nicodem or Kirai, just because they can summon so many different models to really cover what you need.  Tara would probably be a good generalist as well, mostly because she likes to power up her crew, so as long as you're hiring the crew to do the job you need, she can increase their effectiveness no matter what it is they need to do.  Kill, scheme run, interact, all much easier when you have something with Fast.  Plus Tara is Outcast/Resser, so you're covering both bases pretty well that way.

[Hargrave]

9 minutes ago, D_acolyte said:

Can you refine what you want in a generalist master? For instance do you want a combat master or something else? There are 19 different schemes and 5 different strategies some of this comes down to know what you want to play for. Also are you playing GG2016 or the main book schemes and strats?

I'm playing GG2016 mostly. I guess I'm mostly looking for a master that can do a bit of everything, or at least can run a crew that can. I'd look more at Molly/Nico, but my budget is pretty limited, so I'd rather not need to buy a ton of models to add to a summoner's toolbox or Levi's. Hamelin summoning is pretty appealing because of that. If you need a specific focus, I guess I tend to play debuffers and sometimes buffers in other games.

[Hargrave]

2 minutes ago, Four_N_Six said:

When it comes to generalizing like that, I think you're better off considering the crew over the master.  Most masters can do any thing as long as you hire the crew accordingly.  Obviously some options are better than others in some situations, but you could use anybody for anything with the right supportive crew.

In that vain, I'd suggest either Nicodem or Kirai, just because they can summon so many different models to really cover what you need.  Tara would probably be a good generalist as well, mostly because she likes to power up her crew, so as long as you're hiring the crew to do the job you need, she can increase their effectiveness no matter what it is they need to do.  Kill, scheme run, interact, all much easier when you have something with Fast.  Plus Tara is Outcast/Resser, so you're covering both bases pretty well that way.

Yeah, Tara seems pretty appealing too. Karina seems iffy, and I keep hearing that Tara isn't great when I ask about her, though.

[Four_N_Six]

Well I think she's just hard to learn, not necessarily that she isn't great.  I'm not saying she is either, I haven't used her yet.  I've only recently come to Ressers from Gremlins.  I have 4 masters (Seamus, Kirai, Tara, and Reva should be on my door before I get home from work), and Tara is last on my list to learn because of the curve.  That's partly because I need to learn the Resser models in general, since she just increases their effectiveness.  I figured she'd be much easier to learn once I have the hang of what my other models can do.

[Terwox]

Tara's fun.  She's different, but fun.  You don't have to run beastie bomb strategies with her, but it's nice to have the option!  Her learning curve is noticeably higher, and she might not work as well with most schemes, but she's somewhat versatile.

Karina is iffy, not being able to stone for summons hurts, you've got about a 58% chance of drawing a card you can summon w/ for her (assuming you stone for cards.)  I like her, but you can run graveyard spirit instead, etc.

[D_acolyte]

1 minute ago, Hargrave said:

I'm playing GG2016 mostly. I guess I'm mostly looking for a master that can do a bit of everything, or at least can run a crew that can. I'd look more at Molly/Nico, but my budget is pretty limited, so I'd rather not need to buy a ton of models to add to a summoner's toolbox or Levi's. Hamelin summoning is pretty appealing because of that. If you need a specific focus, I guess I tend to play debuffers and sometimes buffers in other games.

The trick to building out a tool box for a summoner such as Nicodem or Molly is not to buy it all at once but instead go with what you think you will summon the most. For instance if I had to list 3 common summons I would tell you that belles, flesh constructs and Punk Zombies are good for Nicodem and do not take supper high cards at a 9, 10 or 11 of crow. For Molly going down the horror rout drowned, punk zombies and guild autopsy are all good to start with. Then if you are to limit it down I would tell you punk zombies as they are a good combat summon. You go from summoning one or two models and increase it over time as you say "it has been a month or 3 and I really want to be able to summon X type of model," that how you increase your summoning pool with toolbox summoners. By the end of a year you may have all the summons or all the ones you really care about/use often.

Schemes and Stones has a post about building on a budget, I would recommend at least looking at it:
https://schemesandstones.wordpress.com/2016/07/25/building-on-a-budget-ressurectionists/

[Hargrave]

Alright. Not sure if I'll try the summoners to start off, but I might give Tara a shot. She seems like she has a big toolbox on her own with being supporty and the beast bomb thing. Only thing I'd really be unsure of is when to use the "go back to deployment zone" upgrade over getting a reactivate. Plus, then I can build towards ressers or outcasts based on which models I wind up liking more. Sure, there's a learning curve, but it doesn't seem too bad.

Thanks for the help!

[hydranixx]

If you're looking to play Tara, you'll be getting as many models as most summoner masters anyway lol; some combination of Killjoy, maybe Bete, Guild Marshals, Scion of the Void maybe? Possibly also things for Karina to summon if you ever want to play her that way - Punk Zombies, Autopsies... You might also consider some staple choices like Nurses/Belles/Graveyard Spirit or Trappers/Johan/Sue etc. 

That being said, I agree that she is a flexible master. It's an added bonus that she works in both factions you're considering. If there's anything holding her back from being popular, it's that she's very intricate, and she really requires lots of playtime to really understand. Anyone who's ever played Tara will tell you that you need to be patient while you learn her. There's lots to take in, and there's so much she can do that it's easy to get overwhelmed at first, and when you don't know when to take advantage of all her tricks, she begins to seem underwhelming.

I'll be playing against a veteran Tara player this evening, which is a kinder way of saying I'll be getting destroyed by a veteran Tara player this evening, so I'll try query his opinion on learning Tara, her flexibility and her place in both factions for you

[hydranixx]

I caught up with the person I mentioned above for his advice and opinions. He played Tara almost exclusively for a year straight. In his view, Tara is good at almost any set of schemes and stones as she multiplies the strengths of her crew and can get 6ap per turn. Having more models in your hiring pool really helps her thrive in her role. 

She requires a lot of planning and card management, especially with her base crew's Df mechanic and Bury mechanic. He's only played her in Outcast, so can't comment on the Resser side. Karina can be quite good. She's a bit of a gamble since she can't stone for suits. He usually averages 1 summoned Punk Zombie per game and sometimes an Autopsy or two as well depending how many  he gets. Scion of the Void is his mvp, and offers a few nifty tricks for an enterprising Tara player.