Philosfr

I wasn't sure, but thinking about burning makes me think that you would NOT lose any conditions that were on you already

That's because of scoring schemes and such. If a Frame for Murder target dies from burning, it doesn't count as the enemy killing them, so the condition wasn't "owned" by the enemy. Based on that, I would say you're only immune to enemy models applying conditions, not immune to conditions themselves.

So I'd say D) Burning +4, because the conditions were on the target before it was in the aura

1 hour ago, Erik1978 said:

Ah okay, thanks. makes sense though it seems weird they didn't specify on a stand alone upgrade.

I would also think it was max Flicker +3 but the wording made me unsure.

Well for being summoned + eating the scrap at least, with the new upgrade Asami could give it more I suppose.

The suit thing says: "it may lower the value of its Flicker Condition by 1 to add a suit of its choice to final duel total."

Yeah, now that I reread that, I think I was in error earlier. The sentence is singular, and would lean towards only being able to do it once. 

5 minutes ago, Erik1978 said:

3) Why do you assume it DOES decrease like Flicker on summoned models, and that she can be sacrificed by going through it too fast? Wouldn't they mention that on the card if that was the case? I mean: They write the full condition effect multiple times on other cards to make sure people know it's the same one but nothing about decreasing or sacrificing is mentioned here.

As Adran mentioned, named things are never different between models. Flicker is the same for everyone, and Flicker decreases. There are many many cases of this, where the ability name is used without the full text.

You're going to have to ask the TO for the event

1) Correct, as you are no longer in range of Wrath of the Oni when you try to take the Charge action

2) I've always played it as Flicker +3 is max as stated, though I have no rules basis for this

3) Flicker always decreases at the end of the turn, and there is no limitation on how much flicker you can use to lower the action. The upgrade is still crazy good, but you have to be careful and give her flicker through other means, or not burn all your Flicker so she goes poof at the end of a turn

In my last game, Titania attacked a target with Bloody Command, declared the Into Thorns trigger and discarded 2 scheme markers (before flipping damage, discard up to 2 friendly scheme markers within 2" and LoS of the target to deal +1 damage for each Marker discarded), but then flipped the Black Joker. Does the total attack deal 0 or 2 damage?

Black Jokers "always deal no damage". Does that mean they can't deal damage regardless? Or does it count as 0?

I would assume the attack did 0 damage total, except that I've successfully attacked people when flipping the Black Joker. On an attack flip, it just counts as 0, but I can still add my Ml to it, and hit low defense targets. So does this work the same? The black joker does 0 damage, but because the trigger isn't "after damaging", it would do +2 damage because the scheme markers are already discarded?

Seems like a simple question, but I wanted to ask anyway after it game up in a game

Mysterious Emissary with the Primeval Conflux upgrade uses "The Seasons of Change" on Titania, giving her the Armor +1 Condition until the end of the turn. Titania herself already has Royal Indignation. She's attacked by a minion that would normally do 3 damage.

• Does she take 1, because the Royal Indignation would come into play first, then she takes 1 because armor can't reduce it to 0?
• Or does she take 0, because the Armor would reduce it to 2, and then Royal Indignation would reduce it to 0 because it can?

The rationale would be useful. Is it a matter of an attackers activation deciding what order simultaneous things happen, or the models owner, or what?

I've tried it, but agree with the 'third scheme' comment. It takes too much work to get much value out of it. I find it is much more successful to hire in different things and skip the grow.

That said, back blood shaman and nekima are important ones. I also say Barbaros. Good attack is designed to feed things to grow

Love the Rasputina sculpt!

I've also been trying Summoning Pandora lately. The biggest issue I've run into is lack of killing ability if Pandora dies. Sorrows are still as fragile as a porcelain tea cup dropped from the empire states building, so counting on them to do Misery damage after Pandora's demise has failed. I've always been a fan of paralyzing with Pandora and then letting the rest of my crew do scheming and killing, and I think I need to make Summoning Pandora crews a little similar.

One thing to keep in mind is enemy conditions count! Play against someone giving out Fast, Defensive, Focus, and you don't need to apply that many conditions yourself. Especially since the opponent won't want to end Fast on their model because you summon a Sorrow off from it, so you can use it multiple times. 

I've had good luck with the crew, but I have spent too many resources on the conditions, which haven't been the concern.

5 hours ago, santaclaws01 said:

That's because you take Tannen for things that don't involve his AP. Both his Anti-cheat and anti-interact aura cause your opponent to spend additional resources to do what they want to do. Or you take him for easier summons on dreamer.

Yep. And if you can't think of what to do with him, have him drop a scheme marker, even if you don't need them to throw off the opponent. Or move into position and go defensive to make him harder for the enemy to remove.

I wouldn't say Tannen is "terrible". His Cooler aura is pretty phenomenal in the right situation, such as a very interact heavy pool that also focuses most of the action on a single area or too. He's not going to be much help in combat, but he can force opponents to deal with him before they can get interacts done.

