Combat Ramos

[Fog]

So, I've been thinking about trying something new with my favorite master. I typically play Ramos as an aggressive support piece, staying upfield to get the most out of my auras and taking shots as needed between summoning and shielding. What if there's another way?

Here's my thought: 

Ramos w/Imbued Protection, Powered by Flame

Essence of Power

Arcane Effigy

 

That gives us def 5, CA 8 Ramos with a pseudo 4/5/6 damage flip.

Has anyone tried anything similar? How has it gone for you? Any other suggestions for how we could turn this up any higher?

[AnythingBut]

Sounds like a fun experiment to try. Not randomising and ignoring armour could be potent with spiders to lower enemy DF. 

Also maybe worth considering trying to get the most out of his melee while you're at it with its severe damage of 7. I'm at work so don't have my cards but does his 2ss upgrade that gives m&su within 8" a +ive to melee include himself? And Johans ability to hand out +Ives to friendly m&su doesn't exclude leader does it? If not he could be swinging (only ml5 but still) on a double positive to try get a straight damage flip to have a better chance of flipping that severe of 7 or even cheating it in if necessary. 

[hippodruid]

A game where I don't try to punch someone with Ramos is a pretty boring game for me.  Given, I do mostly take him for Turf War and Extraction, so that might explain why he ends up where he does.  I usually end up putting him on the front line, although I've never put Imbued Protection on him.  I'd probably take Combat Mechanic instead for the healing potential, and Accomplice is pretty hard to pass up.

Also, good question on Under Pressure.  I don't remember if it's "other friendly constructs" or just "friendly constructs," but that could make this build a lot more interesting.

[Rogue1]

Something to consider may be the mobile toolkit.  The + flip for damage does not specify MI.  Then you can blow it up late game for some pretty funny results.

[Fog]

Even if it was just to melee flips, that would make things potentially very explosive indeed.  

I mean, at this point we're already looking at an absolute monster.  Ca 8, 2/3/4 ignoring armor, non randomizing, burning +2 with positive to the damage flip seems seriously playable.  Def 5 (before his insane trigger), Armor 2 and he heals when a construct dies.  I'd put that up against pretty much anything in the game.  

"I don't need the Union for muscle.  It just saves me the time of geting to you with my walk 4."

[Shadowfane]

Sadly, Under Pressure does specify "other Constructs", so no  for Ramos.

It's still an interesting idea to try, though... Target Saturation by taking Howard and The Rail Golem as well?

[Bengt]

Sounds like a fun experiment to try. Not randomising and ignoring armour could be potent with spiders to lower enemy DF. 

Also maybe worth considering trying to get the most out of his melee while you're at it with its severe damage of 7. I'm at work so don't have my cards but does his 2ss upgrade that gives m&su within 8" a +ive to melee include himself? And Johans ability to hand out +Ives to friendly m&su doesn't exclude leader does it? If not he could be swinging (only ml5 but still) on a double positive to try get a straight damage flip to have a better chance of flipping that severe of 7 or even cheating it in if necessary. 

Johan gets  himself from other M&SU, he doesn't give it out.

[hippodruid]

Drat.  Still might be worth it for Counterspell, anyway, and the to everyone else.

[Shadowfane]

Well, yes, if you're going the small group of killers route, giving  to Howard and the Rail Golem on their MI attacks IS somewhat unpleasant...

Edited September 22, 2015 by Shadowfane

[madaxeman]

Metal Gamin protection for DF6 - no need for the upgrade slot ? 

[Fog]

I was thinking metal gamin, but I wasn't sure if he'd outpace them. I'd probably bring two for redundancy.

Also I know it's corner case but the potential of hitting def 7 with double tomes strikes me as HILARIOUS. 

[Kadeton]

You don't bring at least two Metal Gamin to every game already? What kind of Arcanist are you?

[AnythingBut]

You don't bring at least two Metal Gamin to every game already? What kind of Arcanist are you?

A Marcus main ;)

[Kadeton]

Bah, anything can be a Beast if you put your mind to it.

