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  1. I have been reading the rules for shadows and line of sight several times and there is one thing I don't quite understand. Page 54 (18 in the PDF) in the rulebook says: "When drawing sight lines from one model to another, if either model is in the Shadow of terrain with Height equal to or greater than the Size of that model (even partially), any sight lines that pass through the terrain generating that Shadow are blocked (even if the terrain is being ignored du to its Height, as per the Line of Sight and Size rules on pg. 53)." So, let's say we have a Changeling (Size 1) standing in the Shadow of a Height 1 Blocking terrain and a Peacekeeper (Size 3) is looking at the Changeling. All lines of sight pass through the blocking terrain. Following the quote above, the Peacekeeper would according to my interpretation not be able to see the Changeling since the Changeling is in the Shadow of terrain with Height equal to its Size. That means that any sight line passing through the terrain is blocked even though the Peacekeeper ignores the terrain. A change from M2E, but still quite clear. But then I read the example on page 55. It says: "The Guard patrol is entirely within the terrain's Shadow and the terrain's Height is greater than the Size of both Parker (Size 2) and the Guard Patrol (Size 2), so any sight lines that pass through the terrain are blocked." and "The Guild Hound is entirely within the terrain’s Shadow, and the terrain’s Height is greater than the Size of both Parker and the Guild Hound (Size 1), so any sight lines that pass through the terrain are blocked." (my underlining). In this case it doesn't talk about either of the models in the Shadow, but rather both of the models. And if the requirement was for the Height to be greater than the Size of both models, the Peacekeeper would be able to see the Changeling. So which is correct? Is it enough that the Height of the terrain is equal to or greater than either model in the Shadow or does it have to be equal to or greater than both models? I assume that the rules on page 54 (either) is correct and that the example is just poorly worded. (It is correct that the Height is greater than the Size of both models, even though that is completely irrellevant in that case.)
  2. Discussion came up at a tournament whether models can block LoS to markers specifically when a 40mm Ht:2 model stood on top a corpse marker to block Reva from drawing LoS. I was in favor that it does block LoS until someone laid out a good argument against. FAQ #45 often gets quoted to support that a <30mm models can block LoS to 30mm markers however, I now believe this FAQ was only discussing base size mechanics and not addressing Ht: mechanics at all. According to the Elevation mechanics on PG:43 of the big, if the intervening models has a Ht: lower than the attacker, then the blocking model is ignored for LoS quality. This means that in Reva's case only Ht:3 models can block corpse markers while on top of the marker. Is this correct? what do you think?
  3. had a great interaction that had me scratching my head.... so i asked the local rules people, and it got some more heads scratching they said post it here, hope for an official response... so here it is.... Question: terrifying says if u end a walk within engagement range take a horror test, does not mention los.... so do u need los? Reason I'm Asking: according to faq / errata: Q: If two models are engaged, and one of them wishes to take a Walk Action which will result in it no longer being in LoS of the model it is engaged with (without actually leaving the engagement range) will this provoke a disengaging strike? A: No. Disengaging strikes only occur if the model intends to leave the engagement range. Although the models will no longer be engaged once their LoS to each other is broken, no disengaging strike occurs unless the model is also leaving the engagement range. so you can walk out of los to break engagement as long as you stay in engagement range.... so if you break los while staying in engagement range of a terrifying model, you are no longer engaged, but you should have to take a terrifying duel because you are still in engagement range..... right? Here Is What Happened: firestarter (has flying 5" move) is on the ground, in a square building with a roof, teddy blocking the doorway, engaged.... hungering darkness behind teddy with los on firestarter also engaged.... firestarter with 1 wound, wants to leave without disengaging strikes, or taking a terrifying test, so flies (ignoring models and terrain) past teddy and huggy, out of the building, up and over a 5" wall, and lands inside a building on a step so it is still within his move range because vertical movement was only 1", top down view movement was 4", he is now outside of los of everyone, but did not break engagement range, so no disengaging strikes.... terrifying says if u end a walk within engagement range take a horror test, does not mention los.... well the firestarter ended the walk still within engagement range, but with no los, as required by the faq/errata.... so take a terrifying?
