Justiiiiin, what are the new Tara themed upgrades?!

[DeleteAccount]

OK, reread the upgrade, if there isn't anything to unbury Karina's horrors or if something doesn't waste AP killing it, you can't summon anymore. It also makes using Killjoy clunky...

[Loveless]

So their solution to fix Karina is to give her another corner-case ability that's only useful if you've taken specific upgrades on Tara?

 

Or is it going to work like other Void burying - wherein you kill something in-play and the Void pocket rips open?

 

If that's the case - it could be incredibly annoying to face, especially when coupled with Void Shield.

[hypoking]

Could we get more precise wording, or at least as precise as forum decorum allows?

[DeleteAccount]

So their solution to fix Karina is to give her another corner-case ability that's only useful if you've taken specific upgrades on Tara?

 

Or is it going to work like other Void burying - wherein you kill something in-play and the Void pocket rips open?

 

If that's the case - it could be incredibly annoying to face, especially when coupled with Void Shield.

From what I've been told for now, no unburying, but may be beta version memory.

[DeleteAccount]

Could we get more precise wording, or at least as precise as forum decorum allows?

I'd LOVE to have the exact wording, but I'm pretty much working on the "badgering system".

[Ratty]

What I'm hearing hear is a lot of crying over nothing.

 

Karina means you don't have to take Dead of Winter to Tara get Signature models in Rezers.  And on top of it also allows Outcasts to have Guild Autopsies.. Then on top of it she can bring out a Punk Zombie directly next to someone for a 12 of Crows, a single round of flurrying Punk Zombie can easily pull back her 5ss cost. And then with the right upgrade you can bring that Punk Zombie back into play and do it again.. Even in the worst case a round of Punk Zombie in the face is going to make a huge difference. 

[Loveless]

What I'm hearing hear is a lot of crying over nothing.

 

Karina means you don't have to take Dead of Winter to Tara get Signature models in Rezers.  And on top of it also allows Outcasts to have Guild Autopsies.. Then on top of it she can bring out a Punk Zombie directly next to someone for a 12 of Crows, a single round of flurrying Punk Zombie can easily pull back her 5ss cost. And then with the right upgrade you can bring that Punk Zombie back into play and do it again.. Even in the worst case a round of Punk Zombie in the face is going to make a huge difference. 

 

Wait.  Wait wait wait.

 

Do you mean Karina's summoning allows her to summon a model, let the model activate, and then the model gets buried?

 

Because that's very different from what was implied above.

[hypoking]

What I'm hearing hear is a lot of crying over nothing.

 

Karina means you don't have to take Dead of Winter to Tara get Signature models in Rezers.  And on top of it also allows Outcasts to have Guild Autopsies.. Then on top of it she can bring out a Punk Zombie directly next to someone for a 12 of Crows, a single round of flurrying Punk Zombie can easily pull back her 5ss cost. And then with the right upgrade you can bring that Punk Zombie back into play and do it again.. Even in the worst case a round of Punk Zombie in the face is going to make a huge difference. 

Honestly we don't know what the hell we're talking about here. I'm happy to admit that, but until we get some concrete rules text were pretty likely to engage in the usual internet apocalyptic speculation-doom-gloom cycle. If you'd like to give us the details they would be much appreciated.

[Sezar]

Miss...Information!!!

 

Until we get a copy of wave 2 cards, or some picture is leaked (sooner or later that will happen), everything is just pure speculation.

[DeleteAccount]

Wait.  Wait wait wait.

 

Do you mean Karina's summoning allows her to summon a model, let the model activate, and then the model gets buried?

 

Because that's very different from what was implied above.

It's exactly what is implied above. Summoned without slow, but at the end of turn, buried, half wounds and slow.

 

Ratty, what does this mean?

 

Karina means you don't have to take Dead of Winter to Tara get Signature models in Rezers.

 

Haven't read anything that lets her hire void stuff in a resser crew, so unless I'm missing something from what I've read, it doesn't add any new choices to a resser crew that they couldn't hire from the get go, unless you mean the hail mary Death Marshal summon.

[SpiralngCadavr]

Yeah, if Karina summons a model that activates and buries, that sounds very potent.

[Loveless]

It's exactly what is implied above. Summoned without slow, but at the end of turn, buried, half wounds and slow.

 

Well, the sentence structure was weird, then.

 

"Summoned model isn't slow, but is buried, slowed and takes 1/2 wounds at end of turn."

 

To me that read that it was coming in buried, which made no bloody sense.  Made it look like the "end of the turn" action was "slowed and takes 1/2 wounds"

 

Better structure: "Summoned model comes in without penalty, but at the end of the turn takes 1/2 of its total wounds as damage, receives Slow, and is Buried."

 

Yeah, if we can summon in a Horror to do some dirty work, that makes her far more useful.  The burying thing is more of a boon than a harm - you could potentially pop it out again if necessary, or you could clear the storage space by feeding them to Void Wretches.

 

I see no problem here if the upgrade costs nothing more than a slot.

[DeleteAccount]

Well, seemed clear to me that it gets to activate

 

So Karina's upgrade lets her Take Guild autopsies in her crew and she can summon Horror Minions for a (0). Summoned model isn't slow, but is buried, slowed and takes 1/2 wounds at end of turn. Can't be used if there's a buried horror.