[admiralvorkraft]

I've been toying with a similar idea, but going for electrical summoning as well. The Captain and Cassandra push Ramos up field, he starts summoning bombs in people's faces and throwing around Electrical Fire, cackling like a madman. By turn two the first Creation has become scrap so we start doing the usual spider trick... I love the idea of the toolkit giving him positives to damage, but I'm envisioning Combat Ramos as a major roadblock more than anything else, I don't want to stick stones into his support network - that's what summoning is for.

 

Besides, I probably want 7 stones in cache for tomes/damage prevention. For three record, my full load out would be Arcane Reservoir, Electrical Summoning, Powered by Flame. Back him up with a small crew of heavy hitters and go to town. That's probably my next Reckoning crew.

[zFiend]

Bah, anything can be a Beast if you put your mind to it.

Metal gamin in a bear suit! 

[hippodruid]

Bah, anything can be a Beast if you put your mind to it.

Metal gamin in a bear suit! 

Bear Gamin.  Bear is totally an element, right?

I guess for this build you could also run Ramos as an anti-caster, too, if you slap Bleeding Edge Tech on him.  He'll be in people's faces, anyway, so how much closer is Magnetism going to get you?

[Fog]

You don't bring at least two Metal Gamin to every game already? What kind of Arcanist are you?

I've nnever hired a metal gamin. I'll summon them but there's rarely room in my lists.

[admiralvorkraft]

I tried running this concept today and it was an unmitigated disaster, largely due to the worst-timed black joker flips I've ever seen and my opponent playing a competent summoning Dreamer.

In retrospect I think I took too elite of a crew; Ramos w/7 stones Arcane Reservoir, Electrical Summoning, and Powered by Flame, Johana w/Imbued Energies, Cassandra w/Practiced Production, Joss w/BET, The Captain w/Imbued Energies and Patron's Blessing. Typically the list works because I trade a couple upgrades for a Toolkit, cut it in half ASAP, and make up my activations in the usual way. Given the strat/schemes I should have dropped the Captain for two Railworkers and a Metal Gamin.

Things that were fun; summoning an electrical creation next to Nekima, blowing it up (2 damage and burning+1 on her), summoning 3 spiders into base contact with her, and hitting her with Electrical fire for Severe - of course he stoned away most of the damage, but it still kept her tied up swinging at Arachnids. Positioning Johana to get all the markers down for the Nythera scheme, full points for FFM, and four cards on the first turn with pushes from the Captain, Practiced Production, and Finish the Job.

Things that were less fun, flipping black joker on my first turn attempt to summon an EC. Flipping black joker on Joss's attempt to kill a newly summoned Lelu. Flipping two weak cards on a positive twist damage flip with Joss's clockwork fist on his reactivation attack. Not top-decking a single 6+ for airburst. Only remembering after the game that I had Energies on the Captain and could have charged Chompy before he activated, while the black joker was out of my deck and the red joker was out of my opponents.

I definitely made some mistakes, I should have burnt stones to keep Joss alive for instance, and my crew building was definitely sub-optimal. But being able to casually deal (converted) 8 damage to a model with Ramos, and get three arachnids out in the same turn, was pretty cool and definitely promising enough to encourage me to run the concept again.

 

[Clockwork Top Hat]

I like this idea - might have to do some proxying and try it out.

[Fog]

That's exactly my thought. Sure you still get all the spiders but suddenly you're a cannon too.

 

i might try this during some games this week

[admiralvorkraft]

I definitely might try putting Powered By Flame on Joss instead of BET, and giving Ramos Combat Mechanic or Under Pressure instead. It will take some doing to figure out what his load-out wants to be.

[admiralvorkraft]

After a couple more games I really prefer this style with Ramos over the one-man spider factory. That being said, he really suffers from not being Leveticus - who is the real combat Ramos. But then, who doesn't suffer from being not-Levi?

[Fog]

He's cast 8, 4/5/6, heals himself, has armor 2... Close enough to Leveticus for me. Less mobile, maybe, but spiders> abominations any day

[admiralvorkraft]

Less mobile, has to spend specific ap to summon (like some kind of animal), and getting to ca 8 4/5/6 requires at least 7ss of support models - Essence of Power and the Arcane Effigy, and 2 damage doesn't come into effect until the end of the turn (unless you have Rail Workers). Plus Ramos can't cut himself to gain  to the attack and damage of both his attacks on the charge...