  4. Model A make shooting attack in model D. Model A can draw LoS to model D beside cover. Does model D have a cover from this attack?
  5. So, a few things came up: Hoffman's Field Mechanic Upgrade (Update hardware): You get 1 of each modification card but it seems I can cast "Hydraulics" on 10 different models if I want to? As long as they don't have a Modification Upgrade I have an unlimited supply of each? Which would make sense since there is no mention of getting them back when the model dies etc. When Hoffman (or others) PLACE a marker in base contact, do I need LoS to that marker or is LoS only required once I TARGET that marker for something? (I'm thinking of his 0-action Shakedown "place a scrap marker in base contact with target construct". Can he place it out of sight on the opposite side of a peacekeeper? Mr Graves (and others) that push into base contact: If they can't reach base contact by a straight line, do they push as close as they can or simply not at all?
  6. In our club we've just ran our first tournament and had some LoS issues. after discussion (actually, after tournament) we've found that rules said nothing in regards "from which point terrain height should be measured when drawing LoS". Looks like rules assumed measuring height of terrain on start of the game. And nothing in rules said about "relative" height of different terrain piece (except case when 2 models standing on terrain of equal height, but this rule looks bizzare too) For our local meta we've decided to measure terrain height from point where lower model is standing. Here is why: 1) It's a popular case from forums: By RAW - G1 and G2 cannot see each other. But if we measure terrain height from point where lower model is standing we are fixing these two Gamins 2) Another popular case: By RAW - G1 and G2 doesn't see each other again. Since "If the acting model and the target model are both on vantage point terrain with the same Height, LoS is drawn normally." And normally - Ht2 terrain blocking LoS between Ht1 and Ht1 models. But, if we are measuring terrain Height from point where Lower model is standing - there is actually no terrain between these 2 models 3) Not popular, but possible situation. Blue square on this image is a "river", on bottom of which models can stand, 2" deep: By RAW - in Malifaux there are no such deep rivers. Ht cannot be "below 0". And there are 2 possible conclusions, both of them are actually bad/contr-intuitive: 1) Ignore such terrain feature either by banning tables with rivers/holes/etc. on it, or let models stand on top of this terrain (put something inside of this "hole", make a "bridges"), or not allow model to be pushed/moved inside. 2) Measure terrain from bottom of this "river", effectively making all terrain around river Vantage Points, 2ht (which is... bizzare, no one can shoot) If we are measuring terrain height from point where lower terain stands - this river have Ht0. Which is perfect. 4) It's a new scenario, that I haven't found anywhere on forums/faq/etc. By RAW Rasputina can't see Snowstorm (and vice versa), because all LoS from base to base are passing through Blocking terrain. (Snowstorm is HT3 model, so they can always ignore terrain lower than HT3, and when measuring LoS for Vantage point - it's equal or lower, but HT4 is higher, hence HT4 terrain cannot be ignored) But if we measure terrain Height from point where SnowStorm standing - elevation of Rasputina became Ht2 - and Ht2 will be ignored (it will be Hard Cover anyway) So, basically there are two questions: 1) Is my RAW is correct, and by RAW all heights are broken if both acting model and target stand on Vantage Point / Elevation 2) Is our "home rule" actually a homerule, and if yes - does it make sense to you?
