Pere Ravage Question

[darcoza]

I see a lot of people on here talk about slingshotting Pere forward with Ophelia or using the pigapult, then having him cast oopsie, then shooting him with Rami to get a kabloey. So I was wondering if the following sequence of actions is somehow not allowed cuz as far as I can tell Pere is perfectly capable of killing himself and still getting kablooey off.

1) Get Pere into position either by Ophelia or Pigapult.

2) Activate Pere and (take 1 damage) use Reckless.

3) Use an action that doesn't cause him damage (move, fire stick strike, etc.)

4) Cast Oopsie (take 5 damage)

5) Make a Breath fire strike on whichever enemy you don't like the most (take 1 damage due to careless).

6) That was your last wound which wasn't caused by Oopsie so it activates Kablooey.

I keep looking at it for some mistake since it seems everyone uses Rami to activate Kablooey but I can't find it.

Am I missing something?

[rgarbonzo]

Can't use the breathe fire strike after reckless because it causes 1 wd. Since it is a fixed number a model cannot kill itself in that way.

[darcoza]

Why can't he kill himself with breath fire? Can't Pere cast Oopsie twice and die that way? I don't see any difference between those two situations. Is there something I missed in the main rulebook?

[Tokaji]

A model can never purposefully kill itself.

Pg 44 in the little rulebook, under Damage: "A model cannot use a talent or cast a spell that requires it to inflict wounds on itself if it would reduce its own wounds to 0."

[darcoza]

Ah I see I guess I'm just confused by the wording on Oopsie it says "This model cannot make a Resist Duel to prevent this damage. "KA-BLOOEY!" does not activate if this model is killed by this Spell." implying that Pere can kill himself with Oopsie he just doesn't explode twice. Is it just worded funny?

[Tokaji]

It does not imply that he can kill himself. If Oopsie would kill him, he can't cast it. It is just worded funny. It's just a weird little safety mechanism to keep him from blowing up twice.

[darcoza]

Ok thanks for the help. I was really hoping that would work

[rgarbonzo]

Actually he can cast Oopsie twice since it does damage and not wounds thats why it's worded that KA-BLOOEY doesn't trigger if you double cast Oopsie.

You can also cheat the ram if you can or give it to him from Ophelia to triple the damage but sac him as well

Edited April 23, 2013 by rgarbonzo

[Tokaji]

I'm pretty sure that's actually not correct, rgarbonzo, because Damage is converted into Wounds, so it's still doing Wounds to the model.

[Adran]

Casting the spell doesn't kill Pere. The effects of the spell kill him, so he is allowed to cast Kabluey even if it would kill him.

Pg 44 in the little rulebook, under Damage: "A model cannot use a talent or cast a spell that requires it to inflict wounds on itself if it would reduce its own wounds to 0."

The spell doesn't require him to inflict wounds on himself. It does do damage, which will effect him, but that isn't the same. Yes, the damage will later be converted to wounds and kill him, but it didn't require him to inflict wounds on himself. Compare to Self mutilate on the punk zombies.

[mephiston]

So you can never Reckless yourself to death, but if an effect of a spell/ability does enough to damage to kill yourself it's ok?

[rgarbonzo]

So long as its does damage and not wounds, from Ratty in the Papa Loco thread here..

"The important thing to note is this causes Dg not Wds. You can't use an ability that causes Wds if it would kill you, but there is no such proviso for Dg."

Originally Posted by Rules Manual, p44

A model cannot use a Talent or cast a Spell that requires it to inflict Wd on itself if it would reduce its own Wounds to 0.

(1) “Take Ya With Me!”

(CC: 10 /Rst: Df /Rg: p6) Models, including this model,

suffer 6 Dg. This Model cannot make a Resist Duel to

prevent this damage. BOOM! does not activate if this

model is killed by this spell.

(1) Self-Mutilate

(CC: 12/Rst: Df /Rg: 12) Inflict up to 3 Wd on this

model before choosing a target. Target model suffers

1 Wd per wound inflicted on this model. This spell

may be cast once per turn.

Edited April 23, 2013 by rgarbonzo

[Guy in Suit]

Yup, that's how it works. Anything that does Dg is fine. Wounds is a no-no.

I find that a good way to justify this to players I am teaching is that anything that is automatic death prior to the effect taking place can't be done, but if there is a chance of failure you are ok. (In this case you can fail to cast.)

[Bahoola]

Don’t know if this helps, but I have killed Pere once or twice against Pandora throw placing a blast from Burn’n Stick/Breath Fire so it touches Pere and have him killed that way after you used reckless and Oopsie. Well you have 2Wd left after that so Breath that requires a sever damage might be tricky.

(page 46 – small rulebook)

“Any model, other than the initial target, touched by one more:blastsuffers damage one severity lower than what was infected on the target.”