What is the status of Through the breach for the backers??

[Forar]

I'm not giving Wyrd a free pass on this - I'm just as affected by the delays as anyone else - however I'm not getting worked up about it either. Wyrd did drop the ball on communication (which would've saved a lot of backer angst), and taking on more than they could handle, however at the end of the day this is a luxury item, and it is being delivered.

As I have said previously there are other companies on Kickstarter that are running just as late, and have been just as uncommunicative (many of which backers of this project have also backed), however it seems that Wyrd has been drawing much more vitriolic criticism than these other companies.

 

A) That's putting it lightly.  I sincerely hope that Wyrd's team takes away a lot of lessons about communicating with backers, in the event they ever run another Kickstarter.  But frankly, I wouldn't dream of backing another of theirs.  The product could be sheer and unmitigated 'win', so to speak, and I'd rather just wait for it to hit retail.  Not only that, I would actively advise anyone I knew that was remotely interested not to back either, not out of some childish 'punitive' action, but because between this and EBO, my group is flat out sour on the idea of them delivering packages in anything remotely resembling the allotted estimate, and while we're generally fans of the quality of the products they produce, my friend's response when he opened up his EBO package to see the "plushie" that had held everything up by months was basically "WHAT IS THIS ____?".

 

B1) Care to name some of these?  Because other projects that ran a year late that I'm aware of (Ogre, Robotech Tactics, Relic Knights, Kingdom Death: Monster: Cliches The Title: Etc) all either get their own share of scorn/mockery, or have continued to communicate with backers in a fashion that seems to keep at least a solid portion of them satisfied progress is being made.  We were under the impression that things were being shipped back in March, and they never corrected that view, and it wasn't until half a year later that actual delivery will come to fruition.

 

B2) And so what?  Just because it is not uncommon for successful projects to be delayed doesn't excuse any particular project for being so very late, and with so very little communication as to why these issues were happening.  If they'd told us *back when the issues were happening* about the MPMs, I imagine people would've cut them a lot more slack.  Evening owning up to "ooops, waited a little too long to get started" would've drawn ire but at least we would've known what was up.  No, instead we were to give them the benefit of the doubt that everything was trucking along, when clearly no, it wasn't.

 

We've been told repeatedly 'omg they don't give dates because then people take them as set in stone', but it wasn't until well after the fact that we even knew WHY the project was held up so dramatically.

 

Hell, even the heads up that the MPM sprues were going to contain nearly 4 times as many minis was held up until literally today.  That's great news!  Why did it take months to get out?

 

Luckily it's all academic now, and I say that very literally; one could write a book regarding communicating with ones backers on this project alone.

[Rathnard]

44 models? Holy hell. And here I was, expecting to get 4 or 8 from the sprues I'm recieving.   

[Omenbringer]

Aside from what has already been said above by Forar (a lot of which I agree with) I am leery of the new Wyrd "Job Posting" for a Role Playing Game developer. I am really hoping this doesn't end up as yet another Wyrd game that languishes in the back ground in favor of some other "new hotness" (like Puppetwars still awaiting any attention after the half assed redux, or EBO which hasn't seen any movement since fulfillment, or Showdown, or King of Artifice).

 

I like Wyrd (I really do they are a great bunch of guys) but it really seems like they need to slow down and reconstitute for the next year or two. To quote Sun Tzu "Concentrate your energy and hoard your strength." Fortify the other "brands" (or at least get them to a complete state), refine what is already available (before adding more issues to the mix, a problem with last edition), create official non-tournament events (a unified experience similar to what Privateer Press has rather than the hap hazard personality driven events that occur currently) and give the Henchman/ event organizers the tools to regrow your communities (like the official prize packs that have been asked for).

[Ratsmitglied]

A) That's putting it lightly.  I sincerely hope that Wyrd's team takes away a lot of lessons about communicating with backers, in the event they ever run another Kickstarter.  But frankly, I wouldn't dream of backing another of theirs.  The product could be sheer and unmitigated 'win', so to speak, and I'd rather just wait for it to hit retail.  Not only that, I would actively advise anyone I knew that was remotely interested not to back either, not out of some childish 'punitive' action, but because between this and EBO, my group is flat out sour on the idea of them delivering packages in anything remotely resembling the allotted estimate, and while we're generally fans of the quality of the products they produce, my friend's response when he opened up his EBO package to see the "plushie" that had held everything up by months was basically "WHAT IS THIS ____?".

And nothing I've said indicates that refusing to back further Wyrd Kickstarter's is an inappropriate response to the delays and lack of communication. I also hope that they take a lot away from this in terms of communication and how to approach Kickstarter's in future.

Yes, I was putting it lightly, putting any harsher terms around it isn't going to change anything - You'll note that I haven't specifically said whether or not I would back a future Wyrd Kickstarter either.

