Reckoning master

[rvdbarnes]

So, Reckoning isn't one of my favourite strategies.

 

Who is your go to master for Reckoning? And why?

[Eclipse]

Lynch, Lilith and Pandora are all great for Reckoning.
Lynch has a very killy thematic crew, and with the support of Brilliance they can all deal great amounts of damage. They are durable and have a different ways to heal themselves (apart from Lynch himself).
Lilith is a natural-born killer and the greatsword she wields is even more so (killer, I mean). She can control the flow of battle and the very battlefield itself, while potentially growing her list to be more powerful. She does not need grow lists to work well, though
Pandora is vicious, suprisingly so. She needs more support as most of her crew work to enhance her power and Wp attacks. With careful placement however you can make a dangerous bubble of death.
For the other masters, it somewhat depends on what they bring. Collodi for example does not look like a great damage dealer, but this can be deceptive. In addition, he can steal the enemy models AP, which is horrendous in Reckoning (as there are often fewer, more powerful models in the team).
Lucius can do anything fairly well, given that he takes the right crew. To have a killy and balanced crew take some Rifleman and Dashel or Pathfinders with him as ranged units. Then fill the rest of the crew with summoning and utility models, Illuminated are great here as well (especially if backed by a Beckoner as well).
Zoraida seems scheme oriented, but I believe she would be able to hamper the enemy team, one Hemmed enemy model at a time. In addition to the usual strong melee Neverborn models she can also hire a number of Wp4 models as mercenaries.
The Dreamer can work for Reckoning if you go the Lord Chompy route. Alternatively, I guess you could try to exhaust the opponent by summoning your own powerful models while chipping off the strength of his?
Overall, Neverborn can be pretty great at Reckoning, it just depends kinda lot on what you have available and your preferred playstyle.

[Clockwork Top Hat]

Reckoning is a great Neverborn scheme as every master can bring a crew to the table capable of dealing with the scheme. Liith, Pandora and Chompy Bit's dreamer all get a special mention. Lilith can either be great for isolating and taking down enemies with her broadsword and tangle shadows or she can control the board helping shut down the opponent's crew through transfixing gaze, wicked vines and strategic terrain placement. Pandora's loathing/self harm can take advantage of the fact your opponent's probably going to be bringing models with decent attacks and Misery is free damage without spending ap and is hard to get past - if they fail a wp duel in range of her they take damage and in a Pandora crew this will be happening a lot and Martyr can help deny your opponent kills. Dreamer has lord chompy bits and with  Restless Dreams you can be putting out an awful lot of damage. Collodi, Lucius and Zoraida can manipulate their crews and/or the opponents crew to increase your damage output and weaken the opposing crew's position. if you can move your opponents model out of range they have to waste ap to move them back into range - ap they'r probably prefer to spend hitting you. Also Fated with Collodi will really help out a puppet crew in this scheme. Lynch I can't say much more than what has already been said but once again he can deal with the scheme effectively. Also Wrath can lead the crossroads 7 which have plenty of debuffs to make the opponent's day miserable. Especially if you think you might be up against a melee heavy list. He also has an advantage that he's still new - people are not used to seeing him and playing against him.

 

Non master wise these models all lend themselves to the scheme:

Angel Eyes & Tuco (ranged damage is something Neverborn as a whole lack and can help pick off or weaken models that you want dead), Bad Juju (he can soak up a lot of damage, deal a fair bit and punishes your opponent for trying to complete the scheme and killing your swampfiends. He can also slow and paralyze models to reduce the damage they can put out) Kade (you will probably loose him but the important thing is how many VP he can score you before he goes down) Teddy and Beckoners (either to draw models into position for your damage doing models or to pull weakened friendly models out of danger)

[Ludvig]

 

Lucius can do anything fairly well, given that he takes the right crew. To have a killy and balanced crew take some Rifleman and Dashel or Pathfinders with him as ranged units.

Wow! If you feel Lucius heavily invested in riflemen is an good master for someone having trouble with reckoning you need to give me a few tips!

In my experience riflemen and pathfinders aren't exactly what you would call sturdy models and you usually find yourself giving up way to many points and not scoring enough yourself. There is an awful lot of models in this game that can one-shot a rifleman. Illuminated and Geists are a different story.

The few reckoning games I have played as Neverborn I have had some success with Zoraida but I have a very limited model pool in the faction (Lucius and Zoraida are my only masters).

The posters above have some great tips. I have been utterly destroyed by both Pandora and Lilith and Nvb as a whole have some very nice combos of killy and survivable in one model.

