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M2e Kaeris


mythicFOX

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With how much we rely on armor and H2K, especially Metal Gamin and Rail Workers, two of our best cheap workhorses, I actually had this idea for awhile. Let's get a list of every model that can ignore these traits. I'm not well versed in some factions' options, but off the top of my head:

Guild:

Perdita - zero action (but can't ignore cover also)

Hoffman - on a trigger

McMourning - gives it around to anyone

Various Constructs - on triggers I think

Ressers:

McMourning - has piercing himself

Kirai's summon Iky-something

Seamus - doesn't ignore it, but deals so much damage that it's irrelevant

Bete - on a trigger I think?

Shikome - on a built in trigger

Arcanists:

Ramos - gun and magnetize

Joss - ignores everything

Gunsmiths on a trigger

Oxford Mage - on a (usually built in) trigger

December Acolytes - AoE remove armor/h2w

Large Arachnid - on a trigger removes armor for a turn

Metal gamin magnetize

Neverborn:

Black Blood pings and doesn't care about armor

Some upgrade?

I don't know much about Neverborn

Outcasts:

Just don't bother taking armor because everything and their mothers ignore it here.

10T:

I don't know anything about 10T

Gremlins:

Just don't bother taking armor because everyone and their mothers (and inbred cousins, and sisters, and children, and pets) deal so much damage that it becomes largely irrelevant

I know I missed a ton of models and also got lazy at the end but this is just an example of what I'm going for

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Ehh I just don't like the Rail Golem at all to be honest. It's Ml5 makes it prone to "I cheat a 13, you miss" despite the plus flip, and I generally hate anything that requires more than 1 card from your hand to excel. Also the low Df doesn't rub me the right way. But that's really just me, it has a lot of good things about it too and others have used it well. If bothered enough I can see myself convinced to give it a shot sometime.

I was thinking that originally i generally hope the opponent uses their high cards against my regular attacks then i can force through locomotion attacks with weak 5 damage 3 locomotion attacks tends to be fairly easy knowing im going to need those low-mid tomes turn 2-3. Plus it excells at killing stuff with def5 kill teddy not lilith ;-)

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Could some experienced players post a 50 ss list? I'd really like to see what experienced Kaeris players take. Roll up some schemes and strat if it would help focus things. My list process goes something like:

Kaeris, G&D, Blinding Flame

Malifaux Child

Mech Rider

Johan, Energies

Firestarter, Energies

Gunsmith

... oops. I have barely any ss left. Only 10.

I am of the opinion that you pretty much always want Firestarter with her, and Johan is in my opinion the best model in the game (again, imo) so I always want him. Mech is supposed to do her thing, and any summons are supposed to get healing from Bleeding Edge Tech that I want to put on Kaeris. But then I look back and the majority of my list doesn't even benefit from BETech, and etc etc etc.

Am I just trying to do too much at once? Because in a perfect world I'd also want a rail worker or two and a performer to blow up markers.

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Kaeris - purifying flame, arcane resevoir, seize the day.

Malifaux child.

Rail golem.

2xgunsmiths

2xfire gamin

Metal gamin

Willie.

Most of the crew can operate at range and in close. Purifying flame and malifaux child assist healing.

You can trade out the rail golem for a cerberus or joss to give different options to either then swap willie for johan and give the cerberus imbued energies or just joss i always like imbued energies on whatever is going to be my main melee threat although the rail golem doesnt really need it.

Metal gamin is there to complete protect territory as it seems to come up more than 25% of the time for me.

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I used it today in a Reconnoitre game, and managed to conjure up a couple of extra Fire Gamin using it, which the theory was would help to spawn some more models - worked out OK and I conjured 2 Gamin up, however I'm not convinced Kaeris will do enough actual "killing" (vs burning) to justify it anyway, and the benefit of the Pyre marker seems marginal. In any case the 2-wound Gamin would be something of a liability in any scheme pool where killing models counts for VPs. 

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... any summons are supposed to get healing from Bleeding Edge Tech that I want to put on Kaeris. 

 

Johan is MS&U, so a more than decent host for BET... but are the Gamin worth healing in this list anyway? If the scheme pool doesnt mind them dying, a Fire Gamin shot and a immolation next to an enemy is not the end of the world

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I don't like born of fire because:

1.) As mentioned, Kaeris isn't really that killy herself. Immolate is nice, but is still only severe 5; 

2.) By it's nature, born of fire requires overkill (eg, you waste at least the burning on the target when you kill it) - something #1 makes harder; and

3.) A 2 wound slow fire gamin is often more of a liability than it is an asset.

 

Kaeris is great at spreading burning, and can focus and kill a target when she needs with immolate, but she's not great at it. You always take a limited upgrade with kaeris, and the next question become "is born of fire helping me with more than arcane reservoir, seize the day or imbued energies?". IMO, born of fire rarely passes that threshold. 

