Asami List Theoryfaux

[Somnicide]

A fun trick I picked up forcing myself to hire only oni for the first bunch of games was the Akaname actually have a really nice synergy with the yokai. can you shoot them and give them a poison, and then you get a huge double flicker move at the end of the turn with them. It's good with both hired and summoned yokai.

[InvokeChaos]

On 1/25/2017 at 8:00 AM, whodares said:

I was looking at getting a summoning master and I'm already heavily invested into the Ten Thunders. Naturally I would look at Asami. Reading this thread has shed some light on how she works, but I still have a couple of questions:

1. Does she have a super-high summon with Tannen the way Dreamer can summon Teddy? I don't think so, but I can always be mistaken.
2. How do you get your corpse/scrap markers down? I've read somebody said to summon a Yokai Turn 1, but seems strange as sacrificed models don't drop markers iirc?
3. I suck with Shenlong as doing schemes is my weakest part of this game. Is Asami still a good master for me?
4. How annoying is the Flicker mechanic? Newly-summoned models only last for the turn, unless you have corpse/scrap markers closeby. Yokai can get up to +2 Flicker if summoned (?) so he kind of bypasses this.

Thanks for the answers

Just my own two cents...

1. As mentioned above Joro is the guy. And yes Tannen can be useful. Something to consider: we have no use for 11 & 12. There is no oni summon at those levels. But Tannen makes them into Joro. Not the only reason to run Tannen, but that is the argument for him in regards to the Dreamer comparison.

2. Yes Yokai turn 1 are a great summon. I often summon 2-3. They come in flicker 2, so they stick around for turn 2, which is what I need them for. As to markers, @tomjoad had it covered: obsidian and yokai drop them on triggers.

3. If doing schemes is your weakest part, then changing Masters isn't necessarily what needs to be fixed. As especially with the new GG2017 schemes, being able to take care of your schemes is tantamount to victory. Asami is a great enabler of this in general. I slightly disagree with tomjoad as I see Asami as more of a mid-field support summoner. She has plenty of reposition tricks and the ability to buff your oni and minions as well as eat enemy scheme markers. Her damage track is solid, but it's only 1" and she's not stalwart enough to actually get in the thick. Her aggression comes purely from her summons. Shenlong is one of our most complex masters however, so I wouldn't use him as a benchmark for whether or not you can scheme. Try Asami out, and see what you think! I also recommend McCabe who has a pretty easy baseline (just throw in puppies and give them items) to a very complex set of capabilites. So he's good for ramping up your scheming and complexity game.

4. The most annoying part is simply remembering to tick it down at the end of the turn. Other than that, you are looking at summons as abilities, more than summons. Like jamming up models with a joro and putting out some damage... you could consider that a root effect that deals damage.  Because he's going to go away at the end of the turn, you need to plan with the impact play in mind. If you have corpses and scrap littered about, think of it as an actual summon and look at is an attrition play. Ultimately, the question you should always ask yourself when summoning (or taking any action really) is "will this enable me to score or deny VP?" If the answer is no, then consider carefully what it's supplying you before chucking it out. I've had that monster multiple 13 hand before and not summoned anything that turn, because ultimately I needed the cards to score points. Or they were better served waiting for the following turn.

 

In regard to the Jorogumo vs Yokai discussion...

 

You can't really compare their summons because they are designed to do two completely different things. Yokai are mobile scheme runners with a strong aggressive utility. But their damage track, often able to get moderate, is equal to a joro's minimum. I just don't think diving in your Ml5 models to Df6+ enemies is a good play... unless you REALLY have to.  to attacks or not, you can't count on it to put that damage out. It's just not a certainty.

I use yokai as anti-scheme runners (I can easily one-round a sillurid with a summoned yokai) and I use Joro as bruiser control models. I also send them after anything (typically minions) that are Df5 or lower. I have often hired a Jorogumo with Asami and that works pretty well. And also makes the summoning of a second Joro that much more terrifying.

You just have to take the situations into account. Yokai have often been a better choice when what I'm up against doesn't hit hard and I just need to engage it.  But if I need to tie up a Nekima... you bet your bottom Joro is coming out. 

[qoob]

10 hours ago, InvokeChaos said:

 

1. As mentioned above Joro is the guy. And yes Tannen can be useful. Something to consider: we have no use for 11 & 12. There is no oni summon at those levels. But Tannen makes them into Joro. Not the only reason to run Tannen, but that is the argument for him in regards to the Dreamer comparison.

