MagicGis

So.... We do realise we are not nerfing the real issue here or? I can see the argument behind nerfing nicodems summoning, since wave 2 I said a modell with such a wide pool limits design space and will get broken if a mistake is made.... now the mistake is obviously Kentaus which are by the way also massively broken with several other resser masters, and make others unnecessary they should get hammerd, and some changes to his summon pool should be done, or his mechanic, but not the master made unplayable. Charmwarders now autokill his summons.... just saying. Issues like that can arise with allrounder masters... sandeep did need his impossible to wound nerf his cast or give it a gun icon. Now the thing is this two just were holding back outcasts. Vics have issues... if a onetrick dmg master cna be soloed in a tournament it has issues... the issue is called webster btw, she also breaks several outcast master. However at least they can be dealed with, but with those nerfs without one for plague pits going side by side with it, we now life in Hamelin country... don´t get me started on how terribly executed the storm nerf was on misaki, which allows this spam small shit allrounder summoners to shine even more, and lets her have two useless limited upgrades.... and let me tell you, to be useless in a faction where it can be changed it for basically free by a terracotta, an upgrade needs to really really suck hard... looking at you too disguised...

Wanted to say Yamaziko and lengthly explain why than read you had toshiro... no contest toshiro do not forget to have some high cost minions and a low river healer with him

I dont understand the S&S hate it was a relevant part of my gameplan in several games in 2016. Most noteably with Misaki Jorogumos and when occupy was in the pool. I collected masks with rush etc . Jorogumo are tanky enough to still fight and tank in that time. Tannen tends to fit in this kind of crew anyway also a solid hidden agwnda carrier if you wanna try oiran. Than one turn firat activations suddenly the joro go puff... misaki dives whereever she wants. Joro pops out ... usually was a great scheme ^^

You have Bete... Bete is the answer. If she has activated and Welcome up. Wait till you feel the opp is low on high cards Summon something there for her. If she charges and kills it. Pop Bete if you have that paralyze trigger. Make her sit there a round taking it without countercharges.

Sorry for being ignorant... but what makes the misdirection/ terracotta combo better with a samurai than any other model or for example an illuminated...?

@Kadeton I indeed would like to add my opinion. I saw quite a few topics and FB posts on Yasunori being way over the top... looking at the book I just could not see it. So when I now finally got the minature from the Black friday sale I tried him out... small test size since the stuff arrived just a bit ago. However for me the result is pretty obvious. He is on paar with other similar expensive Beaters. I think Nekima is not the best comparisson the right one would be Howard in my mind. To me this are similar costed beater models with different uses. Yasunori is designed to melt groups of weakers models (minions, stuff without arm etc.) While Howard is a Hench master Killer. They are both specialized for that. MI7 is the stat you want to kill a big fatty, + flips native are good on a lot of attacks to keep the hand drain lower. Both have Support actions to get them to do their thing, howard with nimble and venting, Yasunori with Great Sage. Howard has the Master killing dmg track and instagib trigger while Yasunori kann reliably dish out a lot of attacks with less efforts. Both have access to similar powerful upgrades Recalled vs Imbued. Looking at their stat lines we can see they are both excellent in their role, this is how you should handle them, and how they need to be used. For example I had my first game and charged Yasunori into a bunch of Minions with Asami, it felt like the Wrath of God raining down. Feeling invincible the secound game I got tempted to Charge a Rail Golem, both of them failed to kill each other with Yasunori taking the worse beating. He does not kill everything, however he is very good at doing what he is designed for. Really strong but not OP. I actually think it is a well designed top end Beater. I think this is also true for Howard. Now why are so many people so damn angry. I think it is obvious. They have to plan for it. By now everybody accepts, if you play into Arcanist you have a plan to handle Howard or you give up Quick Murder, if you play into Neverborne you have a plan for Nekima or you give up Hunting Party. You play into outcast, you don´t pick a crew getting oneshot by Blood needing to bunch up in 2" radius... Playing against thunders there never was a beater with dmg output you had to consider when playing against them. So people are pissed because they need to rethink the way they build lists against thunders. A model of this point cost needs to have an focused approach and not cover all corners. Otherwise you end up like Archie a Gimmick in one Masters list because the Ice Cream on your Model looks dope. If howard with Machine puppet and debt or Min Dmg 5 is not op, than Yasunori with fast isn´t either. Comparing him against Archie is also wrong he should be compared against the most competitive similar model that is accepted as very good but acceptable for the health of the game... that is for me Howard, and Yasunori fullfills a different roll similarily well. I think he is exactly in the right spot.

How about depends on the Schemes ofcourse but I imagine 3 Ronin, double austringer, Reporter, press with ss open for some to sound quite funny. Especially against our armoured friends. I actually think ronin are quite underrated in outcasts, and with 6SS they are a solid choice, with the boardcontrol Nellie offers, and their inability to be charged they actually perform suprisingly good. Maybe fill the rest with an anti rang/casting element merc if playing against arcanist, or maybe Anna?