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Johan is MS&U, so a more than decent host for BET... but are the Gamin worth healing in this list anyway? If the scheme pool doesnt mind them dying, a Fire Gamin shot and a immolation next to an enemy is not the end of the world

Well I've given up on the original idea (unless one day purifying flame + bleeding edge and a ton of minions becomes useful) but to answer the Johan question, because

1) Johan hits like a metric ton of bricks under the right circumstances, and when he gets that chance I want Imbued Energies on him for an extra attack, a move before flurry, or extra distance to charge.

2) Johan is also pretty squishy. Not TOO squishy, but he is. He's not really a central point to rally around, as he can be picked off by a dedicated assault fairly simply. He's kindof there to support a bit, then have one or two incredibly damaging activations, and then die to drop a scheme marker. Not to say he always dies, but I'd rather he kill 2 enemies and die than sit around healing metal gamin.

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  • 2 weeks later...

Apologies if this is not the appropriate thread.

I am thinking of going for this as a first 50ss kaeris list

Kaeris

Blinding flame 1ss

Arcane reservoir 2ss

Howard Langston 12ss

Powered by Flame 2ss

Steam arachnid swarm 8ss

Gunsmith 7ss

Gunsmith 7ss

Fire gamin 4ss

Fire gamin 4ss

Mobile toolkit 3ss

So any thoughts?

Only other models available at the moment are:

Steam arachnid swarm

Fire Gamin

Electrical creation

Since I dont have many good ways to achieve burning on myself, I felt I could not go down a healing role on kaeris, everything bar the gunsmiths potentially giving out burning, and the gunsmith getting positives from it, I am hoping the damage will be ok. Mobile toolkit hopefully will help Langston survive a bit more. My main concern is then amount of cards I may need which is why I went with Arcane Reservoir.

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Remember that a fixed list is unlikely to be a good idea (unless you're going to a fixed-list tournament of some kind) - you're better off making a list once you've seen the strategy and schemes for the game. Even if you've got a very limited model pool (as I'm guessing from your other models available), the choice of upgrades will change your crew's playstyle quite a bit.

 

Taking Grab & Drop on Kaeris will give you a considerable boost in missions where a lot of scheme markers need to be placed. If the scenario pushes you more towards killing, I'd suggest taking Seize the Day - being more likely to win initiative than your opponent will let you be more aggressive with Howard. Other than that, it looks like you'll be able to do most things fairly well with what you have.

 

Out of interest, how is it that you have Howard Langston and the Steam Arachnids (great name for a band) but not Joss? Joss is universally good and fits well in any crew, in my experience - he'd be worth tracking down.

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Out of interest, how is it that you have Howard Langston and the Steam Arachnids (great name for a band) but not Joss? Joss is universally good and fits well in any crew, in my experience - he'd be worth tracking down.

M1E crew box?

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Remember that a fixed list is unlikely to be a good idea (unless you're going to a fixed-list tournament of some kind) - you're better off making a list once you've seen the strategy and schemes for the game. Even if you've got a very limited model pool (as I'm guessing from your other models available), the choice of upgrades will change your crew's playstyle quite a bit.

 

 

I will keep this firmly in mind, I am just starting out with the game so while I am aware of the switch your crew depending on mission, I thought with my current limited resources I would just stick with whats above more or less, but you point out quite clearly that a lot of difference can come down to a few tweaks.

 

 

Out of interest, how is it that you have Howard Langston and the Steam Arachnids (great name for a band) but not Joss? Joss is universally good and fits well in any crew, in my experience - he'd be worth tracking down.

 

I bought Ramos box set, Kaeris box set, Electrical creation, and Mechanical Toolkit a few years back when I wanted to get into Malifaux, however the local scene died off massively before the models had fnally been shipped to me :). Unfortunately being the older kits they lacked the henchmen, the Ramos box set being outright worse than the new one by not having Joss, and Kaeris box set trading 2 gunsmiths for the Firestarter and Eternal Flame.

 

Next purchase will be a Ramos kit for the Steam Arachnids I need and Joss. Though I will have to wait a while to save up.

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That should work for a fair few strats to begin with. Purifying fire gives healing plus pyre markers to block line of sight. I like to start with a flare to give both gunsmiths fast plus a point of regen at the end of the turn. I love imbued energies on howard.

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Played my first game at 50ss with the list above though I swapped blinding light for sieze the day. Went horribly, not necessarily due to the list, just being an awful tactician due to being new (I hope) and had some bad luck along the way.

 

My opponent played Pandora with roughly the following (id give a more exact list but with the crew creator down I cant really)

Pandora

Candy

Baby Kade

3 woes

Poltergeist

Teddy

 

We got Reckoning as the strategy and a choice of the following as schemes

A line in the Sand

Bodyguard

Assassinate

Make them Suffer

Frame for Murder

 

i picked A line in the sand and Framed for murder on Howard.

 

I won initiative turn 2, and the all important turn 3 (but he cheated fate with a 11 beating me), he won iniatiive turn 1 , 3, 4, 5 this was even with me have sieze the day.

 

Turn 3 was vital since it was teddy vs Langston both on low wounds, he won beating an 11 by cheating fate with a ss, and with 4 cards I could beat it

 

We both came ever so close to killing 2 models multiple turns, I black jokeredon turn 2 to prevent myself he got unlucky on damage turn 3 after killing langston

 

Turn and 4 and 5 he got 2 kills or more, Kaeris and a gunsmith turn 4, turn 5 Gunsmith, 2 fire gamin who were both on 1 wound.