 

I guess i'm the only one here almost everytime starting with 11 and 12 of  in hand instead of everything else 

[tomjoad]

8 hours ago, qoob said:

I guess i'm the only one here almost everytime starting with 11 and 12 of  in hand instead of everything else 

Exactly; Tannen helps with as many cards as he hurts, so his ability to help you summon is going to be minimal, and doesn't have the huge payoff it can have with Dreamer. We're debating about whether Jorogumo are better than Yokai anyway, and there is clearly no Teddy-level monster for us to aim for here. Again, Tannen just is good, and since an Asami crew is encouraged to bunch up a bit anyway, Cooler and Chatty can both shine. Just don't bank on Leave it to Luck providing a lot of value.

[whodares]

Do you feel like the Oni and Yokai are sufficient to generate scrap and corpse markers?

Does the sacrifice work against you for Reckoning?

Do you feel like you can get a good alpha strike with emissary, asami and bettari? I'm comparing it to how I have a tendancy to blow up stuff turn 1 with my lynch, huggy and Yu combo. I can blow up people that are standing on their own board edge turn 1 rofl

[qoob]

3 hours ago, whodares said:

Do you feel like the Oni and Yokai are sufficient to generate scrap and corpse markers?

Does the sacrifice work against you for Reckoning?

Do you feel like you can get a good alpha strike with emissary, asami and bettari? I'm comparing it to how I have a tendancy to blow up stuff turn 1 with my lynch, huggy and Yu combo. I can blow up people that are standing on their own board edge turn 1 rofl

As the game goes on, you'll have markers to use for summoning. So I wouldn't say that you need the Obsidian Onis or Yokai to get the markers per se - you have beaters and stuff with you as well.

I played against Pandora in Headhunter. Reckoning is similar in the way that you have to kill someone. The Pandora player mood swinged my Yokai and my Jorogumo. The sacrifice was a necessary step. So a clear Yes from my side.

You could probably, yes. But a "in your face turn 1 Bettari" is probably going to die pretty fast because she has no defensive mechanisms besides her option to use soulstones. I would personally exchange Bettari for Yasunori for such trick because Yasunori is more resilient and you can keep your stones for summoning. And if Tail 'Em is in the pool, even better - you don't want to add a Henchie to your Crew if the scheme is in the pool.

 

[Somnicide]

Plus you can protect Yasunori with the terra-cotta warrior

[newsun]

You can easily be turn one charging with yokai turn one if it calls for it. It does extend Asami a bit.

[whodares]

8 hours ago, qoob said:

I played against Pandora in Headhunter. Reckoning is similar in the way that you have to kill someone. The Pandora player mood swinged my Yokai and my Jorogumo. The sacrifice was a necessary step. So a clear Yes from my side.

I'm not certain what you mean with this. Do you mean that the Flicker sacrifice counts as kills for Reckoning? I'm only playing on the standard schemes and strats, so I prefer to actually know how the crews interact with them.

 

Guess I won't go with the Bettari alpha strike then. I'll have to switch up my tactics a bit from my Lynch crew then. I'm going to miss blowing up a 10+ ss model turn 1

[qoob]

4 minutes ago, whodares said:

I'm not certain what you mean with this. Do you mean that the Flicker sacrifice counts as kills for Reckoning? I'm only playing on the standard schemes and strats, so I prefer to actually know how the crews interact with them.

 

Guess I won't go with the Bettari alpha strike then. I'll have to switch up my tactics a bit from my Lynch crew then. I'm going to miss blowing up a 10+ ss model turn 1

The opponent won't score if I recall correctly - have to double check the wording but i'm pretty sure you have to kill to score. 

Yasunori is able to kill a 10+ model with the right hand. 

[Nikodemus]

Reckoning scores when: "a Crew earns 1 VP if it killed or sacrificed two or more enemy models during that Turn". If you sacrifice your own models enemy won't score for them.

[whodares]

Thanks for the clarification. I thought it worked like that, but I still prefer to get it cleared out before any arguements can start.

[InvokeChaos]

On 1/26/2017 at 4:17 AM, qoob said:

I guess i'm the only one here almost everytime starting with 11 and 12 of  in hand instead of everything else 

Oh my goodness, I seem to always flip tomes whenever I use that damnable aura!  Then my buddy comes out with dreamer and goes... "meh, why not... Teddy..." flips a damn 13 of masks.

Didn't say it was consistent! Just what it's good for haha.

[Jafar]

Great topic guys! Good work.

I hope you can help me with my questions:
- How do you take care of armor?
- Do you use Katanka Snipers?
- How do you play against blasts?

Also providing some core crews would be great

 

[tomjoad]

7 hours ago, Jafar said:

Great topic guys! Good work.

I hope you can help me with my questions:
- How do you take care of armor?
- Do you use Katanka Snipers?
- How do you play against blasts?

Also providing some core crews would be great

 

I occasionally take Snipers, but I feel like, in general, they are the single most overrated model in the faction, if not the game. They're still fine though, and sometimes have a use.