If you wanna play around with Burning I would go to Mei. She has easy Access to some of the Support and Profits herself with positive Flips. She also likes scrap and minions and can work well with toshiro. I could post a list that I used a bit ago but that would derail the Topic... ^^ In General I think Obsidian Oni in many cases are better hires than summons. If they die from flicker they do not explode, and I want some high Cards for triggers on attacks etc. the 10+ Region seems solid for that, with 13th and if you have tannen 11+ per turn turning into Jorogumo. I experimented with Chisaki and the totem out as well as smoke grenandes (instead hidden on Hannah for emissary pushes and fast) for another low river + tannen. It was a bit one dimensional, and requires a set up activation, but allows to turn this low moderates into Yokai. I think it Plays quite different though. So if you are happy with your core I would not recommend this Change. The 7 activations to start I think is not a big deal for asami. If you really want you can always spam out a few yokai early in the turn. If it is an issue to be outactivated she can usually avoid being outactivated against most normal Crews, and can allow them to go first on t1. Some Gremlins Hamelin Kirai sure not but most of the time one model would not make a big difference here. I find the Emissary provides several important Options: - The few left over low Cards are seldomly used better than for Focus 2 which can provide one very significant attack - Fast + push on Hannah and Anna are very significant. - Blast on Focus attacks is also really worth the mention if your master also Hands out Focus 2... to giant Spiders for example... - The possibility of 2 times Dest ability and the additional reg, makes the totem higher value too. - HTK in a Crew with several heal Options - Another big base to hide Asami behind I like this Setup because it provides some redundancy to the Support Options. Also it makes the totem a more valuable target. If you want to shut down the heal you have to Kill Chisaki and The Low River or the upgrade carrier. If you want to shut down the Card Quality you need to go through Hannah and Anna, if you want the Utility down you need Anna the totem and the Emissary dead. It also leaves you with 4 solid but not insane damage dealers in the Group besides summons, which also makes it hard to pick a target. The models are also all good enough on their own to not completely fall appart when Asami falls (though it should be avoided modelcount and so on). For non blasters you can ball up quite a bit and it is not so easy to go in and survive. This is also where Strands shines I believe. The Thing is, like many Upgrades it is hard to judge. If your Opponent knows what it does, you will seldomly see him Charge in to do one attack unless he needs the movement. So it is hard to judge if it was worth it in a game... after all unless he tells you, you will never know exactly how much your Opponent felt he needed to Play around it. I feel against meele centric groups that allow me to ball up it gives them one more thing to think about. Also the tigger seems situationally useful. I feel it is often worth the 1ss though I believe thats true for equality too.

The first List on the page is nearly what I Play with at the Moment. The only changes are: - Grasping Strands on Asami instead of Equality. I like equality but the Crew tends to bubble up the first few turns and shoot out Oni. Anna blocks a lot of stuff, tempting People to Charge in where Strands just provides another layer of stuff they need to consider. Also I feel the heal is less needed in this Setup though the other Options are nice too. - Upgrades on Hannah and Chisaki switched (feels saver that way for me) - Emissary instead of 2 Yokai. I feel the emissary makes the death ball much more of a threat. Fast min dmg 3 Beaters are way more scary, as are Focus 2 attacks. Sure she has no upgrade but the Standard one helps her summons, and allows to later cycle. Or you can place Equality or smoke grenades here. Thanks to the totem he also should be dealt with or maybe Pop his dest Zero twice a game. Also giving Blasts to Focus dmg tracks with Anna, Hannah and a master that can hand out Focus 2 seems rather solid. In Theory her summons also can use every condition option he has. Sure pushes you down to 7 models but... well..

Dude no jokes about people not being familiar with the fine details of your heavily outdated measurement system... metric won the war... accept it.

Listen Gremlin swamp shitters.... the thunders are ready to hear your crys... after moonshine negotiations of the finest Level we offer the following Business deal. This week your Little green fingers click the thunders button, next week ... if we win and only if... our most pleased hordes will let the pendelum swing in your direction.

So my guess on rider = resser was right, than outcast should be the gunslinger I guess makes me hope the twirly hair Person is a thunders oni master ^^

Female Jorogumo will be Special release sold only at conventions in europe. US-Players can´t take the Titties ^^ I expect it to clock in at 45 € a Piece.... I would still buy it ^^... female Oni master not beard Sinkh guy... pls our faction needs some more female masters and some Oni support ^^

So that Looks like Turban and Bear on our Thunders Master... which sucks... while I am ok with more Sinkh and it makes sense we saw the pic of the minion already I guess... I was hoping for an Oni Master in best case female summoner, our faction Needs some more Ladys, and some oni Support, and we lack a real summoner master. However the theme seems to be Sinkh... fingernails etc ... while Oni go in the Japanese direction. Meh.... Change it now Wyrd! Also People vote thunders please ^^ granted Resser is maybe interesting because also unclear.. However gun guy, flying gremlin and the Reporter are already clear so stop voting for factions we already know whats coming help us People which have to struggle with your votes...