 

Game ended turn 5

He won 4-2

 

He got 2 points for reckoning, I got 0.

I got 2 for framed for murder

 

I think he miscalculated his vps since looking back He took make them suffer, which earned him 1, and either assassinate or bodyguard either of which would of earned him 2 points. So he should of got 5 rather than 4.

 

I laid down 4 sheme markers so we thought it was a 4-4 draw, but I completely failed to place them on the centre line since I am an idiot who did not have enough sleep.

 

I had the Steam arachnid left on 5 ish wounds he had Pandora, Candy, Teddy, a Sorrow, baby kade.

 

On turn 2 I thought I was doing ok I had lost Howard, but I was doing some good shooting with the rest of the army at almost max range, then the true neverborn came out, and where I thought I was at a safe distance I was immediately not with sorrows jumping in with their abilities, and pandora moving like grease lightning with her pushes. I was losing a lot of willpower duels and my armour was negated by the nature of the wounds being low but very numerous apart from teddy.

 

My attacks were generally negated by being halved by sorrows ability and putting wounds on pandora to keep them alive. Once Kaeris was down it just became so difficult. She lost so many wound in only a couple of turns due to being close to pandora and woes, and having immolate used against her for max damage.

 

Captain hindsight wise I needed to keep my force together more so I could focus down targets, and instead of charging Teddy I need to utilise nimble and get away and charge something else yes I felt agrieved not to have gotten the iniative in that important turn but I should not of put myself in that position. I was worried he would be able to charge me due to a combo of the pull from candy or baby kade (I forget which) so I ended up charging him in rather unsupported, after he had died my expected follow up of Fire Gamin into gunsmith didnt work due to the wp check paralysing the gamin.

 

I also need to learn when and what to use soulstones for, my opponent seemed to use them in all the right places and I just didnt have a cle when to use them.

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With kaeris I tend to use them for cards and damage prevention she doesn't really need them for anything else. Willie is really good vs sorrows as he can walk and put down blast markers resisted by defence and the damage isn't reduced by incorporeal as it isn't a sh or ml attack.

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  • 1 month later...

so guys , can you share useful lists, and upgrades. 

I have kaeris right now, as far as i understand. without gunsmith crew is lacking dmg output. 

if kaeris focuses then she can deal fair amount of dmg depending on your cheat deck. 

what else to buy? (only have Burning Relevations and its hardly 30ss)

planning on getting Ironsides to switch and add models to each other (mainly for oxfordians) 

what about, rail golem, metal gamin, mech rider, joss, willie, or anyother suggestion? 

 

thanks 

 

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You're correct in terms of damage output. The key thing to add to a Kaeris crew box is what I'd call a 'combat core'.  To this end Joss & Howard make good initial picks. The Rail Golem also makes a good, but much less reliable, beater.

The Mech Rider is great, and you'll want one at some point. That said it doesn't add what you need at this stage, you already have enough objective running potential in the crew box for the moment.

Metal Gamin are also good to pick up at some stage but I'd prioritise your combat from there.  Don't overlook Molemen either they make great objective runners.

 

 

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  • 3 weeks later...

Hi

I am new to Malifaux and decided to pick up Kaeris and like what I see, plan to use the tactics in this thread a lot.
Please could anyone advise me on these 3.

1) A problem I am having is escaping from ML heavy hitters with a range of 2 or 3 (Nekima and Lilith with the 3" upgrade are my biggest problems). Am I correct that Drag and Drop can't help me with this, due to ending within 2"? Would Blinding Flame be the tactic to use when I need to escape from such things? Or am I missing something else?

2) Could anyone suggest improvements for my generic list. For models I have the box sets for Kaeris, Rasputina, Ramos, also metal gamin and Hannah. The people I play wont mind one or two proxy models. I will be mostly playing against Neverborn, Gremlins and arcanists.
Current list:
Kaeris [imbued protection, grab and drop, arcane reservoir]

Howard Langston [Bleeding edge tech]

Firestarter [powered by flame]

Eternal Flame (for healing)

Metal Gamin x2

Fire Gamin x2

Union Miner (proxy model, mainly to set burning on Howard)

3) my next buy is the Mechanical Rider, but where should I go from there?

Thanks for the help.

Pete

Edited by Pete Zero
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1. Blinding flame will definitely help with escaping melee!

2. Does kaeris need imbued protection? I tend to only use it if assasinate is on the table but even then with her mobility and defensive abilities it seems like overkill(or whatever the opposite of that is.).

I like imbued energies on howard rather than the ability to heal gamin.

If you swap imbued protection for blinding flame on kaeris the the union miner and one of the gamin could be replaced by joss who will put out much more reliable damage and tank a lot of damage!.

3. December acolytes. A bit of ranged threat never goes amiss. Willie is useful then johan and maybe a cerberus give you some healing/condition removal or straight up killing power.

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