Fetid Strumpet Posted July 7, 2015 Report Share Posted July 7, 2015 I'd suggest you start learning the full use of SS. For instance anytime someone with High damage focuses against you and then attacks a SS user, spend a stone for defense, and watch their face fall because for a stone, you essentially took their focus away, and if they spent an AP to get it you essentially just gave them slow. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zFiend Posted July 7, 2015 Report Share Posted July 7, 2015 I'd suggest you start learning the full use of SS. For instance anytime someone with High damage focuses against you and then attacks a SS user, spend a stone for defense, and watch their face fall because for a stone, you essentially took their focus away, and if they spent an AP to get it you essentially just gave them slow. This. A very solid piece of advice. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D_acolyte Posted July 7, 2015 Report Share Posted July 7, 2015 Been using them for as much as I have ever need to, I am aware of the plus flip to defense causes a negative flip to damage for instance. I just tend to have better things to do with them than that, such as insuring a trigger. I find that cards are often enough to ensure a negative damage flip except vs focused models which only happens sometime. Get one thing wrong about soul stones and people assume you do not know how to use them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D_acolyte Posted July 7, 2015 Report Share Posted July 7, 2015 Now back on to focus with the topic, even if you do not have focus on him as long as you get an even flip you lobotomy is still twice the damage of his normal attack with out any triggers and is at a higher skill. Not a bad trade if you ask me, 1 attack at slightly better to hit for double damage or two attacks if you think you can get a trigger off but at less damage and less skill. I probably do the double unless I had a good ram card in my hand and a stone to spend for another ram. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Zinc Lich Posted July 7, 2015 Report Share Posted July 7, 2015 I think that people are over valuing Lobotomy. It's really similar to the instant kill abilities present in the game: when it works, it will be a huge tempo swing in your favor, but for it to work, you either need to force the opponent into a very specific situation, or catch them unawares. While getting 10 damage in one swing against Sommer is *awesome*, the chances of it happening are not very good. The thing of bigger interest, to me at least, is that he has a threat range of 14 inches on the charge, with built in terrain mitigation and a pre-charge move that renders a lot of the ways people usually prevent charges ineffectual. Before you commit him to something, he provides increased movement to your crew with On Doctor's Orders and a 7 inch threat of lobotomize. I get the sneaking suspicion that, once he comes out, people are going to be winning more games with his Skull Saw than Lobotomize. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D_acolyte Posted July 7, 2015 Report Share Posted July 7, 2015 Probably, it like I can not tell you the last time Barbaros used Bull Rush over Macuahuitl (spelling form memory hopefully it is right), but also that is a one 4/5/6 vs two 2/3/4 at the same skill. It will probably come down to your hand and if you need to charge for some reason, such as charge and then move away after the thing is dead. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D_acolyte Posted July 7, 2015 Report Share Posted July 7, 2015 Or it will control there where they move and target priority which is just as big. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
decker_cky Posted July 7, 2015 Report Share Posted July 7, 2015 A key thing with lobotomy is that it's higher melee, meaning you can force it through with a single high card (and are less likely to need to cheat that card). That will be enough to set up a guaranteed kill against a lot of targets. It's a lot tougher and more card intensive to get two separate hits with the bone saw. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ludvig Posted July 7, 2015 Report Share Posted July 7, 2015 If you are walking up and using lobotomy with a minus for the (extremely likely) min dmg 4 you could have taken basically any guild henchman or the peacekepper which would do more damage by charging the same target and hitting twice with min 3 or 4 resultibg in 6-8 dmg. That is why people are making a big deal of wether you can focus it or not. As the Lich said above the big deal is most likely going to be his threat range and ability to shuffle about before charging. He eill make a great schemer and can probably beat the living crap out of the enemy schemers so also denying enemy marker schemes. Only time will tell if the cost ia worth it and I'm betting there will not be a concensus Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D_acolyte Posted July 8, 2015 Report Share Posted July 8, 2015 I figured out how to focus him and I am not telling for his big attack. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rathnard Posted July 8, 2015 Report Share Posted July 8, 2015 I figured out how to focus him and I am not telling for his big attack. Oh come on now. That's not very sporting... As far as I can see, the only ways Guild have for letting Grimwell Focus & Lobotomise are to Obey him with Perdita*, or Take a Student of Conflict to give him Fast with Assist. Having Papa Loco activate next to him before Grimwell does (either in the current turn or previous) will also have the desired effect. There are plenty of other ways to do it outside of Guild, and that fact might alone might make him well worth the +1SS Merc tax. Other than that, I think Decker_cky has the right idea with Lobotomy. It's a situational attack, which is going to see use when Grimwell either needs the higher Ml, just needs to finish off a 4 wd model or is looking at taking on something with armour. Finding a way to give him a positive on damage flips would certainly be handy, but Lobotomy (and Dr Grimwell himself) is not useless without it. * EDIT: You could also Obey Grimwell with a Malifaux Child in a Perdita crew, but you'll need to flip or cheat a 10 to cast it. Assuming you Focus with the child, from my dodgy math there's about a 28% chance of flipping the required card. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LunarSol Posted July 8, 2015 Report Share Posted July 8, 2015 He's probably a little expensive for what he does unfortunately. I'd be a lot more excited if his TA was a 0 or if he was a couple of SS cheaper. Hard to give a final say without knowing his upgrade, but it really needs to be 1 or 0 SS to make him stand out in the crowded SS range he currently occupies. Nimble is legitimately interesting and definitely enough to be worth giving him a try, but he's not really sporting anything that demands attention either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D_acolyte Posted July 8, 2015 Report Share Posted July 8, 2015 Oh come on now. That's not very sporting... As far as I can see, the only ways Guild have for letting Grimwell Focus & Lobotomise are to Obey him with Perdita*, or Take a Student of Conflict to give him Fast with Assist. Having Papa Loco activate next to him before Grimwell does (either in the current turn or previous) will also have the desired effect. It is no fun if you tell them, I am also think that Abuela Ortega can obey or something equivalent for this. Not sure if it has been mentioned before. If so it is probably on page 1 or something, after all who reads page one of a posting. But I have yet another way that Guild could use, but that probably will not be thought about. Que the organ music, in fact anyone can use it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uktena Posted July 8, 2015 Report Share Posted July 8, 2015 Well it shows how often I use stones for things other than prevention flips or suits. Neverborn player detection alarms!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Math Mathonwy Posted July 8, 2015 Report Share Posted July 8, 2015 It is no fun if you tell them, I am also think that Abuela Ortega can obey or something equivalent for this. Not sure if it has been mentioned before. If so it is probably on page 1 or something, after all who reads page one of a posting. But I have yet another way that Guild could use, but that probably will not be thought about. Que the organ music, in fact anyone can use it.Well, there's Ama No Zako but I'm very disappointed if that's what you were thinking of Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zFiend Posted July 8, 2015 Report Share Posted July 8, 2015 Well, there's Ama No Zako but I'm very disappointed if that's what you were thinking of Hahahaha yeah. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D_acolyte Posted July 8, 2015 Report Share Posted July 8, 2015 Well, there's Ama No Zako but I'm very disappointed if that's what you were thinking of Not her at all, this is a more sure fire way then Obey to get focus but does involve a mersonary model. I even gave a really spasific hint on which model it is. Neverborn player detection alarms!! Yes I play Neverborn and Arcanists and Ten Thunders and soon some Resers, it is the curse of malifuax when you play for a long time you tend to get into atleast 1 other faction. I also the cool model syndrom and can if you wish provide a clinical deffinition lol. My focus has been Neverborn and Arcanists rescently, though the Nightmare Tara Box I have is begging for attention. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zFiend Posted July 8, 2015 Report Share Posted July 8, 2015 Did envy give out focus? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D_acolyte Posted July 8, 2015 Report Share Posted July 8, 2015 Did envy give out focus? Yes as a zero tacticle action that needs you to discard a card called Sinister Organ Music, this is all based on the card from the end of the beta. He would be 9 ss in guild and have 2 decent attacks, can hand out focus, armor and gain a tome vs models he shoot with in 3 of a scheme marker. I think that is a deal if you just want a model which can hand out focus. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zFiend Posted July 8, 2015 Report Share Posted July 8, 2015 Yes as a zero tacticle action that needs you to discard a card called Sinister Organ Music, this is all based on the card from the end of the beta. He would be 9 ss in guild and have 2 decent attacks, can hand out focus, armor and gain a tome vs models he shoot with in 3 of a scheme marker. I think that is a deal if you just want a model which can hand out focus. I think I'd still hire Abuela over Envy and give out the focus on her (0) action. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D_acolyte Posted July 8, 2015 Report Share Posted July 8, 2015 Both are good choices for the job. It is only limited by the other stuff you want the model to do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonahmaul Posted July 8, 2015 Report Share Posted July 8, 2015 Taking him in Outcast with somebody rocking I Pay Better would work well but not sure he'd be worth 10SS considering how many good beater options Outcast already have. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zFiend Posted July 8, 2015 Report Share Posted July 8, 2015 I'm going to try Grimwell with I pay Better on a Tara list with fast. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonahmaul Posted July 8, 2015 Report Share Posted July 8, 2015 Nice idea but when you can just put Bishop in there or the NB for the same cost I don't think it's worth it. Would be very scary mind! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zFiend Posted July 8, 2015 Report Share Posted July 8, 2015 Nice idea but when you can just put Bishop in there or the NB for the same cost I don't think it's worth it. Would be very scary mind! Well they're not a deranged doctor with a skullsaw are they? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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