In my eyes reckoning is one of the strategies where it's hardest to score a lot of points so you need to think a lot more about denial while eeking out a couple of points by killing off models you have worked on weakening the turn before. Denying enemy scheme points and making sure you get full for your own also becomes super important. It can be a good strategy to up your game and evolve. Think about who your enemy is trying to kill and set it up so you kill it yourself/save it after they poured a ton of AP into it. You can also work on scheme denial.

Specifically at rvdbarnes: Can you be more specific with what it is about reckoning you don't like? Who/what is you favourite master/models/theme to play generally?

Edited October 6, 2015 by Ludvig
weird grammar

[D_acolyte]

When I see people play reckoning they tend to go with small elite hard hitting forces (I feel that is a mistake on there part) which makes me grab Pandora and sometimes Candy as they can hit as hard as they do.

Otherwise I like Lilith because of being able to mess with movement and separate out one or two models to make them not useful or dead, once kept a rail golem not moving for 4 turns.

Lynch is not bad at it as he can deal a good amount with various upgrades and Hungry does not die. Depending on your opponent Collodi is nice with all his AP manipulations, slowing or stealing the first AP of a model can really mess up a persons plan.

I also can not stress this enough, most reckoning games I have seen from the beginning of 2nd ed have low strategy points and high scheme point in there spreads. Pick schemes that do not need you to stay alive at the end and try trading blow for blow through the game, or even better through the first punch.  I almost always take a mature with Retribution's Eye, people have mocked me for it till they are hit and Howard is dead.

[Eclipse]

 

Lucius can do anything fairly well, given that he takes the right crew. To have a killy and balanced crew take some Rifleman and Dashel or Pathfinders with him as ranged units.

Wow! If you feel Lucius heavily invested in riflemen is an good master for someone having trouble with reckoning you need to give me a few tips!

In my experience riflemen and pathfinders aren't exactly what you would call sturdy models and you usually find yourself giving up way to many points and not scoring enough yourself. There is an awful lot of models in this game that can one-shot a rifleman. Illuminated and Geists are a different story.

 If you have only Lucius and Zoraida you might find it hard to make a good reckoning crew for Lucius as how well he does really depends on your minion choices. I firmly believe he is only great in Neverborn, where you have heavy melee presence and more worthwhile minions for him. Rifleman are indeed squishy and this is why you need to protect them. Blocking the charge lanes towards them, putting them in (hard if possible) cover always helps a lot. Since the shooting range is 12", it allows melee models to close in and engage your shooters in two walk actions (or sometimes, less). To counter this leave the Riflemen even further back so they can't shoot the other team, but the other team must come into your crosshairs to do stuff (useful cover fire for Turf War, Reckoning, Squatter's Rights, they also hold a quarter for Reconnoiter well). Remember you can keep focus for the next turn, almost always keep focus in stock to be able to punish charges (unless you are sure it will help you kill something important). If you take Riflemen, Dashel is a must, the + flips and (0) focus is unvaluable. Even if he does little else other then stand there, him giving auras are enough for me for the first three turns at least. Keep in mind that he can soulstone for a ram and cheat a high ram to deal 5/5/6 damage when hitting. WIth Nexus of Power he can use a Soulstone to heal 1 Wd when down to 1 to go above his Hard to Kill and Lucuis could also use it sometimes.
 Pathfinders are the real powerhouse models, with advanced deployment they can be used as scheme/strat runners turn 2 onwards. Their triggers are great and the ignore armor/HtW one is applied to the blast as well. They really benefit from focus and having traps around their targets. Laying the Clockwork Traps is very powerful, they can be put to block charge lanes, engage enemy models, sit on top of markers to prevent interaction... they are REALLY good in wasting AP. And annoying the bejeesus out of your opponent. They are rather squishy too (although they have better defense), so you could just hide them behind cover, they when you have 6+tomes have them pop out and set a trap and shoot or go back into hiding.
 To make Lucius powerful you need the ranged units from Guild, to use "What Lackeys Are For" well and to have summoning. Summoning is only available to him in Neverborn and the main reason why I believe he is only great there. Remember that Lucius loves minions? Well, when he runs out of them he is rather useless (as he is accustomed to having them to everything for him  ). To solve this, take summoning. This goes especially well with what he need to fill the crew with after taking the gunmen: Either solid melee or scheme runners, possibly both. Nekima and Terror Tots that grow, Widow Weaver and Wicked Dolls, probably Spawn Mother (for the Gupps) and eventually the Mysterious Emissary (Yay! Finally cheap Changeling, uh, I mean Mimic, minions!). Other strong minions for him to take are Illuminated (who like it when they have a Beckoner around to pull models and spread Brilliance) and Young Nephilim (who you can grow from Terror Tots).
 Given that you only have Zoraida and Lucius crew boxes, I would go for something like: Take Dashel with Riflemen (it sounds like you already have them) who will provide cover fire and possibly take out something big if you have careful, try NOT to get engaged  Take Bad Juju with Eternal Fiend. Take Sulurids for scheme running. Take a Waldgeist or two if you can. Now you have durable units up front and quick scheme runners. When any Swampfiend dies, an annoyingly dangerous beater (Juju) appears. Force a heavy choice, this is the Neverborn way. Doppelganger is an amazing model, and also thematic (mimic). Finally, remember to keep dancing: Practice switching your positions, Lucius loves that  

