Friends or Enemies, what happen?

[TeddyBear]

Hi all!

When an action of a model are controlled by an opponent what changes if model is seen like friend or foe? (when not specified)

For example: with obey, models that this model treat like friend don't change: but i think with an obey action i can force one model to attack one of his friends models right?

So what change?

Thanks

 

 

[solkan]

39 minutes ago, TeddyBear said:

Thank you Ludvig!

Then ultimately the fact of considering one model an enemy or friend (or specify it on the first manual rules) is useful when an action say "friends or foe" models on the character card?

(For example (1) ....... "heal friendly model of 1/2/4")

with an obey i can't heal one of my models, instead if i use bleeding tongue upgrade of sybelle i can use this action on her.

this can be right?

From the Rules Manual, page 23:

Quote

Friendly and Enemy

Some rules reference friendly or enemy models. From a mechanical standpoint, friendly models are any models that are on the same Crew as the model the rule is affecting. Enemy models are any model that isn’t on the same Crew.

If a rule does not specifically state that it only affects friendly or enemy models (for instance legal targets for an Attack) then it can and does affect any model.

When a model’s Actions are controlled by the opponent (for instance with the Obey Action) the model does not change which models are considered friendly, its friends are still its friends.

Note the first paragraph.  That's how "friend" and "enemy" are defined.

So if a model has an action that says "heal friendly model", that action only heals models on the same crew, as specified by the second paragraph.

There are a very few number of actions or abilities that specifically override this.  For example, Hungering Darkness has this action:

Quote

1) Heed My Voice (Ca 7 / Rst: Wp / Rg: 8): This Action gains against targets with the Brilliance Characteristic. Target enemy non-Leader model immediately performs a (1) Action chosen and controlled by this model’s controller. The target considers this model friendly for the duration of the Action.

The part in red is overruling "Friendly and Enemy" specifically concerning Hungering Darkness and the target model.

So Hungering Darkness could use Heed My Voice to cause an enemy model to use an action that specified "Target friendly model heals 2 wounds" because Heed My Voice makes the model consider Hungering Darkness friendly temporarily.

 

[Ludvig]

Nothing changes most of the time. You are always allowed to charge and attack friendly models. 

If you obey a model you are engaged with it cannot shoot since your model is still engaging it. The same thing if it could charge. It will not be engaged with it's friends so it can obey it to ahoot if it is close to models from it's own crew.

[Adran]

Yes.

Very few actions change what models view as friendly and enemy.

But a lot of the time the rules don't matter if a model is friendly or enemy.  A friendly model doesn't engage you, and some abilities can only target friendly or enemy. Thats about it. 

The 2 I can think that make some changes are obey type effects on a model with terrifying (Sybelle and Hungering Darkness), which make the model which cause the attack also friendly to the target, so they can't easily paralyse the model by making it attack them and fail the duel. 

[TeddyBear]

Thank you Ludvig!

Then ultimately the fact of considering one model an enemy or friend (or specify it on the first manual rules) is useful when an action say "friends or foe" models on the character card?

(For example (1) ....... "heal friendly model of 1/2/4")

with an obey i can't heal one of my models, instead if i use bleeding tongue upgrade of sybelle i can use this action on her.

this can be right?

[Four_N_Six]

That's basically why it specifies in certain situations.  I'm not sure on the exact way it works, but when an obey (Hungering Darkness' Heed my Voice, for example) specifies that the target treats the acting model as friendly, I don't think it's the entire crew, just the acting model.  So in that situation, HG could obey a model with a "Heal friendly" type of heal, to target himself, but not Jacob Lynch.