I currently play around with this jack list to which she is pretty central: Jack+withering+twist+all curses Ama Jaakuna Lust +Creeping The Hanged The Guilty The Drowned 4ss I also try two variants of this one with effigy for soft cover aura and 2ss usually one oathkeeper 1 in pool or Lady L with a smiliar SS improvement. So far really fun to play in general.

I will never understand why people keep suggesting models that are not released or ehole crewboxes to usexq single model to people thatvclearly say they want to start one master and a not optimized but playable startingpool... While it is somewhat ok for people that expand and may have some of the stuff... it is the way to go to turn down potential new players in the hobby by making the startinvestment look higher or making it look like proxys are needed to keep up... So Yan Lo: Yan lo box The Armor Toshiro Komainu Yin In that order are a solid start since you mentioned you play Mei i would put Toshi and Komainu on top of the list. Both packs support Mei really really well and flesh out your options with both crews. For the same reason I would recommend Shadow Effigy after you have the stuff above. This are also all relatively inexpensive boxes. Railworkers can do descently with Yan but at some point you should look for some ranged support. Which of the tt options you use here is mainly up to taste. Most people will advise snipers for good reason. Personally recently I like having a trapper in this slot in both Mei and Yan lo lists. While unfortunately the traps are no constructs...they have their uses. With the models listed both crews tend... besides Mei herself... to be on the slow end of thunders. Thats also part of why the typical good but expensive if you lack the crewbox speed options get suggested here. The trapper box can provide mid range support with blasts as well as an option to slow down the enemy aaproach or the time they need to take a map position for the strategy without a too big investment. However purely for the range aspect other cheap packs can be better.

Hey I would like to ask where did you get this nice base fitting slow+activated markers?

My current theme list is Mei Feng +Misdirection+Vapormancy+Seismic Claw Railworker Railworker Metal Gamin Komainu Johan Willie Railgolem 6SS Unfortunately Metal Gamin were killed instead of Rider so there is nearly never a reason to play them in theme. Here Johan provides at least an alivlbi to play them over effigy. I dont know why people dislike Willie... he can ignore cover and LoS hand out more me burning... brings blasts and a high wp def against charges. He is also very reasonable priced at 6 stones and the model is just too good. A solid range support. Johan also usually brings a lot of useful stuff to Mei and fits her Theme. If I want to go out of theme first thing I add is Effigy. After that usually Toshiro goes in. He summons Komainu which you want as theme models anyway. He also makes Komainu on the board even better. He can summon out of corpse and scrap and when a Railworker dies you decide what is more iseful. I also tend to play mei Minion heavy to have more Railwalk options around the board... I really dislike walking with her. Toshiro really loves minion heavy lists too.

Why dont you just use the Misaki smoke package yourself if you think it handels shooting that well... Misaki can hire 4 last blossom and smoke and shadows is a split faction upgrade. You can bring Yamaziko to not even have to give it to misaki. 3 models with smoke should be enough. Add in an Hodge Effigy etc... and you fight one thing that hives you trouble with the other learning the weaknesses of Misaki at the same time

I think this overall looks more balanced. I also appreciate a hit to summoners especially those that are now more often forced to get the heal in their crew to present less easy targets. This is a great way to handle mech rider btw... makes me question even more why htk on the gamin was removed though if you already know this is in the pipeline. However I think it benefits Mei and Marcus a bit which is good, and forces ranged masters up the board a bit which makes them easier to handle for newer players. Overall I think loses and wins balance for arcanists but promote a more diverse master pool. Thats a good thing...

Komainu are the solution... great for both masters toshiro would also make both lists for me. Next purchase would be shadow effigy also great for both

Beware my 13 point merc protecting my 15 stones 2+blot archers from your insignificant peon ""

The fith is the one you always made with the upgrade.

I would not take the lady in all lists. I would only consider it with creeping. However some models get screwed pretty hard by that aura. I find it worthwhile with a certain number of crossroad seven where you play a good number of denail already. Or with a good number of models which def is based around horror/manipulativè Charging a hanged gets so much more scary if you cant cheat... obviously useless at range which makes lists like that much more vunerable at distance... but jeah i consider dropping her or effigy for stones and an upgrade

I currently try this: Jack:+3×Injustice +Twist+Torment Lady L Guilty Effigy Lust Envy Jakauna +creeping Amo na Zako 3ss A bit light on stones I thought about dropping Lady for stones to use Amos triggers to her full potential on the other hand effigy is not soo bad at creating some.... Did not find the right stone balance yet... However the amount of board control is absurd and I dont feel I lack damage... if anything tankyness against perdita shooting and a lot of blasts... so basically lists that need to get my zone control right in their face to feel it even a little... and shoot you to clumps on the way in... besides that test results are promising so far.