yool1981

The Order Initiate card only includes CHIMERA and is Arcanist. My guess is that he loses the BEAST keyword altogether.

Actually, there kind of is. They said each Master can hire based on their keyword and their faction, if it was just things from their faction that'd be kind of pointless to add in the thing about keyword. I'm confident that anything we consider "thematic" to the master (like the NVB Lynch models) will be hireable by him even though he won't be NVB anymore, or what would be the point of keeping them NVB at all? Or playing Marcus in his new NVB role, most of his Beasts (including Myranda) are Arcanists, so would he just lose all access to them in NVB? I seriously doubt it. This is what I presuppose also but actually Wyrd has not said it would work crossfaction. The Keyword is introduced to keep thematic crews as non-thematic models will be hired at higher cost. But I think like you that it will be cross-faction, it just has not been confirmed yet. Additionally, I doubt that Marcus, Levi and even Zoraida will keep the same keywords/hiring pools as they are wide and hard to balance imho. The purpose of this edition is likely also to free design space. Finally about Lynch, what is the point of keeping Illuminated, depleted or beckoners in NB unless they have a rework in their rules (which, granted, is still possible)? They are Brilliance oriented currently. They could be transferred to 10T.

It's a bit more than curiosity though, it's more about planning painting & purchasing. Personally I won't purchase anything Wyrd until I know more about what I will actually be able to play in M3E. For example, I'd be keen on getting Hoffman for my Arcanists but there is no statement that KEYWORDS will work cross-faction (although I suppose they will). Additionally, there is no guarantee that his keyword will simply be "construct" (it would make sense for Wyrd to limit hiring pools to keep design space for later and avoid the Nico or Levi syndrome). So all those Guild constructs in his starter set may not be useful at all. Same thing for NB, I won't purchase Hinamatsu as I don't know with who she will work. I will also avoid painting Tannen until I am sure he is hirable in NB. Bultungins seem a safe bet though. I just bought Cyclops but I don't think I would have done so had I known about Euripides 2 months ago because of the high risk of finding them in the crewbox.

Temporary + Beta + Usual reserves (might be modified...) = instead of a gamble it becomes a calculated risk. It also helps people know where Wyrd goes which is reassuring. Additionally, if they are about to start the Beta testing, it means there has been an Alpha testing so I would be extremely surprised if the keyword list moved significantly. Personally, I trust they will do a great job with the rules. They always do imho. Granted, for the hard core competitors it may not be the case but the game is still vastly better balanced than most of the other miniature games I had the opportunity to play. On the faction shuffling and purchase invalidation part (it is the first time it happens), I am not so sure though, same thing with crewbox composition (bad previous experience).

There may be a reshuffling of the keyword attribution. From the fluff blurb it is not sure if Lucius will keep the GUARDSMAN keyword for example (especially since Dashel is a master now).

New Crewboxes contents are not known either. I really hope there is no Cyclop in Euripides' crewbox or I'll be very disappointed. If M2E -> M3E is the same as M1E -> M2E, then if you buy crewboxes for M2E, you might end up having to buy new ones in a few months because one key henchman or totem will only be available in this box. For example, Nekima, Mature, Young Nephilims & Tots + a brand new and useful totem (only available in the crewbox of course)... Honestly, the simplest thing to ease these worries is that Wyrd publishes: A temporary list (pre-beta) of Keywords/Masters association, A temporary list of faction/keyword/model association A confirmation / infirmation that keyword hiring can spread cross-faction [EDITED]A reassurance that we will not get "coerced" into buying limited added value crewboxes.

It's not panic. It's just that I wouldn't plan any purchase nor assemble / paint any of these models prior to the M3E release. It is interesting to have the list of how much of our collection is currently with a question mark or plain shelved (in the case of mercs). I think this explains why many NB players are a bit reserved regarding this new edition. Gremlins in comparison have their whole collection valid barring perhaps some of the Zoraida hiring pool. Ressers have Nico, his totem and mayhaps Mortimer (3 models) + Tara and the void theme + perhaps Yan Lo & Seamus depending on how the keyword go. Arcanists have Ramos & his Totem (perhaps Joss but he was not in as much trouble as Barbaros in the fluff so he may be OK) +be some Marcus beasts depending on how the keyword thing goes. Outcast will likely be hitten as well. They already lost Misaki and if Levi loses his huge hiring pool, there will be a lot shelved models.