  7. Hey Gang, Just wondering how this should be correctly played with Reva's Strength of the Fallen. It Reads: When performing an Attack, if this model is not Engaged, this model may draw LoS and measure range for Ca Attacks from Corpse Markers within 18" and LoS. This Ability is ignored when determining Engagement. So the question is, and the way I presume it is meant to be played, is you essentially play it as the corpse marker is a Ht3, 30mm Reva that is attacking, would that be correct? As a height 0 model wouldn't be able to do or see shit, would that be correct? Cheers, Nick
  8. General rules about aura/pulse say: "A model cannot be affected by an aura or pulse that emanates from a location out of LOS". But I noticed that there are some situations where some auras seems not responding to los rules. Let's make two examples: 1- Mei Feng's "Vent Steam": "Until the beginning of this model's next Activation, all Sh and Ca Attack Actions taken against models within a4 suffer [-]". Now, usually, auras and pulses affect models within range. But Vent Steam don't say models within 4" get a condition/ability/other. So models inside the Vent Steam aura are nit affected from the ability. Models affected are those that are trying to target someone inside the aura, and usually they will be outside the aura itself. So, by raw, are the targetting models that should have los to point of origin, that'sis different from how I always seen play it around. The fact that attacking models needs to see Mei Feng to get the malus make very simple to avoid suffering the effect making this ability almost completely unuseful. This is in my opinion clearly against the intended effect... 2- Anna Lovelace's "Gravity Well": "Enemy models may not end placement effects within a8 unless that effect was generated by a bury effect, summon effect, or a model in this Crew." I think the clear intent of this ability is to block all place effects within 8". Particularly against masters like Lilith. Simple. But how it works about los? If you consider the los of the placed model after the placing, the ability doesn't work. In fact, it's enough to make a place just behind a model with HT2 or higher to avoid the effect. Not counting the fact that seems very unfriendly to consider the los from that point since the placed model is not there until the place is done, but the effect should prevent the place effect... If you consider the los of the placing model before the place took effect, the ability doesn't work again. In fact, it's very easy to screen the los with some trick (another model, an illusory forest, etc). Overmore, also in this case, the aura should affect a model outside the aura itself, that is not how the rules are written. So, the best way to play it seems simply ignoring los. But the rules are written in a way that don't consider a situation without los evaluation.... IMVVHO, it's wrong the basic general rule about los in all pulses/auras. It would be enough to specify for each single aura/pulse if you need los or not. Another rule that creates confusion is the specification that a model of 30mm base can block los between two same based models. And the further specification that is teorically possible but is very difficult to do in pratical means only more debate and uncertainty. It would be much better if the rule would be "a model cannot screen another model with same base size"... But now the point is, how is legal to play Anna Lovelace in tournament?
  9. Hello, First Question: does a Rat King need LoS to a Scheme Marker target it with Gnaw? If not, he would be able to teleport through walls to it, right? Gnaw: Target a Scheme Marker within 5". Place this model into base contact with the Marker and then discard it. This Action may not be taken while this model is engaged. Second Question Viktoria of Ashes targets Hamelin that she sees with Dragon's Bite. Vanessa is near enough for the ability to resolve for her, but cannot draw Line of Sight to Hamelin, because he is behind a Wall. Does the ability resolve for Vanessa, so she is placed next to him for an attack? Dragon's Bite: Target an enemy model. Place all friendly Sisters within 6” of the target into base contact with the target. Each Sister placed in this way may make an immediate (1) Ml Action against the target which receives + to the damage flip. I didn't find any rules clarifying the situations, so if someone could point me to the book entries, I'd appreciate it!
  10. Does model B get cover from lossblocking terrain if it is located more then 1 inch from losblocking part of the terrain but within 1 inch of that terrain.
  11. Had a situation tonight which confused me and an opponent regarding a Bayou Gremlin's Whoops, Ricochet trigger going off. I read that models can see in any direction at any time. The Gremlin in question was within LOS to 3 friendly models, depending on how you say he was facing. Obviously he's shooting a particular direction - is that what you use to determine what model is in LOS for the Whoops, Ricochet? Or are any of the three models fair game? (Two were beside him, one a little above, one a little below, with Somer quite far above him, call it North, but still within range.) For purposes of our intro game I thought the most logical course was for Somer to be the friendly target, as he was in the direction I'd been trying ot get the Gremlin to fire. But I wanted to see how it is supposed to actually play out for future reference. Thanks in advance for any help!