20 minutes ago, MrDeathTrout said:

Please see "Who Flips" I quoted earlier in this thread.

I'm not sure where you're going with that. It explicitly lists Obey as something that changes the controller.

If I understand what you're arguing for, you're saying that I can Obey your model to charge, but then you get to decide what to do about the attacks? That would be pointless then, why would I ever Obey a charge? Considering Zoraida just got an upgrade specifically allowing to Obey a Charge, it takes some odd mental gymnastics to say that the ability is more beneficial to the opponent.

Or what do you think the results would be if interpreted your way?

15 minutes ago, MrDeathTrout said:

I agree that any action you control can do anything that is valid for that action (like us abilities, declare triggers, etc).  But there is strong precedent that something Applied to an action only affects that action, not any resulting actions.  E.g. Focus used on a Charge does not benefit the resulting attacks.  Both Obey and Focus affect a single action.  Why does Obey affect the resulting actions and Focus does not?

Obey controls an action (the entire action)

Focus gives a positive flip to a duel when declaring an action. You don't flip any cards when you declare a charge, so you aren't really using the Focus on the charge. You're using the Focus on the first declared attack generated by the charge.

26 minutes ago, Ludvig said:

Haha, I respect Wyrd's decision to go big, it is a mythical elephant snake after all!

Unfortunately the price and transportation implications kind of make it hard for me to justify getting the official model. 

Having just painted it... it's sort of hard to decide how to paint it too. The range of textures and skin features left me baffled!

1 minute ago, MrDeathTrout said:

 

 

The controller of the model does not change.  The Obeying models controller controls the action, but not the model.  See quote below.

While the Charge action is not resolved until after all resulting attacks are resolved it does not follow that anything that applies to the charge action applies to the resulting actions.  For example Focus applies to a single action (just like Obey) and if used on a Charge action it does not apply to the resulting actions. 

 

Also why would a triggered attack operate any differently?  The Charge action would not be resolved until after the Triggered attack was resolved/

 

Rather than risking mangling my answer again, from the rules:

Actions Causing Actions
Some Actions will force or allow a model to take another Action. If an
Action calls for another Action to be taken (such as Charge or “Make A
New Entry”) then the additional Action or Actions do not cost any AP.
The original Action is not considered resolved until the new Actions are also
resolved.
 

6 minutes ago, Myyrä said:

This answer is basically self-contradictory. Either the actions aren't resolved until all the actions they generated have also been resolved or they are. (Rulebook has a very clear answer for this, which you also seem to be familiar with.)

 

Sorry. I mangled the second half of my answer, you're 100% correct. 

Black Blood is only 1 damage in most cases. Hitting your own model will likely do more than this, so it's a net loss. Yeah, it's a nice consolation prize if you inadvertently hit your own, but I certainly wouldn't make it part of my tactics.

The Obey'd action isn't complete when you move as part of the charge, it's not complete until the two ML attacks are also resolved. The Obeyed model would still be under control of the Obey for these attacks during that time.

Brutal, Arcane and Hodgepodge are definitely the best three for most uses, though I often will limit to just the first two.

Coryphee aren't bad, but remember they can't dance together in Neverborn, so no Duet. Definitely limits their usefulness.

Bunraku are interesting. I've had bad luck when testing them (Misaki killed both before they did anything but walk last game), but on paper they are solid.

Stitched Together are pretty amazing.

New Wave 5 puppet henchmen will be good, but she's not released yet (even at GenCon, so it'll likely be a while)

Yeah, the debuff is really his best option, but it's not very reliable. Some games it will be decisive, other games he'll feel like a flop. It's like playing Gremlins relying on luck rather than a reliable ability

17 minutes ago, Ludvig said:

Yeah, I actually have her old metal set but good suggestion! Maybe I shpuld have specified that I have her set and McTavish as well as plastic waldgeists.

 

Maybe it could be that spidery thing that buries itself? It looks like some sort of shadow-being with a little imagination.

Bandersnatch? Paint it in blues and blacks and purples with glowing red eyes?

Grootslang, they are camouflaged hunters that live underground?

Do you already have Bad Juju? It looks like the old metal Bad Juju, and since he hangs out with Zoraida, I think that was intentional

Hooded Rider is definitely one that could use a little love. Never see him except in the Four Horseman lists. I want to use him, but just isn't worth the points on the table.

I think the Doppleganger is good, but not OP. Lots of games go by where she's barely worth her points, but then she makes a huge splash by borrowing Nekima's sword for three big swings or something and everyone remembers that. I see a lot of competitive NB players leave her home.

Ace in the Hole is often played incorrectly. The Ace only returns to your hands if it is played on "another friendly activation". As Myyra said, discarding them to avoid decapitation and they are discarded for good. Flip it on initiative and it doesn't go back to your hand. Use it on defense for a suit trigger, it doesn't go back to your hand.