As for armor and blasts, the answer is mostly the same: don't worry about it. Don't ignore it either, but during the course of play you'll just need to be aware of it the answers should come to you naturally (hide a little, spread out a little, don't waste AP attacking Lazarus, etc). If the blasts are coming from Sonnia the answer is different though (you're screwed; everybody is dead; game over man, game over).

[Somnicide]

This is what I've settled into as a pretty common core. 

50 SS Ten Thunders Crew
Asami Tanaka + 7 Pool
- A Heavenly Design (2)
- Grasping Strands (1)
- Nefarious Pact (2)
Ohaguro Bettari (8)
- A Taste For Flesh (1)
- Recalled Training (1)
Obsidian Oni (6)
Terracotta Warrior (5)
Akaname (4)
Akaname (4)

(exported from CrewFaux)

the akaname usually end up doing a first turn combo to puke up a corpse/scrap marker where I want to summon something for an extra flicker and then run schemes, but depending on my opponent the pool table setup etc they might get swapped out for Thunders brothers or yokai or combine for something bigger if I feel I'll need a dedicated tank or beater. They are definitely not required, I've just found I like what they add for my style. I almost treat them more as an alternative to a totem than anything else really. I just like the little guys and they usually win games with aggressive scheme running.

The remaining choices are usually fully in support of the strategy and scheme pool.

[whodares]

Going to be playing Asami tonight with Kamaitachi (of however you write that) and the Terracotta damage controllers. What upgrade do you usually swap between to get the Kamaitachi bonus? I'll be bringing Heavenly design, Grasping strands and Nefarious pact on Asami; My other models will have either Recalled or Equality on them (still deciding).

With Yan Lo, it was fairly easy to decide. Just get a Chi upgrade and trololol swap to Recalled training every single turn. Since I'm bad at using the Soul Porter, the Kamaitachi was a pretty awesome upgrade for me. For Asami, it's a lot harder as I don't have a clue on what would be useful to swap out. I'm thinking about Grasping Strands, but I'm not completely sure about that.

 

EDIT: Just realised Interference is our Strat. How does the Asami Flicker mechanic work with that? Do Flickered models go away before counting the models or do they stay for it?

Currently looking for reliable ways of getting Corpse and Scrap markers as well.

I'm guessing the Yokai's 0 action allows him to take the interact action even when engaged, right?

 

So many ways of getting stuff done in this crew, it's insane. I'm used to playing Yan Lo and Lynch, but this crew just seems pretty crazy!

[Nikodemus]

Flicker ends "at the end of the turn". Small rulebook page 32 states that end of turn effects happen during the upkeep step. VP happens after that.

So Oni that flicker out aren't on the board when you check for VP.

[Kogan Style]

40 minutes ago, whodares said:

Currently looking for reliable ways of getting Corpse and Scrap markers as we

This is why I like to hire an Obsidian Oni, as they auto trigger to drop scrap from their 'Flames from the Heavens' attack which is very handy for Asami to boost the flicker values.

[whodares]

3 hours ago, Nikodemus said:

Flicker ends "at the end of the turn". Small rulebook page 32 states that end of turn effects happen during the upkeep step. VP happens after that.

So Oni that flicker out aren't on the board when you check for VP.

Should have known this. It's really been too long since I last had something like this :s

 

3 hours ago, Kogan Style said:

This is why I like to hire an Obsidian Oni, as they auto trigger to drop scrap from their 'Flames from the Heavens' attack which is very handy for Asami to boost the flicker values.

Thanks for the answers. I knew about the Obsidian, but I'm still a bit hesitant on using it right now.

 

Any hints on what upgrades you're swapping with Kamaitachi + Terracotta?

I'm guessing the Yokai 0 action let's him use the interact action whether or not he's engaged, but it would be great to get some confirmation on that.

[Kogan Style]

49 minutes ago, whodares said:

Any hints on what upgrades you're swapping with Kamaitachi + Terracotta?

I'm guessing the Yokai 0 action let's him use the interact action whether or not he's engaged, but it would be great to get some confirmation on that.

Yokai - depends which interact action you want to use. If you want to drop a scheme marker then you cannot be engaged when this happens (but you will place 3" from lowering flicker first so most of the time you can escape engagement)  but the VP schemes which require interactions with a model can be done while engaged. Note you can't interact the turn you summon a Yokai.

The options for upgrade swapping is many and varied! For example you could finish Asami's activation while she has Nefarious Pact (so she draws a card) and then swap it to Heavenly Design (if she doesnt have it already) so that Oni that flicker out at the end of the turn drop a scheme marker, or Fate of Mortals so that Oni minions that kill other models allow you to draw another card (This is also rare 1 so you can't have 2 copies of this on the board).  Holding Feigned Weakness to acquire some free summons could be useful, then when the VP score is tied you can swap it for Recalled Training so Asami can go to town on the remaining models for the final turn. It really grants flexibility to an already flexible master.