  12. Hello all, Could not find this (but I am sure it is out there somewhere so sorry in advance). If I have a Ht 2 model standing on a Ht 1 box, can I see over the Ht 2 wall? I will not spoil the opinions with what was decided in our tournament. Thanks, Steven
  13. Hi folks, I've been trying to find anything in the rulebook, but have had no luck so I hope you can help... 1) If I'm attempting to shoot an enemy model which is hiding behind another enemy model which completely blocks the base with equal or larger height, am I right in believing this closer model blocks the LOS? 2) If a LOS can be drawn on the base belong to the hiding model being targetted, does it benefit from any soft/hard cover from the fact that part of the base is covered by the other model, or if it's a height 2 model hiding behind one that is height 1? Many thanks for your help!
  14. Ok, I understand that a height 2 model will emitt a height 2 aura. My question is if an enemy model is standing on ht 2 terrain, is it still affected? LOS can be made.
  15. Hey gang, The more I play Malifaux, the more I enjoy the game. In part, because the rule set is so clearly defined and well written. Which leads me to the following question which came up in a game last night. A Death Marshal was adjacent to a short Ht 1 wall, firing over it at some Wicked Dolls five or six inches away. Do the dolls technically get cover because of the wall is between the bases of the marshal and the dolls? Does cover not apply because he's Ht 2 and within 2 inches of the wall (did I make that rule up? I can't seem to find it.) Thanks for yall's help in advance, and my apologies if things are spelled out somewhere and I just couldn't find it! James.
  16. I hope some of this will make sense...M2E Follow up question using the LOS on page 41, IF the level 3 boxes were not there could Rasputina draw LOS nephelem even though Lilith is in the way? what if Rasputina was 3 " back and the distance between her and Lilith was 7" because Lilith is further away than 3" would Rasputina be able to draw LOS to Lilith but give her cover? Here's what happened. A fiercorp tanner (ht 2) was sitting on a hill that was 2" high (ht 2 to me but I digress) shooting along the down slope so he was 4" from the actual edge. Target model (ht 2) was under the overhang of a building (think of it as a porch) with no elevation (ground floor), about 18-20" away. About 6" in front of the target model, on the same level as the target model, was a prisoner model (ht 2) directly between the attacker and the target. Does the attacker have LOS to the target model who is on a lower level? See page 41 Thanks, Gryffen88
  17. I know you cant charge through blocking terrain, so if you don't need line of sight to charge, you charge in a straight line, round the block, to a point within reach of the target. But what about range attacks? Can you attack a target behind a blocking building with a SH or CA attack, if you don't require LOS?
  18. Is line of sight required for auras, and bursts? In my 101 rules book, the description of Aura, makes no reference to line of sight, then gives an example aura with no reference to it either, but then says this example would need it. Looking on the web, I found if something says 'target' an item, like a marker, you would need line of sight to it, but if it just has to be in range then you don't. Is the example wrong, or is the default, you need line of sight unless something says you don't? It cam up in a game, when I trying to use 'Powered by flame' across a small hut, that blocked LOS to the damaged enemy.
  19. Some more basic rules questions, so I can understand how to play correctly. If a height 2” figure is standing on the ground, next to a height 3” flat walkway, that has a scheme marker on it, on the edge nearest it. What is the distance from the figure to the marker? Is it : 0” as from above they are adjacent. 1” as the Head of the figure is 1” below the side of the marker. 3” the base of the figure is 3” below the marker. Also can the figure see the marker, as the walkway is in the way? If the figure was hight 3” could it then see any marker on the walkway? Will the marker be, out of sight to all onlookers, not taller then its position, if its any distance in from the edge, since it is, in a vantage point with a zero hight? This has come up in a few games, where I have placed markers on top of a 2” flat building. I have had Ramos trying to spot markers to summon with, and in another fight Colette trying to work out, where she see can stand and still be withing 1” of the marker. Both times we have looked at the rules about 'vantage points' and have become unclear how a height zero marker works, for this. John D.
  20. Hi, a friend and I, have got some crews together, read the rules, played some games and searched the web to answer things. But I still have some rules, I am uncertain about. Can a figure target it self, as a 'friendly figure' within range? (Disappearing act, for example). Do I need Line of sight to, a target marker to use it? (Summoning needs LOS to the new figure, but how do Vantage points work with markers as they have no height.) If you can ignore LOS, and Cover, can you shoot through all terrain even blocking ones like buildings? Can a figure stop on a wall its climbing? And then continue on is next activation, or must it start from the ground each time. Sorry if I am just missing where these details are explained, but I did not want to start playing the game wrong, and so get into bad habits. John D.