 

I mean read it again, whats the point of being summoned without slow only to gain slow again?

 

So yes, you get an full activation, but very high crows are needed and without Tara using Symbiote, it's a once per game deal unless you kill your own summoned model. I mean, I can see the ideal process of Tara preps a bomb, throws it turn 2, Karian summons something turn 2, charges and then turn 3 Tara unburies it and gives it fast, but a lot of things have to go golden for that scenario to pan out, first one being that unless you have at least an 11 of crows, you won't really have anything that interesting to summon.

[DeleteAccount]

Well, the sentence structure was weird, then.

 

"Summoned model isn't slow, but is buried, slowed and takes 1/2 wounds at end of turn."

 

To me that read that it was coming in buried, which made no bloody sense.  Made it look like the "end of the turn" action was "slowed and takes 1/2 wounds"

 

Better structure: "Summoned model comes in without penalty, but at the end of the turn takes 1/2 of its total wounds as damage, receives Slow, and is Buried."

I did a copy paste job, so excuse me for sharing.

[necroon]

Thanks for sharing what you know, Razhem. Looks interesting at the least.

[SpiralngCadavr]

Agreed with Loveless, the sentence structure was confusing- I made the same interpretation as a lot of people, that the model began buried. I don't think anyone's blaming you for the copy-paste, Razhem, just confused by the wording in said copied text.

[Loveless]

I did a copy paste job, so excuse me for sharing.

 

Oh don't take it personally.  I appreciate the sharing and I'm aware it's a copy-paste job.  I was just rewording it so it was more sensible.

The only logical reason prior to clarification for it to not come in slow was so that Tara had a chance to Unbury it in the same turn to make use of it.  It just went from an Order of Operations headache to a minor problem with several crew-based remedies.

[DeleteAccount]

I'll have to try it out, but I just don't feel as positive about it, too few cards in the deck give worthwhile results and while you are waiting for her to actually get the desired crow, she is still a glorified walking peacemaker.

[SpiralngCadavr]

A non-slow summon that's potentially quickly protected by bury (if I'm reading this correctly now) seems pretty potent, but, yeah, expensive (card) summons sounds like a lesser version of Karina's original problem.

 

The more I think about it, the more I think that the NB upgrade is solid, though.

[DeleteAccount]

The nothing beast gets the job done, saves him from a critical turn of just being beaten down when his defense is crap. The rest of the upgrade is a glorified patch, but the discard effect really lets it be counted on for a couple of turns at least.

 

What irritates me about Karina is that it's another cornercase ability on a model full of cornercase abilities. I will admit the payoff of this one being a LOT better than her other abilities. But again, once the muppet is buried, you have a slow missile that NEEDS to be made fast somehow to make it go full bore and disallows you from just burying something else and flinging it into somebody's face with Tara, now you need a Marshal to prep it up for you, meaning another activation.

 

Yes, Karina can burn it to take it off the table, but not on the turn it's buried, and Void wretches can bite it, bu the last thing I consider I should be doing is wasting the activations of my objective grabbers to compensate for another friendly model's ability.

[Ratty]

Critters may say something like may hire Nothing Beast, Void Wretches and Guild Autopsies.

[hypoking]

Believe bury is at end of turn, at which point it takes half its hp. There's a relative degree of protection in being buried, but a weak damage flip between the summon and the disappearance could easily bring it down to htk. That assumes I have the timing right.

 

Hypothetically this could also get crooligans, autopsies, or drowned. Not much of a point to summoning a crooligan that can't interact. Autopsies are solid. Drowned aren't shabby but their primarily tanky attrition pieces, dropping one that will cut itself in half and remove itself for the game for a bit seems counter intuitive. So the money shot here is the punk.

 

According to Rat there's something there that allows hiring wretches and nothing beast in resser. This is certainly nifty and much appreciated. The underlying problem here is that it brings in a new set of tools for Tara to use rather than augmenting the one's she already has and to that point actively prohibits the use of one of Tara's bigger thematic beat sticks. It just seems a bit weird that the solution to tweaking the nightmare edition Tara crew is to tell everybody to buy a blister of autopsies and a box of punk zombies and use those instead.

 

Edit: I like Molly. I have zero problem playing Molly or her toys. I just didn't think her toys were what was being addressed when people were making threads about Karina and Tara.

[Clement]

The students are also horrors remember. They would also be available for summoning here.

[DeleteAccount]

Critters may say something like may hire Nothing Beast, Void Wretches and Guild Autopsies.

OK, thats a lot better, it at least saves me an upgrade if not interested in bringing marshals for whatever reason.

 

Also, I always put students and punks int he same bag since they cost the same and have similar intended roles. Below that, a drowned can be worth summoning, but a drowned is appreciated by how hard it is to remove, not how hard it hits... With autopsies ans crooligans, I have to have a very good reason to summon them, specially with Tara being able to summon autopsies with Spare Parts as a resser master for cheaper and less strings attatched.

[Sezar]

One of the things for me is if Karine does need a Corpse for her summoning or not. If not, that would spice it up quite a bit.

 

That would also lead to another question: where does the summon happen?