For information, below the list of the models in the former NB hiring pool that risk being put on shelves or do not seem advisable to purchase at the moment unless you want to dabble into other factions. LYNCH Old Key Word – DARKENED · Jakob Lynch · Hungering Darkness · Gwyneth Maddox · Mr Graves · Mr Tannen · Illuminated · Stitched Together · Beckoner · Depleted LILITH Close to Lilith in Game or Fluff · Lilith · Cherub · Barbaros COLLODI Old Key Word – PUPPET · Collodi · Vasilisa · Hinamatsu · Hodgepodge Effigy · Bunraku · Marionnettes · Mysterious Effigy · Stitched Together · Wicked Dolls · Lucky Effigy · Brutal Effigy · Arcane Effigy · Coryphee · Shadow Effigy · Carrion Effigy · Mannequin LUCIUS Old Key Word - GUARDSMAN · Captain Dashel · Master Queeg · Guild Sergeant · Guild Austringer · Guild Guard · Guild Hound · Guild Investigator · Guild Pathfinder + Traps · Guild Rifleman · Mounted Guard · Warden Old Key Word – MIMIC · Mr Graves · Mr Tannen · Beckoner · Guild Lawyer · Terracotta Warrior · Ferdinand Vogel & Beast Within PANDORA Old Key Word – WOE · Journalists ZORAIDA Old Key Word – SWAMPFIEND · McTavish · The First Mate · Bayou Gator · Wild Boar Old Key Word – WP <=4 (Most Common hires) · Nurse · Papa Loco MOST COMMON MERCENARIES · Anna Lovelace · Aionus · Hans · Johan · Lazarus · Sue · Freikorps Trapper

I completely understand the perspective as a Neverborn player. In fact, I don't know who is going to want to buy Hinamatsu now since we don't know if anyone is going to be synergizing with Puppets (And I would be really sad to not be able to use Coryphee and Mannequin in Neverborn anymore). If you take into account the lost master and their closed ones, the out of faction hiring pool of Lynch, Lucius, Zoraida, Pandora and Collodi that are in question (they may not stay the same) as well as the loss of mercs, that’s a lot of models on the shelf or out of question for purchase.

Yep, same here. Nothing compares to the joy of putting a fully painted crew on the table. Some people display their minis on shelves, I don't. I paint because I like it but the idea of playing with the minis I paint is what guides me.

I am in the enthousiastic camp regarding the new edition, mainly because I support a game evolving with its fluff and the streamlining of the rules. However, I would like to stress out the following points. 1. A mini is not just a mini and price tag. It is time spent on assembling it, basing it and painting it. For example, as a Neverborn & Arcanist player, I lost 3 painted / assembled masters (Ramos, Lilith, Collodi). As a fan of themes, I suddenly don't know what to do with my little puppets (no master seems to be in theme anymore and out of faction puppets will likely not be available anymore). Additionally, Lynch being 10T now means that my carefully painted NB coloured Lynch crew is out of place, even if I wanted to dabble into 10T (which I don't want to, 2 factions is enough). Finally, all the mercs I based & painted in specific NB & Arcanists themes are completely shelved. I spend 10-20mn/mini to assemble and I spend 4-10h for painting. If I do the math, I lost a big investment in time and efforts (not talking about money...). 2. In terms of fluff, I am still annoyed at seeing how much NB got boned compared to other factions, especially Gremlins and 10T. I loved Lilith's fluff, Collodi & Lynch's themes. Now we have Nekima who has the charisma of an oyster in the stories (zero depth of personally), a frost giant for which I could not care less and Marcus who has not taken an active part of the fluff since... ever (and I already own him in Arcanists so 0 benefit here). The way the Arcanist lost Ramos was not very coherent in Broken Promises and getting Hoffman does not realy rejoice me as I find him very transparent in the stories.

Aren’t the Neverborn the big losers in this edition? 3 masters lost is huge !

Count me in the excited camp. I have one worry and I d be glad of Wyrd could alleviate it. From M1E to M2E, the crew boxes changed very little with only one or two new models that could not be found in separate dedicated boxes. This resulted in a « compulsory » purchase of a whole crew box. Could you please kindly confirm you are doing something more customer friendly this time ?

You have a point obviously, Gremlins have always been a bit goofy. I have a feeling though, to better illustrate my point, that we are moving from Batman's Joker/Penguin creepy (Gremlins in M1E) towards Jar Jar Binks goofy which is really not my cup of tea. If it was limited to Gremlins I would not mind much but, from the last Monday previews, I am afraid that this is moving towards other factions and Malifaux in general. This is disappointing to me, especially since TOS' art seems to be keeping the original Malifaux feeling (at least the one I perceived). Is it still the case though? It seems that we are moving out of this in the latest fluff and the latest artwork. The latest Gremlin fluff is not grimdark at all imho, it is plain goofy.