  21. The Vulture has this Tactical action (1) Eyes and Ears: (Ca:4 / TN:12 / Rg:12): Until start of this model´s next Activation, target friendly Master may use this model to draw LoS and range for any Ca Actions it takes The upgrade Manical Laugh reads: (0) Muwahahaha (Ca 6 / TN: 13 / Rg: 8 ): Summon one mindless Zombie into base contact with each Corpse Marker in range, then discard all Corpse Markers in range. Mindless Zombies may not count as Corpse Markers for this Action If Vulture has managed to cast Eyes and Ears, and if Nicodem then cast Muwahahaha. 1. Do the count as LoS? 2. Can I make Mindless Zomies arround both the Vulture and Nicodem at the same time? I guess Manical laughter also can get confusing here, but that is an not a
  22. Does Ramos need LOS to a scrap counter to use the 'Summon the Swarm' tactical action? The spell doesn't explicitly say to target a scrap marker but states to summon the spiders within 2" of the target scrap marker. This came up when Lilith dropped a forrest between Ramos and a scrap marker denying LOS to it. I assume others have encountered this with other masters able to drop blocking/dense terrain markers. We played it that he could do it for the pupose of a balanced game, but is this technically correct? I would think he couldn't use the scrap marker because he can't target it without LOS.
  23. Cover is a subsection of the LoS rules on page 41 and say "A model will gain the benefits of cover from a Projectile Attack when any LoS line between the Attacking model and the target model...". Some talents modifies LoS, does this mean that Cover is modified in the same way, since Cover uses "LoS lines"? Examples: Hans vs Steam Cloud. Hans | Googles - "This model may ignore any , , or Markers which affect LoS." Howard Langston | Steam Cloud - "... 4 around this model is considered Ht 5 soft cover terrain for the purpose of drawing LoS." Would you determine Cover from Raspy or the Frozen Heart model? Rasputina | Ice Mirror - "...this model may draw LoS and range from a friendly model with Frozen Heart..."
  24. Hey all, Just a little confused on this one... Seamus has "Back Alley" 1) No enemy model can draw LOS 2) "Place Seamus anywhere within 10" that is also within 1" of any blocking terrain" The "blocking terrain" has me confused, does that refer to LOS again, or does that simply mean it could be something (crates, forest,) that would provide hard or soft cover? Also it says "within 1"" - would that mean that I COULD place him so that he could get a shot off with his pistol? (ie: at the corner of a building say). Thanks
  25. Hello everyone! I have some questions regarding Line of Sight (LOS) and Height... For now, I'm eliminating any talk regarding elevated terrain. This is all based on a flat gaming table. I have a model who is height 1" (Model A) I have a terrain piece (say a cobblestone wall), that is also 1" high. I have a model B, that is also 1" height. 1) If the wall is in between Model A and B, so that a LOS from their bases can not be drawn, then neither model can see one another - regardless of how close or far away from the wall they are? Next... same scenario as above, but now the second model C, is a HT 2" model. 2) Can a Ht 2" model see OVER a Ht 1" terrain piece, so that they can still see a HT 1" model? 2a) Does proximity to the 1" high wall matter at all? ie: only if the Ht 1 model is within 1" of the wall, then LOS can NOT be drawn... but if he's farther away from the wall, then he CAN be seen by a taller model? 2b) Does proximity to the wall matter at all for the Attacker? ie: if the HT 2" model is right up against the wall, can he still see a Ht 1" directly on the other side of the wall? Next... Now, we have two models that are each HT 2" and yet still a 1" wall between them. 3) Each model can draw LOS (in spite of the bases being blocked) so each model has LOS to one another... BUT in order to claim (Hard or Soft) Cover... the target would have to be within 1" of the wall? I may have more follow-up questions depending on the answers Thanks!
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