 

B1) Care to name some of these?  Because other projects that ran a year late that I'm aware of (Ogre, Robotech Tactics, Relic Knights, Kingdom Death: Monster: Cliches The Title: Etc) all either get their own share of scorn/mockery, or have continued to communicate with backers in a fashion that seems to keep at least a solid portion of them satisfied progress is being made.  We were under the impression that things were being shipped back in March, and they never corrected that view, and it wasn't until half a year later that actual delivery will come to fruition.

Monster Numbers, Midgard Miniatures, Rivet Wars.

None of these have had exemplary communications - yet nowhere in the comments have backers been advocating violence against the creator as they have in the comments for the Through the Breach Kickstarter.

I can accept mockery and scorn, but actually threatening violence is taking it to a whole new level.

One other thing, I'm not aware of a single CMON Kickstarter that has shipped on time, or if something does ship on time it is less than half the rewards people signed up for, yet they continue to make significantly more than their goals without changing their estimated delivery timeframes? Also, I've noticed that communication does tend to drop off significantly after funding and delays are not communicated very well at all (case in point, Rivet Wars they were telling us in January that they still expected to ship remaining items in Q1, we're now in Q3 and the remaining items are still not shipped, yes the core box was out only 3 months late, but the remaining items are now delayed by at least the same amount as TTB).

 

B2) And so what?  Just because it is not uncommon for successful projects to be delayed doesn't excuse any particular project for being so very late, and with so very little communication as to why these issues were happening.  If they'd told us *back when the issues were happening* about the MPMs, I imagine people would've cut them a lot more slack.  Evening owning up to "ooops, waited a little too long to get started" would've drawn ire but at least we would've known what was up.  No, instead we were to give them the benefit of the doubt that everything was trucking along, when clearly no, it wasn't.

Did I say anywhere that it was? I agree that the delays should've been communicated with us better, but at the same time some backers did get significantly more irritated by the delays than I believe was warranted

 

We've been told repeatedly 'omg they don't give dates because then people take them as set in stone', but it wasn't until well after the fact that we even knew WHY the project was held up so dramatically.

 

Hell, even the heads up that the MPM sprues were going to contain nearly 4 times as many minis was held up until literally today.  That's great news!  Why did it take months to get out?

 

Luckily it's all academic now, and I say that very literally; one could write a book regarding communicating with ones backers on this project alone.

And funnily enough, I agree with you on all of these points, I just express myself differently.

I also agree with the points made by Omenbringer regarding Wyrd needing to focus their efforts a bit more for the next little while.

[i_was_like_you]

Yes, please focus on the flagship product Malifaux and its immediately relevant spinoff Through the Breach. Maybe give Puppet Wars some love, but let the rest go, at least until next year. No more evil babies, no more jetpack unicorns, no more kings of artifice. Just pure, unmitigated Malifaux UNTIL every single model is available in stores. Then you can branch out and stamp your brand on everything you can get your hands on.

If Gencon is your official Malifaux breadwinner, make Adepticon or some other convention your time to roll out the other games. Hell, for a company that's been around since 2005 or so, where the heck is WyrdCon?

And, I say again, don't even think about crowdfunding until at least after Gencon 2015 has come and gone.

[Malsqueek]

Yes, please focus on the flagship product Malifaux and its immediately relevant spinoff Through the Breach. Maybe give Puppet Wars some love, but let the rest go, at least until next year. No more evil babies, no more jetpack unicorns, no more kings of artifice. Just pure, unmitigated Malifaux UNTIL every single model is available in stores. Then you can branch out and stamp your brand on everything you can get your hands on.

If Gencon is your official Malifaux breadwinner, make Adepticon or some other convention your time to roll out the other games. Hell, for a company that's been around since 2005 or so, where the heck is WyrdCon?

 

I'd go to WyrdCon. In a heartbeat.

 

I gotta say, pretty stoked to be within a few days of my box-o-goodies.

[Kadeton]

Looking at my schedule, both Gencon and NOVA are WyrdCon as far as I'm concerned.

[Starweaver]

There's just been a post in the ks comments (as well as 2 updates with pics!) that all the packages have been sent. Good news finally

[Mike3838]

Aside from what has already been said above by Forar (a lot of which I agree with) I am leery of the new Wyrd "Job Posting" for a Role Playing Game developer. I am really hoping this doesn't end up as yet another Wyrd game that languishes in the back ground in favor of some other "new hotness"

 

That isn't for new hotness. There are *six* Through the Breach expansion books in the works, as well as scenario packs/Penny Dreadfuls. Somebody has to write them...

[i_was_like_you]

That isn't for new hotness. There are *six* Through the Breach expansion books in the works, as well as scenario packs/Penny Dreadfuls. Somebody has to write them...

Malsqueak has already written much of the mechanics for Through the Steam...