Is goofyness a thing now? I went into Malifaux for the cowboys fighting against steampunk robots, mages and horrors while trying to keep their sanity. This nightmare crew and the arts we have seen in the recent monday previouses tend to remove this horror effect, as did the "Broken Promises" fluff which was interesting but tending more towards the poorest scenarios of the worst X-Men (Guild is no longer an oppressive facist government but a group of colleagues meeting at the coffee machine and bitch about their respective hairs, Outcast meet up to create their super lair, the TT fluff looks like a HK movie of the 80s...)... I'm a sad panda.

When will the changes be effective in the app?

Really nice ! The concept is very original and the art is innovative. Now let them be WOEs !

Exactly.

Yes we are far afield. Maybe there is also a cultural bias. I'm French. For most of the French the Victorian era is just a time period of British dominance in international affairs marked by strong technological progress and industrialization sometimes leading to modern forms of poverty & slavery (let's say it's a combination of Verne & Dickens to be simplistic). The peace is never emphasized and almost nobody uses the term Pax Britannica. But let's stop it at that to avoid the long off topic pollution of the topic. I'm not a fan of a goofy Orang-outang by the way :p. Not my meaning. Border wars were a thing also. Especially against organized empires such as the Parthans (which were as "civilized" as the Romans, not mere tribes). Civil Wars were extremely frequent as changes in Emperors were usually justified by military might. However, you are right that there is a strong illusion of peace behind the Pax Romana that has been conveyed throughout the Western world. If you wish to continue this interesting discussion, you can PM me.

Maybe there is a misunderstanding. I think the Malifaux setting is a worldwide setting. Hence my analysis of the Victorian era being bloody as usual in worldwide terms. Now if you want to speak about Britain, there was no war on the British soil (as often) but while the British Empire expanded, it shed blood around the world (as did all the imperialist countries of the time). So, the Wikipedia qualification of "The period is characterised[sic] as one of relative peace among the Great Powers (as established by the Congress of Vienna), increased economic activity, "refined sensibilities" and national self-confidence for Great Britain." is overly simplistic imho. It is the same as defining the 1950-1970 era as peaceful, even relatively (many historians do and that is what we learn at school in France for example, even though we had a shameful civil war and knew violent decolonization wars). There were terrible wars during this time, just not on the European and North American soils. It is the same as "Pax Romana", it is a figure of speech and a warped history construct because we often want to see Ancient Rome as an ideal. Border wars & civil wars were extremely common all throughout the history of the Roman Empire.

From Wikipedia: In the history of the United Kingdom, the Victorian era was the period of Queen Victoria's reign, from 20 June 1837 until her death on 22 January 1901. This time period was absolutely not marked by peace, even relative. From the top of my mind: _ War was waged in Europe (for example, France and Germany had a war that ended at the doors of Paris). _ The USA fought against Mexico and knew a violent civil war that still echoes nowadays. The natives had a very difficult time also. _ China knew the Opium wars and the Boxer rebellion. _ Countries were colonized in Africa and Asia. _ There was famine and rebelion in India. One may argue that there has never been a peaceful era in the history of mankind but that's another topic.

I can't wait to grab this book !

Sorry for not being clear. Of course it is perfectly fine in terms of gameplay. However, if the Bayou Bash model is supposed to go on a 30mm, it means that its size is defined in order to be smaller than if it was to be on 50mm. So the war pig proxy will be much smaller than the official one and not on scale compared to the other models in your Malifaux crew. I was merely pointing out that, although the Bayou Bash models seem gorgeous and fun, they may not be that good looking as Malfaux proxies. Did I misunderstand anything?

Yes sure they stack but the proprotions of wa rpig fitting on a 30mm are not the same the ones needed for 50mm base war pig.

Hello everybody, I have noticed that the 30mm morgue base inserts (metal) were no longer sold in many webstores. They are however written as temporarily out of stock on Wyrd's webstore. Has there been any annoucement as to what the metal inserts will become with the arrival of the new plastic bases from Wyrdscape? Is there any plan to complete the plastic collection with other themes such as those presented by the metal inserts? I have a side project with a Ressers' "Arkham Asylum" and I need would morgue/hospital bases to complete it. Thx for the replies & BR