SurreyLee Posted October 22, 2015 Report Share Posted October 22, 2015 Okay, Silurids are great at what they do....what do you think is the best "counter" to them within faction. How do you effectively try to stop them to deny opponent VP? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adran Posted October 22, 2015 Report Share Posted October 22, 2015 Lileth is probably their best counter, bringing them back into the fray where many things can target them. But focusing on them with hard hitters can work really well. Most people expect their scheme runners to be left alone, or only face other scheme runners. If your opponent just seems to be using them to drop schemes, your silurid can do a decent amount of damage to them. Things like hooded rider, Teddy and nekima can all have a large enough threat range to hunt them down fairly quickly on most boards. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Insidiously Mad Posted October 22, 2015 Report Share Posted October 22, 2015 Don't forget that Lilith can't target them unless she has Line of Sight due to their Silent ability. Which is why I love using Gupps/Swampfiends against Lilith on boards with a fair amount of blocking terrain. Nekima/Hooded Rider are amazing scheme runner hunters though. Coppelius is also a solid scheme runner hunter who can then do his own scheme running later once he has powered up with eyeball from attacking scheme runners 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SurreyLee Posted October 22, 2015 Author Report Share Posted October 22, 2015 Don't forget that Lilith can't target them unless she has Line of Sight due to their Silent ability. Which is why I love using Gupps/Swampfiends against Lilith on boards with a fair amount of blocking terrain. Nekima/Hooded Rider are amazing scheme runner hunters though. Coppelius is also a solid scheme runner hunter who can then do his own scheme running later once he has powered up with eyeball from attacking scheme runnersIt's partly your game against me i've asked this question....8)Coppelius is a solid choice actually. I like him a lot. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Insidiously Mad Posted October 22, 2015 Report Share Posted October 22, 2015 I used to use Coppelius a ton when I was new to the game. I don't use him very often any more (think the last time I used him in a tournament was our reckoning game at Wayland) but he's still a solid choice. Hooded Rider is in a lot of my stake a claim lists (though in our game I took Nekima instead) just for his crazy mobility to hunt down scheme runners Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hungering Derpness Posted October 22, 2015 Report Share Posted October 22, 2015 If you gave Coppelus the "Wings of Darkness" upgrade, it'd make him very effective at Scheme Runner hunting. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rathnard Posted October 22, 2015 Report Share Posted October 22, 2015 Baby Kade also has Lure (which most people seem to forget ),Bunraku can draw in models trying to sneak around the flank,Tuco and Angel Eyes can take shots at scheme runners,...and Primordial Magic could just make it insignificant. Aside from what's already been mentioned, those are the ones that come to mind. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bodiless Posted October 22, 2015 Report Share Posted October 22, 2015 I would second Nekima as a scheme hunter, particularly for tricky models with leap. Flight and melee expert means she can chase them down, and her combination of high min damage and the ability to splash black blood means she has a decent chance at taking a silurid down in a single activation. I wouldn't rely on shooting too much unless you know you can out activate, since that built in negative often means your odds of hitting are pretty low. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ludvig Posted October 22, 2015 Report Share Posted October 22, 2015 I would second Nekima as a scheme hunter, particularly for tricky models with leap. Flight and melee expert means she can chase them down, and her combination of high min damage and the ability to splash black blood means she has a decent chance at taking a silurid down in a single activation. I wouldn't rely on shooting too much unless you know you can out activate, since that built in negative often means your odds of hitting are pretty low.Depends on what you mean by shooting. Lucius can hire a rifleman who I'm pretty sure can reach severe damage 7 with focus, a friendly activated guardsman + a cheated ram. Focus cancels the from perfect camouflage so it is often not a problem since you are relying on cheating that high ram in your hand anyways. With the commands and stuff you can also reach hard to get places or move so you're not shooting into cover. Then again I'm not really a fan of riflemen anyways so I rarely bring them. Just consider that the upgrade, a rifleman + a babysitting guardsman is still cheaper than Nekima. They also dress a lot more sensibly I guess the guardsmen can't really handle "the crunch" quite the way Nekima does... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hungering Derpness Posted October 22, 2015 Report Share Posted October 22, 2015 I like the idea of Hooded Rider as a scheme hunter. Doesn't it also have some kind of 0 action or trigger to clear scheme markers, or is my memory fuzzy? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ludvig Posted October 22, 2015 Report Share Posted October 22, 2015 I like the idea of Hooded Rider as a scheme hunter. Doesn't it also have some kind of 0 action or trigger to clear scheme markers, or is my memory fuzzy? Think it's a trigger on the attack. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeregrineFalcon Posted October 22, 2015 Report Share Posted October 22, 2015 Trapper, obvious answer. It has a built in + flip and anyone can take it. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ludvig Posted October 22, 2015 Report Share Posted October 22, 2015 (edited) Disregard this post. I thought silurids were 7 wds but they are only 6. A trapper is even better than I thought for removing them. Edited October 22, 2015 by Ludvig 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeregrineFalcon Posted October 22, 2015 Report Share Posted October 22, 2015 Disregard this post. I thought silurids were 7 wds but they are only 6. A trapper is even better than I thought for removing them.Yes, yes it is. If it can gain focus out of activation somehow I'm pretty sure that Silurid is dead dead dead goooooo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ludvig Posted October 22, 2015 Report Share Posted October 22, 2015 Disregard this post. I thought silurids were 7 wds but they are only 6. A trapper is even better than I thought for removing them.Yes, yes it is. If it can gain focus out of activation somehow I'm pretty sure that Silurid is dead dead dead goooooo.Lucius... You want him... You know you do Even when focusing for his own AP the trapper can just cheat in a ram to crit and oneshot it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Insidiously Mad Posted October 22, 2015 Report Share Posted October 22, 2015 No offence, but if the neverborn player is dumb enough to have a silurid in LOS of a trapper or rifleman they probably weren't going to win the game anyway. In my game vs Lee I think one of my silurids was in LOS once and the other one had already dropped two claims markers before he got a good angle on it. Obviously it's board dependent to an extent, but on any decent board you should be able to jump between blocking pieces of terrain easily with 17" of movement. In my experience you need to get close to them to have a chance at killing them, which is why Hooded Rider or Nekima is so good at it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeregrineFalcon Posted October 22, 2015 Report Share Posted October 22, 2015 Disregard this post. I thought silurids were 7 wds but they are only 6. A trapper is even better than I thought for removing them.Yes, yes it is. If it can gain focus out of activation somehow I'm pretty sure that Silurid is dead dead dead goooooo.Lucius... You want him... You know you do Even when focusing for his own AP the trapper can just cheat in a ram to crit and oneshot it.Collodi does that better though. Dmg max higher with Lucius but chance of hit higher with Collodi. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ludvig Posted October 23, 2015 Report Share Posted October 23, 2015 No offence, but if the neverborn player is dumb enough to have a silurid in LOS of a trapper or rifleman they probably weren't going to win the game anyway. In my game vs Lee I think one of my silurids was in LOS once and the other one had already dropped two claims markers before he got a good angle on it. Obviously it's board dependent to an extent, but on any decent board you should be able to jump between blocking pieces of terrain easily with 17" of movement. In my experience you need to get close to them to have a chance at killing them, which is why Hooded Rider or Nekima is so good at itVery good point. That's where the obey-like actions from Lucius or Collodi could come in handy to move your shooter into a better position.On some boards shooting just isn't an option but on most boards you should be able to find an angle around that terrain. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thana. Posted October 23, 2015 Report Share Posted October 23, 2015 Nekima is probably the best general purpose siluid killer. With activation control chompy is very good at killing them as well thanks to his enormous threat range and weak damage 3. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cursingbulldog Posted October 23, 2015 Report Share Posted October 23, 2015 I would think Silurids would be pretty good at countering other silurids, cheaper then nekima and hooded rider certainly. You can keep up with the speed obviously. If they leap walk and drop a marker you can leap and charge going for rams to chain attacks, and if they double walk you can reengage them so they have to repeat next turn. Most of the time I'll bring 2 gupps instead of a silurid if I'm going for heavy marker schemes for the bonus activations. Silurids usually come out if I'm only planning on 1 marker scheme and am planning on trying to deny my opponents marker schemes charging in to take out their runners then going for my points. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nical Posted October 26, 2015 Report Share Posted October 26, 2015 Simply, We can use Models with Wp Attack and/or Fast Flight Models as faction models. And Tuco / Hooded Rider may be useful in this case. But I think our best solution is Trapper, too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Insidiously Mad Posted October 26, 2015 Report Share Posted October 26, 2015 Don't see my silurids going down to trapper very often BUT no model has more of an effect on where they can go, which is often enough to somewhat neutralize them. Bloody trappers.. (looks uneasily at Vonschill Box..) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SurreyLee Posted October 26, 2015 Author Report Share Posted October 26, 2015 I will say that Conor played the Silurids exactly as advised above. A trapper almost certainly wouldn't have done anything in our game. Trappers, I can see would, given the right board, do well. Personally, i'd think that a bigger hitter like Nekima would do nicely. Mature Nephilim could also, with it's charge through action, get some nice results too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thana. Posted October 27, 2015 Report Share Posted October 27, 2015 Mature might be ok if you can work the angles. The reason Nekima is so good is because she can kill a silurid in one activation from thirteen inches away without needing Los. A mature can kill a silurid from 10 inches away under normal circumstances and needs Los. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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