[rvdbarnes]

 

Specifically at rvdbarnes: Can you be more specific with what it is about reckoning you don't like? Who/what is you favourite master/models/theme to play generally?

some great info so far, thanks all.

I use Pandora, and like to play the central turf war/misery/widow weaver buff zone, with teddy and Kade in there too.

I think it's the thought of not being able to utilise sorrows and really changing my play style that makes this strategy seem so tricky.

that and the fact that I regularly play against the hanged! Who softens the toughest beat stick so easily with a half wounds and no heal attack.

 

[Eclipse]

A friend (who is a natural Neverborn player) plays very well with Sorrows. He forms something like a net, where if any enemy model enters, it will eat tons of Wp duels while being drained of life a few ticks at a time. Something like this:

S            S

       S

As for the hanged: Hang back, stay behind cover so that it can't see you. If it can't see you, it can't halve your wounds with no heal. Thus it will have to expose itself. This is the moment when you use (preferably Ca) attacks on it and hopefully obliterate it before the next turn begins. Take Doppelganger to cheat initiative if necessary, make the first hits in later rounds.

[Ludvig]

Thanks for the tips Eclipse. I have most of the guild faction and some odds and ends in neverborn but haven't had time to build and paint much of my neverborn.

If I was going for reckoning I might just use an austringer instead of a rifleman. Even with 14" range most crews have things that can engage you from really far away. When I field my own riflemen they often have trouble with freikorps trappers or katanaka snipers, austringers can hide from those and still shoot. Another problem is that most schemes require you to leave your deployment zone and as soon as you do that the enemy beatsticks can hide in engagement with something.

I'm not sure how summoning changelings will help me give up less kills to my opponent? Please elaborate.

@Barnes: I think there were some pandora specific tips above you could try out. You might also try models with fewer wounds but higher stats perhaps Vasilisa/Widow Weaver? I haven't fought hanged spam with Nvb but hanged are tough. I usually try to block LoS to the best targets. If you feel like an all or nothing approach you could use stitched together against hanged, that should have your opponent sweating. 

Edited October 7, 2015 by Ludvig

[Eclipse]

Thanks for the tips Eclipse.

You know where the like button is

If I was going for reckoning I might just use an austringer instead of a rifleman. ...

I'm not sure how summoning changelings will help me give up less kills to my opponent? Please elaborate.

 Remember that Austringers can not be targeted by Issue Command - which is the way you should be giving orders in Neverborn. Normally I would try to limit Lucius to issuing orders to the gunline, then swap him with something upfield to give the 'Elite Training' aura or hit something with Red Tape and keep issuing orders to the shooters behind him. The reasoning here is that eating those Horror duels is a pain, and I really don't like bringing Lawyers just for that. For Austringers I imagine you would give them orders less often and leave them more independent, pecking from behind cover. I intend to try them out at some point soon-ish, can't really say I am familiar with them. If you find they suit your style better, go for them. Tailor the list to your taste, this is the fun stuff
 Changelings are rather defensive in nature. If you feel you will have trouble keeping them alive into the fray though, just keep them away from heavy-hitters. Have them run errands instead. What I have found is that people often go for elite crews with lower numbers in Reckoning. This is where Lucius is different as he needs his minions, seriously, he does (taking a tank/beater does not hurt, though). What you have to try to do with him is overactivate the enemy, outmaneuver them, suppress them with cover fire while having more bodies to run schemes. Having free models (if situational like Changelings) helps with this. They can also benefit from a small number of benefits as they are mimics, thematic for Lucius. In addition, the game where you kill the schmidt out of Nekima or Killjoy with a Changeling that succeeded to mimic them is going to be a game to remember forever In my head and in theorycraft, at least.

[Philosfr]

In addition, the game where you kill the schmidt out of Nekima or Killjoy with a Changeling that succeeded to mimic them is going to be a game to remember forever In my head and in theorycraft, at least.

One of my changelings murdered The Captain with a red joker mimic'ing his own relic hammer last game. It was glorious and certainly memorable.

[admiralvorkraft]

The Changeling is Joss's natural enemy... gotta love models that circumvent all their own defenses.