[whodares]

25 minutes ago, Kogan Style said:

Yokai - depends which interact action you want to use. If you want to drop a scheme marker then you cannot be engaged when this happens (but you will place 3" from lowering flicker first so most of the time you can escape engagement)  but the VP schemes which require interactions with a model can be done while engaged. Note you can't interact the turn you summon a Yokai.

The options for upgrade swapping is many and varied! For example you could finish Asami's activation while she has Nefarious Pact (so she draws a card) and then swap it to Heavenly Design (if she doesnt have it already) so that Oni that flicker out at the end of the turn drop a scheme marker, or Fate of Mortals so that Oni minions that kill other models allow you to draw another card (This is also rare 1 so you can't have 2 copies of this on the board).  Holding Feigned Weakness to acquire some free summons could be useful, then when the VP score is tied you can swap it for Recalled Training so Asami can go to town on the remaining models for the final turn. It really grants flexibility to an already flexible master.

Thanks for this. I already forgot summoned models can't interact first turn. This is my first "real" summoner I'm playing, so I'm going to have to reread some rules now.

Your upgrade swapping is so much better than what I had in mind with switching to Recalled training all the time. It really shows how great the differences in mindset between masters are.

I'll definitely take a look at Fate of Mortals as it seems like a really nice suggestion here!

[Nikodemus]

5 hours ago, whodares said:

I'm guessing the Yokai 0 action let's him use the interact action whether or not he's engaged, but it would be great to get some confirmation on that.

Small rulebook page 39:

"A model may not declare this[=Interact] Action if it is engaged, unless the Interact Action targets an enemy model."

I don't have Yokai card but if it says you do an Interact Action then all limitations of interact actions apply.

[whodares]

23 hours ago, Kogan Style said:

Yokai - depends which interact action you want to use. If you want to drop a scheme marker then you cannot be engaged when this happens (but you will place 3" from lowering flicker first so most of the time you can escape engagement)  but the VP schemes which require interactions with a model can be done while engaged. Note you can't interact the turn you summon a Yokai.

18 hours ago, Nikodemus said:

Small rulebook page 39:

"A model may not declare this[=Interact] Action if it is engaged, unless the Interact Action targets an enemy model."

I don't have Yokai card but if it says you do an Interact Action then all limitations of interact actions apply.

Just a question about this: Don't I get the 3" place after I declare which interact action and not before?

 

(0) Corrupting Essence (Ca 5 / TN: 10): Lower this model's Flicker Condition by 1.
Then, if this model is still in play, it may take a (1) Interact Action.

 

Ephemeral Warriors: After the value of the Poison or Flicker Condition on this model is lowered, if this model is still in play, this model
may be placed within 3", not in terrain, after completing the current Action. (If the Condition is ended or removed without lowering the value,
this Ability does not come into play).

 

This looks like I first have to remove + declare which interact to complete my 0 action.

Do tell me if I'm wrong here, because it would be very interesting for me to know how these wordings should be read.

 

My crew yesterday fielded both Bettari and Yasunori, but no Yu/Emissary. I have to say Bettari (and the Yokai) get some crazy mobility thanks to Asami. I had 4 soulstones that game, but I feel like I really need more than that to keep up my sommoning engine with Asami. Bettari with Eat Your Fill can be disgustingly good though. Get nearly killed, Asami summons a Yokai behind LoS-blocking terrain and you place Bettari completely safe. Next round you can go HAM, kill something and get Bettari back to full.

I was kind of skeptical about the Terracotta/Kamaitachi, but that combo was so good. It kept Asami constantly on full health with free push AND a card draw.

 

 

Something I did notice is that my Yokai never survived 2 turns. I summoned them and they usually died thesame turn as I threw them onto my enemy and burned at least 1 Flicker. End of turn I lost the second Flicker which then sacrificed it. Free scheme marker though

My MVP upgrade was either A Taste For Flesh on Bettari or The Fate Of Mortals on Asami. I drew 3 cards from AFOM, which thinned the bad ones from my deck. Bettari survived and went crazy thanks to ATFF.

My worst upgrade was Grasping Strands because I only managed to use the charge portion once and never the Reaching Tendrils thing. At least I was able to swap between upgrades a bit.

 

My takeaway from my last game: more soulstones. Getting 7 might not even be overkill on her.

[newsun]

On 3/18/2017 at 6:07 AM, whodares said:

My worst upgrade was Grasping Strands because I only managed to use the charge portion once and never the Reaching Tendrils thing. At least I was able to swap between upgrades a bit.

 

My takeaway from my last game: more soulstones. Getting 7 might not even be overkill on her.

The charge debuff is the reason for that upgrade and it has saved so many models, that is one upgrade I'd be hard not to take. Don't think I've pulled off the reaching part.

I think 7 stones is crucial for her or any summoner.