[Forar]

Monster Numbers, Midgard Miniatures, Rivet Wars.

None of these have had exemplary communications - yet nowhere in the comments have backers been advocating violence against the creator as they have in the comments for the Through the Breach Kickstarter.

I can accept mockery and scorn, but actually threatening violence is taking it to a whole new level.

 

Glad to see we mostly agree on the matters, if perhaps state our views in different fashions.

 

However, regarding the projects you mentioned, note that the projects I brought up were all large, with a thousand or more backers and brought in hundreds of thousands of dollars.  2 of the 3 you list are significantly smaller, so I don't find it at all surprising that their backers might be less... vocal.  The third I was aware of, and yes, 9 months late and of a significant scope/size of backer pool is certainly worthy of some ire.  And a cursory glance in the comments shows they are indeed getting some (likely well deserved) flack.

 

That said, as a frequent member of the TtB comments, I'd say off hand there was ONE person who stated an inclination towards violence, and was swiftly told to stow it by a number of backers, so let's not pretend the TtB comments are some kind of pack of thugs.

[xeth1313]

For me, a big part of what bothers me comes from the dishonesty. Much like a lot of Malifaux v1 and now m2e there is talk about "as written" and "as intended" when it comes to communications from Wyrd. "It's here!" (the proof we mean) "rules aren't even out yet for Hannah" (We are planning a new edition and we mean rulesset not model rules) "Will be in the hand's of backers before the general public" (unlike evil baby orphanage, except not at all because we don't mean ALL backers and Gencon doesn't count as general public) Everything that come out of Wyrd is half promises/truths, and for the most part becomes an argument about legalese. There is no reason for that, and it is just bad PR. Where is the Nekima errata that was a christmas poem? Where is the alt Kaeris sculpt that was the prize for the Dead heat league? It just seems to go on and on.

[Martel]

Did anyone else have to change their address partway through this KS?  I updated mine back in September with Jacqulyn MacHardy but now it looks like she no longer works for Wyrd.  I've seen a few posts from people in my state that have already received their package, so now I'm starting to freak out a little.

[Mako]

If Jacq replied confirming the address had been updated, I wouldn't worry.

[Ratsmitglied]

Glad to see we mostly agree on the matters, if perhaps state our views in different fashions.

 

However, regarding the projects you mentioned, note that the projects I brought up were all large, with a thousand or more backers and brought in hundreds of thousands of dollars.  2 of the 3 you list are significantly smaller, so I don't find it at all surprising that their backers might be less... vocal.  The third I was aware of, and yes, 9 months late and of a significant scope/size of backer pool is certainly worthy of some ire.  And a cursory glance in the comments shows they are indeed getting some (likely well deserved) flack.

 

That said, as a frequent member of the TtB comments, I'd say off hand there was ONE person who stated an inclination towards violence, and was swiftly told to stow it by a number of backers, so let's not pretend the TtB comments are some kind of pack of thugs.

 

I was a casual reader of the TtB comments, so this is one thing that stuck to me, even if it was only the one backer (who from what I saw made these threats on more than one occasion). Mind you, I suppose I have to remember that this is the backer who insisted that nothing had been delivered even after delivery of the PDFs.

 

I was also pointing out that there are ways to express frustration that are appropriate, and ways that they are not - in the case of the three projects I mentioned I think that the expressions of frustration that have occurred have been expressed much more reasonably than some of these expressions in the TtB comments.

[Drabix]

I came home from work to find a nice box from Wyrd.  Both soft cover rule books, Fate Deck, Miss Terious, and Thunder crew box.  That's in Ann Arbor, MI

 

And I moved in May and the package was addressed to me at my new address, not forwarded by the post office.

[Shadowopal]

Drabix: that is in itself a miracle. I still get mail routed through my old address every once in a while. Fortunately, I know the current owners. So, they forward stuff on to me. Even with the new address on the package, for some assinine reason it goes to my old address first. Hope that doesn't happen here. Better call my buddy.

[keeperofgrudges]

Still waiting on mine… hopefully tomorrow. 

[Guest]

I got my box today and I'm in Central Illinois.

 

Everything looks great.

 

Thanks!

[Shadowopal]

Damek66 What tier did you pledge please?

[Lupercal]

Damek66 What tier did you pledge please?

And if you don't mind, what did you get as your "we are sorry it took so long" box?  I am just wondering as everyone I have seen so far seems to have gotten the Thunder box set. 

[Guest]

Core Set.  I got the two books, the card deck, the Miss Terious fig, and the Torch and Blade set.

 

Although, after seeing the customizable figs, I kind of wish I would have gone for a higher level.

[Lupercal]

Thanks much.

[Shadowopal]

Yes...thanks for the info.

[Nick]

I'm a backer from the Netherlands, I pledged the core set and I got the 'The torch and the Blade' set as an excuse, next to the two books and the card deck.